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Scottish by Nigel Eaton played by duo Lenormand - Restoin.
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I have a Bflat F wooden ended by Charles Junior, i have to say it is a superb instrument, i love it.
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Fanny Powers - The South Wind
Wolf Molkentin replied to Wolf Molkentin's topic in Concertina Videos & Music
Hi John, thank you so much for taking the time for your in-depth commenting and advising. Your contrasting ornamentation and harmonisation is new to me but appears to be quite suggestive, all the more with reference to a harpist. I will certainly experiment with the choice of either the one or the other, with possible stages in-between and probably some allowances as well. My true responding will of course have to be an improved recording which I'm eager to prepare and execute as soon as the workload both jobwise and private shall let me do that. Your other points are well made too; I have been inclined to diversify running through a piece many-times but seem to fall back to the enthusiasm of immersing myself in the sweet sounds of the fully-developed version. With the second tune - which I primarily wanted to play and record - I have a "thinner" version included, not just in the treble range but even less spreaded. I really like this interposed reduction of volume and saturation... As to the shortness of grace notes - IMO there's at least one exeption: an ornamentation which we - at least in the playing of Alistair Anderson - often come across in Northumbrian tunes (and maybe Irish as well), in endings like E - C - C there is a trill (Triller in German, I'm not sure about the proper name in any Anglo-Irish-American tradition) on the E, which seems to be waisted if played too rapidly. Re Fanny Power I absolutely agree with you and previous posters. I'm glad over your words about the sound of my Tenor Treble Aeola - in fact I started my recordings with the Excelsior back in 2013 without any equalisation and later on added just a touch of that. The three recordings with the model 24 however seemed to need to be corrected to a higher degree in order not to, well, hurt... But with the Aeola, everything was lovely and perfect. I just added some digital reverb, but the sound was basically the same without. So thank you again, and I will come back to the subjec(s) after some checking out and practising... Best wishes - 🐺 -
Thanks wolf...............I'll check out those suggestions. Anyone else care to chime in?
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Fanny Powers - The South Wind
Anglo-Irishman replied to Wolf Molkentin's topic in Concertina Videos & Music
Wolf, Your concertina certainly has a marvellous timbre. Interesting that you note that you used no equalisation on the recording - I'm always reluctant to judge an instrument by a recording, because what comes out of the speaker is often far removed from what went into the mic. Now to your interpretation of Fanny Power. I agree that the ornamentation is too much, too aggressive, or whatever else has been said. Here are a few thoughts on the matter of ornamentation: Carolan was Irish, and ornamentation is a typical feature of Irish music, so ornamentation is the name of the game, right? Well, wrong, actually! Ornamentation is a typical feature of purely melodic music, vocal and instrumental, and the traditional music of rural areas in Ireland (and Scotland) developed in an environment where one fiddler or one fluter played for dances, and one singer sang - unaccompanied - for entertainment and edification. Playing or singing the bare tune over and over gets boring very quickly - but the harmonic treatment that is possible for the urban musician in his band, orchestra or other ensemble was not available to the country musician of yore. So an important function of ornamentation is to hint at an underlying harmonic structure. As soon as there's a second voice or an accompanying instrument, ornamentation becomes unimportant, except perhaps here and there for special effect. I know that when I sing an Irish ballad unaccompanied, I feel the need to add ornamentation; when I sing it with the band or self-accompanied, I don't. Bear in mind that Carolan was a professional musician and, above all, a harper - so his compositions presume polyphonic capability, with ornamentation only for occasional emphasis. Another point: what is ornamentation, as opposed to harmonisation? For me, ornamentation consists of grace-notes. which are defined as having no time value. They do not alter the rhythmic structure of the basic tune to which they are applied. They are, as I said above, gentle hints at a harmonic structure, and should not obtrude. Their shortness makes them inconspicuous, and it's a good thing to keep them quiet as well. (When I play Carolan on the banjo, I prefer to make grace-notes as hammer-ons and pull-offs, not as plucked notes.) With the concertina, this is not possible, which is why ITM anglo players just give their grace-notes a very brief tap of the button. Your ideas for improving you interpretation are right on. Quite honestly, the linked version, with several iterations of (apparently) exactly the same arrangement, got me bored fairly quickly, I'm afraid. It would certainly be a good idea to start out by stating the basic melody, with only as many ornaments as you really feel you need, played as unobtrusively (short!) as possible. Then introduce a second line, and probably dispense with ornamentation, then play a fully harmonised iteration. Playing two or more iterations of the tune - whether bare melody, ornamented melody or harmonised arrangement - exactly the same way, is never a good idea. From the recording I can tell that both you and your concertina are well capable of this! Cheers, John -
Hi Canary Bird! nice to see a concertina player that lives in the Canary Islands! Where are you based? I live in Santa Cruz de Tenerife, and I play the English system concertina. Fernando
- Yesterday
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That could do it. It would work on me!
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Thanks for the continuing advice. And I am starting to think that it's likely that a lot of the problem is valves, and of course I will check that first. One thing I have noticed since the advice started rolling in is that some of the offending notes have a very audible valve slap sound, which can't be a good thing? If none of this works, I will try playing while standing on my head, to see if the problem is simply hemispheric.
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It's south, we also suffer from the sense the northern hemisphere is somehow the top of the world and that anything that falls can be seen to be slipping downwards towards the south pole. If anyone goes down there to through the giant piles of things that went south I'm looking for a sock, made from possum fur, black with a blue heel. The possum is probably looking for it too.
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Thanks Chris for talking some sense here. It is fine for people to describe how they do things, but proper diagnosis has to be the starting point. Bob Snope at the Button box once said most problems in concertinas can be traced to the valves. Sure there are lots of things that can and do go south ( or is it north for Australia?). But for anything but new instruments, reeds are pretty stable and problems are much more likely to come from the environment the reeds live in. Valves are generally not stable. They curl, get stiff, or lose their elasticity, depending on lots of factors. They should be your starting point, not reed set. Dana
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adding: bar 7 of section A, start with A-min (or, again, F-maj), bar 3 of section B, replace E-min with A-min. Of course, just suggestions, but I was trying to keep things within your concept, as far as I get it. In my own playing Greensleeves F-maj is rather prominent I guess... Best wishes - 🐺
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Having listened to the video once I seem to hear Amin as suggested in the seventh bar...
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Mdarnton: Thanks for your reply. Yes, I do tend to play tense and have to remind myself to bring my shoulders down from my ears from time to time. But now that I think of it, the only real difference last night was that the button accordionist who usually plays next to me (covers me) was away, so I was perhaps feeling a bit exposed. Christine
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I will just comment that a friend wanted to try my concertina the other day and after messing with it for a half hour or so had just the pain you describe. I credited it to the stress of having not settled into a comfort level with the instrument, that he was tightening something he shouldn't have, to hold the instrument in an death grip that wasn't necessary. Anyway, so one thing to ask is whether there was anything different about your seating position that might have thrown you off? An unusually higher stool or something like that?
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Hi Robin, as the A section avoids the sixth entirely you could very well change the key signature to one sharp = A Dorian for the entire tune. I can't listen to your recording or play from the sheet at the moment, but re the harmonies I would at least suggest to have C Maj in the first and fifth bar of section B, maybe adjust some more bars, possibly first half of the seventh bar of the B section to A min or F Maj. Hope that makes sense and I'm not mistaken just reading everything from the screen. Best wishes - 🐺
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Great session last night. I was, as they say in Nova Scotia, givin'er. After one set, a dull pain started in the palm of my left hand, just left of centre. Felt like a pinched nerve or something, I iced it (lucky we were at a bar), took an Advil, and the pain dissipated, but left behind a faint bruise. Today the hand feels mostly fine---the bruise is a bit tender. Weird, hey? Any amateur diagnosticians out there? Christine
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I've recently found this version of Greensleeves, one I Like very much. Could someone have a look at the pdf and tell me if the B part looks right...........ie should I keep the same key sig. throughout and place the # signs as I have. And A minor dorian ? The chords I've indicated are ones I play but any other suggestions welcome. Thanks.................Robin Greensleeves & Polly the Lass Greensleeves.pdf
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setting the reeds for nice attack?
Wolf Molkentin replied to Wolf Molkentin's topic in General Concertina Discussion
Thanks a lot, Chris and Alex, first I have to say that albeit mostly playing with lots of bounce (as anyone who has listened to my playing will be able to confirm) I never experienced a "choking" reed (or anything even near to that), not even with the Excelsior which appears to be a parlour instrument per excellence. The same is true for both instruments I'm playing these days. Reversely, with the TT Aeola I'm for the first time experiencing a certain unevenness of multiple reeds beginning to speak at low pressure, or - as Chris has put it - a lack of control over note starts. Also a slight delay as mentioned is felt, even with moderate pressure, and the quiet sounding at low pressure is a bit breathy, so maybe the phenomena are closer to what Chris has outlined than my inaccurate description suggested. OTOH the extra "cut" is a certain if not stunning "clearness" of the tone, combined with some kind of staccato or rather portato when playing scales rapidly. This is what I really like, an added distinctiveness to my playing resp. sounds - which is so very different from the (very fat and "present", with the risk of involuntarily "slurring" consecutive notes) sound of the model 24 that Alex' suggestion might be on the right track. Amazing...- no real issue at all, all that just puzzles me... Best wishes - 🐺 -
setting the reeds for nice attack?
alex_holden replied to Wolf Molkentin's topic in General Concertina Discussion
My (limited) experience concurs with Chris regarding the effect of different set heights. It can be difficult to know where to set the reeds on a particular instrument if you don't know how hard it is going to be played. If you set it high so you can't make it choke when played very hard, it won't perform as well when played very softly. Speculating a bit - I wonder if the difference between Wolf's two instruments could be to do with the shape of the reed vents? -
setting the reeds for nice attack?
Chris Ghent replied to Wolf Molkentin's topic in General Concertina Discussion
Wolf, I noticed your statement in the other thread and it does not tally with my experience. When the reed set is very high you will get a bit more cut but the effect on the output at low pressure is not quiet playing, it is no noise at all, just a sound of air passing the reed until sufficient pressure is attained so as to start the reed. This sometimes feels like a delay in starting at low pressure. If your reeds will play quietly and you have a bit of cut at volume then it sounds to me as if they are adjusted very well. The equation goes something like this; when the reed set is low the reed starts easily and has a slightly more mellow sound. It is however prone to stalling or choking if the initial bellows pressure is sudden and high. When the reed set is high there will be a little more cut in the tone but the reed will not start well without a lot of pressure and it is difficult to play quietly and have control over note starts. Somewhere in between these two stations lies a way which will suit our individual needs, for example, an Irish dance player might want a little higher set than a person who wanted only to play airs. - Last week
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Excerpt from another thread - think I might make another try under a specific headline: With my new Aeola TT I get the impression that the reeds are in a way set to maximum volume and "cut" (apparently rather high) which causes them to speak rather quiet under low pressure with a "leap" to a much higher volume with the bellows pressed or pulled more boldly. May this be a desired feature as it leads to a very distinct attack with I came to like very much? I just played the instrument again against the „screaming“ model 24, which is indeed much louder but raises its voice continuously from the moderate to the extreme, which is of course nice as well but a different thing (both are ME Wheatstone instruments). Any thoughts? Thanks in advance for the attention! Best wishes - 🐺
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Duet concertinas - why such a large overlap?
ritonmousquetaire replied to ritonmousquetaire's topic in General Concertina Discussion
Thanks to everybody for the very interesting remarks! I do agree that one does not need to bound himself to the original intent of the instrument, yet it is interesting to understand why an instrument was designed in a particular way. I still wish that duet makers would make them with a greater range - but at least now I understand why they are the way they are.
