Anglo transcriptions

[LR71]

Has anyone sat down with a player and wrote out what they played, note by note?  That would be interesting.  The Chris Droney book has a good few of those, have other players gotten the treatment? 

[Leah Velleman]

There's more of these on the English side of the fence. Dan Worrall has done one for William Kimber (the book is out of print but apparently going to be re-released soon). Gary Coover's done ones for John Kirkpatrick and Phil Hamm.

 

There's also House Dance (Dan Worrall again), which is mostly text and not transcriptions, but it does cover a lot of ground: there are a few songs each from England, Ireland, Australia, and South Africa.

 

Edited December 25, 2023 by Leah Velleman
Fixed a line break

[Michael Eskin]

I've done that many times with both Anglo Concertina and box players. Not in real time, but after from slowed-down recordings.

[Doug Barr]

Do it all the time!

 

[LR71]

I'm talking about writing down which buttons were used, not just the notes. 

[Roger Hare]

5 hours ago, LR71 said:

...I'm talking about writing down which buttons were used, not just the notes... (my emphasis)

If that's the case. have a look at this PDF. Posted by Gary Coover in (I think) 2014.

 

There are more button numbering schemes there than you can shake a stick at.

 

The system I use isn't there - because it wasn't developed till ~2015...

Edited December 27, 2023 by Roger Hare

[papawemba]

5 hours ago, LR71 said:

I'm talking about writing down which buttons were used, not just the notes. 

Yes that is not always easy from a recording because you don't always know which key they are playing in...

Ornamentation can give some clues to where they are playing on the concertina. You can also eventually hear the change of bellow direction.

Finding the way to play it is the harder part !! But a lot of fun 🙂 

 

Nicolas

 

[LR71]

papawemba understands what I'm getting at - sitting down with a musician, having them play a tune, noting whether they used, say, pull G on the outer row, push G on the C row, or push G on the D row.  With a recording you can somewhat infer which of those is used from the tone, the grace notes, things like that, I've seen very detailed transcriptions of players of Irish music, often with quite old recordings.  But with none of those instruments (fiddle, pipes, flute) are you so mystified about which of multiple choices they're using for a note like you are with the concertina.

 

With pitch I'm usually confident that I'm hearing an "Eb" or "C" concertina, since when I play along they're sharp or flat.  Unless they're showing off and deliberately playing in F instead of G - or if that's their style, ala Mary MacNamara. 

 

 

[Peter Laban]

13 minutes ago, LR71 said:

Unless they're showing off and deliberately playing in F instead of G - or if that's their style, ala Mary MacNamara. 

 

 

That really isn't 'showing off', it's a matter of pushing different buttons.

 

Anyhow. My son went to Noel Hill weekly for a few years when he was learning aged 12/13. He had dozens of tunes with exactly the information you are looking for, taken down during these lessons. So that sort of thing is in existence but it would not be fair to pass it on or make it otherwise available.

[LR71]

Playing in F on the concertina is much like playing in F on the B/C box, takes a little bit to adjust is all.  People play in different keys all the time, for whatever reason - change of pace, "breathing fresh life" into something done to death, works better in that key - I faithfully work on O'Dowd's in the original key of Gmin, which is a real headache, and for no real reason at all, no one I know plays that tune in the first place...I might as well just put it in Amin.

 

I've read all about Noel's feelings about wanting to safeguard his teaching tools, that's cool, he has a right to make a living.  I just wonder if anyone has any interest in comparing how different people go about playing tunes.

[papawemba]

When I was saying "you don't always know which key they are playing in", I was talking about the concertina 😉

Maybe I should have written in which position they are playing.

What I usually do is to transcribe the tune as played then with abc online tune transposer (https://www.abctransposer.de/), I change the key to see which one is closest (meaning flow like) to the tune I hear. For exemple, some triplet ornamentations flows very well in one key but not the other...it's a match ! then I know they are playing with a C/G or a Bb/F or...Not always easy but fun 🙂

Hope it is clear...

Best 

[LR71]

Yes, I see what you're getting at - G/F#/E is a good one, that's a snap played all on the pull on a C/G, if you heard someone play that but the pitch is F/Eb/D they probably have a Bb/F instrument.  I think...trying to think of a counterexample I started to get dizzy...🤪 

 

I naively assume musicians mostly just pick up these sharp/flat pitched instruments and use their normal fingering for them, for the sound/result/flexibility.  Eb sessions and all that.  If I had a G/D that's what I'd use it for, get a load of the sound out of this Jeffries.

[SIMON GABRIELOW]

I think you will find each player will use their own way of button playing, as goes choice. 

And if you observe someone playing you would certanly see the buttons used, of that individual performer.

[Kathryn Wheeler]

I do this with my own music, certainly 

[Alan Day]

Gary Coover has just released a book of the wonderful playing of John Watcham.

Al

[papawemba]

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Edited December 30, 2023 by papawemba
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