Does Your Concertina Go To Sleep ?

[Geoff Wooff]

I find that one of my Concertinas sounds much better if it is played a lot but never sounds happy if it remains in its box too long.

 

After a hard night (or weekend) of playing, especially at sessions or with the band playing for a Dance, then it positively sings.... and if it is not played for a few days is sulks for an hour or more before coming alive. This is a 115 year old Wheatstone and one might think it had stabilised, grown up and knew how to behave!

 

Now, I know from my day job as an instrument maker, that a new instrument needs to be 'played-in', usually for the best part of a year in the case of my instruments... but does this happen with Concertinas too ?

 

I have recently recieved a new-ish Concertina which does not look as if it has been played much but the sound has improved since it arrived last week, I think because I have played it for a couple of hours each day for five days..

 

What do you think ? Are these things just mechanical boxes that sound as good as they will from the first day of their life or do they improve, sort of 'warm to the task' so to speak ?

[Frank Edgley]

Concertinas definitely improve with the playing.

[Jody Kruskal]

Hi Geoff,

 

I have noticed something like this too. Here is one explanation. The tolerances on concertina reeds are very fine and minute particles can gum up the works. Playing frees the reed up so that it vibrates more easily.

 

You say " the sound has improved since it arrived last week" Do you actually mean the timbre of the sound or rather the whole playing experience, including the reed response?

[Geoff Wooff]

Hi Geoff,

 

I have noticed something like this too. Here is one explanation. The tolerances on concertina reeds are very fine and minute particles can gum up the works. Playing frees the reed up so that it vibrates more easily.

 

You say " the sound has improved since it arrived last week" Do you actually mean the timbre of the sound or rather the whole playing experience, including the reed response?

I think the timbre has improved and perhaps the dynamic range (but that could be me getting used to the way it breaths)... it is as if the woodwork is waking up to the vibrations.??

Edited August 29, 2013 by Geoff Wooff

[Lawrence Reeves]

Geoff, I know that pipes play in, and if I left my set in the case for a week it seemed like the chanter took the longest. With a drone playing one note ( aside from complex overtones) it vibrates at a constant rate. Chanter ( bore) reacts to many vibrations. A concertina like the chanter plays many. I suspect the wood of the reed pan is what really comes to life. I also feel like the player makes a difference. If I play a concertina or a concert flute owned by someone else it sounds a bit different. It becomes an extension of the player.

[Myrtle's cook]

I think there is definitely something in this as I have recognised the same in both concertinas and guitars.

 

I wonder if there is also an element to this of the player's ear (and fingers etc) once again becoming accumstomed to the instrument. I say this because I tend to play a single concertina or guitar for a few weeks at a stretch and then switch to another because I might require a softer tone for a particular ballad I am learning or a guitar that sounds better with a dropped tuning etc. It seems to take a few days for something in my brain to fully recallibrate and become fully satisfied/comfortable with the instrument's sound - and when I go back to the preceding instrument mental re adjustment also seems necessary.

 

I wonder if this, combined with Geoff's observation regarding the more physical manefestations within the instrument, provide [?part of the] explanation?

[Dirge]

I've never noticed the short term effect; I believe the Menuhin quote "If i don't practice for a day I can tell; if I don't practice for 2 days the orchestra can tell, if I miss 3 days the audience can tell" and I suspect that's most of it, just everyone loses a little 'tone' very quickly.

 

I don't think anyone disagrees that long ignored concertinas come to life magically; that's included nearly every duet I've ever had (and is probably nearly every duet full stop). The latest one has even found more volume I feel sure.

 

I talked to a violin dealer at a folk jamboree a couple of years ago and we discussed this; he said fiddles are just the same; they come to life when regularly played. He put no premium on such an instrument but expected it to sell quicker. Not quite sure what the logic behind that was.

[Bruce McCaskey]

I purchased a fifteen year old Dipper in near-new condition a few years ago and it hadn't been played often or recently. When I tested it at the seller's location I was of the opinion that it must have great potential because of the maker, but it played very poorly. Reeds were slow to sound and many were badly muted. After taking it home I was surprised how much difference 45 minutes of playing it made, and after a few weeks time of playing it a few hours a day, eveything seemed perfect without ever having opened it up.

 

Shifting to more on-target comments for this topic, I've noted that some days my most frequently used concertina seems to play very easily and everthing responds and sounds just as I think it should. Then other days, while the instrument plays, the reeds just don't seem to be quite as quick to respond or to sound just as I think they should. I don't know if the difference is measurable, but it's certainly something I think I perceive. The instrument referenced is used almost daily.

 

Then I have one concertina that often goes weeks between use and often seems a little unwilling to get into the spirit of playing when it's then taken in hand. I guess my best description might be that it sounds a little muddy and seems to respond overall a little slower than it should. If I play it for a half-hour or so it seems to improve greatly.

 

This preceived variance has often caused me to wonder what might account for the differences. While I couldn't convincingly argue against someone that says the instruments respond the same way each day and I'm just imagining the variances, my pet theory is that it's related to the valve leathers. I find myself wondering if they aren't the first things to respond to humidy changes and perhaps they stiffen or relax and that affects their flexibility? Then too, if they go long periods without flexing maybe they take on a bit of a "set" and it takes several minutes of flexing for them to limber up?

 

Related to this topic, I certainly acknowledge that every time I pick up a different concertina there's some adjustments that have to be made to play them at my best. Bellows pressure response, spring pressure on the buttons and general reed action all are factors to be adjusted in my approach to playing when switching instruments. I find that t takes me a few times playing a different instrument to really get adjusted to it. I also find it works both directions too, returning then to the prior instrument takes a few times with it to regain my best ability to play it. That said, I still think I percieve the other factors alluded to in the prior paragraphs.

 

I'm not discounting possible changes in the sounding board resonance or other aspects of construction and materials that might affect sound quality and response, just tossing in my speculation that the valve leathers might be a factor.

 

Edited to recover from previously unrecognized "auto-corrections"

Edited August 30, 2013 by Bruce McCaskey

[Dirge]

Valve leathers sounds very plausible to me. Good thought.

[Chris Ghent]

Bruce,

 

I think you are right. If you think of it in terms of the most naturally variable factors from most to least the list would have to go something like;

 

Me (usually how much claret)

Valves

Bellows leather

Cloth,

Cardboard

Softer woods

Harder wood

Glue

Steel

Brass

 

Of these the factors most likely to influence tone are the woods, and to influence response, me and the valves. With the me factor it is not so much that I am physically variable, more my perception is variable. See it as, I need to get tuned in.

 

When you cast your mind creatively into the question it is tempting to come up with an idea such as repeated exposure to regular vibrations causes the neutrons in the wood atoms to point in the same direction and they then vibrate together and harmoniously. I feel world peace coming on.

 

This effect is talked about more in the violin world, probably because there is more money involved.

 

Having played a bunch of instruments from unrelated but joined parts through to putting them in the post I can tell you there is something that happens. When first assembled it is rare for them to be in tune and when they finally are the instrument seems to lift tremendously. This however has to be a cultural factor. In just tuning there is nothing natural about a lot of the frequencies involved, sure 220, 440, 880 on A are related but any real natural order was lost in justification. There is no reason these frequencies should get on and be harmonious. Many reeds are in obvious discord with each other, in fact every reed has two reeds which are a second away.

 

Some time later, by this time the instrument is usually in the owners hands, something else happens. From the experience of those I kept myself I think of it as unification, no longer a bunch of parts, but as to the mechanism I have no idea.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Chris Ghent

[Rod]

Is there significance in that some of you refer to having more than one instrument at your disposal ?

 

For over 34 years I have possessed just my one and only 36 button CG Anglo and throughout that period we have been totally faithful to one another.

 

I have now reached the time of life when I realise that any prolonged periods of physical inactivity on my part are definitely counter productive to my health and well-being and I guess the same applies to my Concertina. I have no substitutes on the bench.

Edited August 30, 2013 by Rod

[Rod]

Having altered the word 'activity' to 'inactivity',as was originally intended, the last paragraph of the above now makes a bit more sense.

[Geoff Wooff]

Having altered the word 'activity' to 'inactivity',as was originally intended, the last paragraph of the above now makes a bit more sense.

Yes that sounds better Rod.

[Wolf Molkentin]

I certainly acknowledge that every time I pick up a different concertina there's some adjustments that have to be made to play them at my best. Bellows pressure response, spring pressure on the buttons and general reed action all are factors to be adjusted in my approach to playing when switching instruments. I find that t takes me a few times playing a different instrument to really get adjusted to it.

 

That's what came to my mind too, and it might temporarily apply to an owner and player of just one concertina (like me) as well. After some days without having taken up the instrument the rather "strong" tone which it had acquired for me over the time of our acquaintance appeared to be lost. But OTOH this kind of confusion comes up scarcer by this time (but might return through switching back and forth among two or even more instruments).

 

I wouldn't deny the physical aspects as mentioned above, of course. But besides, it's not all about hearing but (the micro aspects of) playing as well IMO.

[Bruce McCaskey]

Is there significance in that some of you refer to having more than one instrument at your disposal ?

 

For over 34 years I have possessed just my one and only 36 button CG Anglo and throughout that period we have been totally faithful to one another.

 

No significance in my mind, it only has contextual significance to the topic of how concertinas may be affected by periods of inactivity.

 

Certainly in my case there's no correlation between the number owned and playing ability. I can imagine that some professionals and talented enthusiasts might own multiple instruments in order to be able to offer more diverse sounds to their audience. Perhaps a more piercing, penetrating tone concertina for playing with others in a band or sessions, and a more mellow, less stident toned concertina for solo work, ballads, airs and vocal accompaniment.

 

I know several people that own more than one concertina, although few of them perform in public and fewer still on a professional basis. In most cases they started with a decent "hybrid" accordion reeded model and then later moved up to a better instrument with traditional concertina reeds. Those that aren't hard pressed to recover the investment in their "starter" concertina sometimes elect to hang on to them even though the instruments are subsequentlly rarely used. I think that's primarily motivated by sentimental attachment, but often justified by the explanation that they might need a "backup" if they have to have work done to their "good" concertina.

 

I think I fall into the hopeful hobbist category. I like having alternatives available in tonal ranges (keys) and character of sound, I find it refreshes the sound of familar tunes when I switch concertinas. I should comment at this point that, yes, I am capable of playing in multiple keys on a C/G Anglo concertina, lest someone fell inclined to suggest I've overlooked a basic capability of the Anglo system. There are a few tunes I play in seven keys (primarily for the mental exercise involved), and several I play in two or three keys.

 

Since I started playing about eleven years ago I've had as many as four concertinas at one time, and as few as one. I've had possession of three Dippers, a Wheatstone and multiple hybrids from multiple makers. While I placed orders for most of the hybrids I've owned, I didn't seek out all of these instruments. The Wheatstone and Dippers came to me via intentional sales efforts from their prior owners, and in each case, "out of the blue." As Tom Lawrence commented to me a few years back, "people get to know that you play concertina and they come to you when they want to sell."

.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Bruce McCaskey

[RWL]

This effect is talked about more in the violin world, probably because there is more money involved.

 

 

It has been measured and documented in the violin world. It's been a few years since I read the papers, but it was explored by a retired German physicist / luthier and his son (probably among others). If interested, you may be able to find information on this under the topic of "vibration dedamping". I wouldn't be surprised if something similar occurs in other wooden instruments, but I have no personal experience in that regard with my concertina. I have experienced it with one of my old fiddles, which really woke up after a few days of ineptly vigorous playing.

[Mike Franch]

I've read that a Stradivarius museum has an employee who every day unlocks the cases and plays the violins for a bit. This, and the above fascinating discussion, makes me wonder if museums with extensive collections of concertinas have or should have their instruments played regularly. That would eventually put wear on some of the parts, but if it would help retain the musical qualities of the instrument, which as much as the mechanics is a subject for study.

 

However, my personal theory for the phenomenon noted by Geoff at the beginning of the discussion is that an instrument's feelings are hurt by neglect, and that these ill feelings need to be mollified by the repentant owner lovingly taking the instrument in hand.

Edited September 12, 2013 by Mike Franch

[cboody]

Well, Mike and Geoff might be right about the hurt feelings. But I can testify that I took out my Edeophone Treble Tenor today for the first time in a while (I've a concert coming and am using my other instrument for a variety of reasons). The Edeo was edgy, almost strident, when I started and the sound was a bit weak. After a few tunes the sound was full again, and the quality much improved. It didn't help the Lachenal mechanisms, which tend to be a bit problematic if you don't hit the keys accurately (the Wheatstone is much more forgiving...at least mine is), but playing certainly improved the instrument in many other ways.