Playing In Your Mind

[Robin Madge]

Nope, it doesn't work for me. I just end up wriggling my fingers at random. It's only when I'm holding the concertina that I know where the notes are.

Could be that changing from one concertina to another all the time means that I never get keyed into the exact positions of the buttons.

I should point out that I only know the names of about 4 buttons anyway. I suppose I just work from aural feedback, though in some sessions you get used to relying on the vibration coming back through the finger-tips.

 

Robin Madge

[Alan Day]

I am still interested to know if this only happens for by ear players or is it experianced by music readers?

Al

[geoffwright]

I can imagine "mind-english" players wagging their head from one side to the other as their fingers swap sides.

I am always in trouble for silent concertina (moving the fingers but not the bellows) playing during the TV news.

I am also regularly told off for reading the paper, listening to the news AND playing silent concertina. How's that for multi-tasking?

[David Barnert]

I am still interested to know if this only happens for by ear players or is it experianced by music readers?

There are, of course, many music readers who cannot play without the paper in front of them. I would think such a player would be unable to use the "think system" (as Professor Harold Hill called it in "The Music Man") without looking at the music also.

 

I'm equally comfortable learning tunes by ear and by reading dots. I sometimes find myself working out arrangements (for my duet concertina) in my head, but not often.

 

When I feel the need to play an instrument in the car, I reach for my "road whistle." It's a 3-holed tabor pipe that I keep tucked behind the passenger-side seat. It has an octave and a half range and can be played with one hand. It is meant for playing with the left hand while beating a drum with the right, but in the car I play it with the right hand. Oddly enough, I find that if I've learned a tune with one hand I can then play it with the other without any additional practice. I'm sure that relates to Al's original question, but I'm not sure how (maybe I'm "think" playing with one hand while I'm actually playing with the other?).

 

Edited for typo.

Edited February 27, 2004 by David Barnert

[stuart estell]

I am still interested to know if this only happens for by ear players or is it experianced by music readers?

I find it happens both for instruments that I play largely by ear and instruments that I play largely from music, if that helps.

[Rhomylly]

I play about half by ear and half by dots, and I also play air concertina. Especially when bored at work (almost all the time) or under serious stress (caused by boredom at work, like as not)

[JimLucas]

I am still interested to know if this only happens for by ear players or is it experianced by music readers?

Depends on what you mean, I suppose. I read music pretty well, and I do it. But I can also play by ear.

 

I can imagine reading the notes of imaginary music and playing my imaginary concertina with my imaginary hands as I do so, but I wouldn't want to do it while driving.

[Chris Ghent]

I play in the mind and take great pleasure from it, unfortunately most often tunes come out in fiddle fingering, an instrument I have not played in years, rather than concertina fingering, even if I have learned the tune only on the concertina. This is at least partly explained by my starting to play fiddle when I was 9, and doing it for 20 years.

 

In similar fashion, if I glance at a row of dots they usually occur kinetically to me in fiddle finger patterns ie. when I see an E0 it occurs as a feeling in my left index finger and with a certain set of both wrists and right arm. Although it has already been years, I am still hoping this will change with practise, as it means I could dispense with the rational thought interchange while sight reading and get on with the feeling of it. If I take a longer look rather than glance concertina fingering does start to assert itself.

 

I learn by ear and/or dots.

 

Chris

Edited for spulling...

Edited February 27, 2004 by Chris Ghent

[mike byrne]

If you want to see air concertina being played look at 'Grock the Clown' on

www.britishpathe.com

[Aldon]

When I feel the need to play an instrument in the car, I reach for my "road whistle." It's a 3-holed tabor pipe that I keep tucked behind the passenger-side seat. It has an octave and a half range and can be played with one hand. It is meant for playing with the left hand while beating a drum with the right, but in the car I play it with the right hand.

 

 

I have a couple of whistles with the top 3 holes taped over for that reason myself! My favorite is a Susato Bb...

 

I also have a tabor pipe, but don't care for the thumbhole thing. I prefer having 3 fingerholes (instead of 2 fingerholes + a thumbhole) because it lets me use my thumb and pinky to hold/balance the whistle.

 

Since you play tabor pipe, can you explain why they use a thumbhole? Is it mainly to get that extra half-step lower note by using the pinky to cover part of the end of the pipe? I've always wondered.......

 

Aldon

[Alan Day]

I was being a bit sneaky when I asked my question about mind playing and music readers,because I think only people who can play by ear and put it to memory can do it.Nobody has replied and said they only play by dots and mind play,all of you who have replied can do both or only by ear.If a dot reader could do it, he could play by ear without the dots.

Come on prove this theory wrong.This is a much more interesting subject than you may think if I am correct.

Al

Edited February 27, 2004 by Alan Day

[JimLucas]

Nobody has replied and said they only play by dots and mind play...

'S true, the only-readers haven't.

 

But I don't think it's my ear playing that makes it work for me. I can also to some extent sight sing (or whistle), i.e., know what the written notes sound like when I see them. And when I mind-play, I can imagine either written notes or note names, or whistle fingerings, or sounds -- however else I already knew it, -- and that's how I translate it into buttons... and bellows for the anglo. (If I'm just practicing "playing" something I already know, it may be simply the feel of the buttons I remember... and reinforce.) Sometimes when I'm learning by ear, though, my fingers find the right buttons while my mind is still trying to decide what they should be.

 

So what about those who "only" read to learn, but who then play from memory. What are you remembering, and can you use it to mind play?

[David Barnert]

Since you play tabor pipe, can you explain why they use a thumbhole? Is it mainly to get that extra half-step lower note by using the pinky to cover part of the end of the pipe? I've always wondered.......

I thought about answering this in a new thread about tabor pipes. I really did. But a whole thread about tabor pipes on concertina.net would have been silly, so I'll answer the question here and hope the subject goes away soon.

 

The only time you can use the little finger to get the low half-step is when all the fingers are down, so it hardly matters whether there's a hole under your thumb or some other finger. You should be able to do that trick with either arrangement.

 

The thumb hole actually makes the instrument easier to hold firmly. With your lips at one end and two fingers clamped on the other end, there's nowhere it can go. I've tried it the other way, too and I find that while it's certainly possible, it tends to roll around a bit when you have two or three holes open.

[Helen]

Oh all right, I'll answer this. I have been avoiding responding to this, sorta like avoiding the plague.

 

But here goes. When I learned a tune for the hammer dulcimer, I would use the dots and immediately memorize the tune. I then played it, I think, geometrically, by the pattern that developed. Sorta like remembering a phone number by the pattern you make when you *dial* the number on your touch tone phone.

 

The most amazing thing. I really never thought about it. I learned Silent Night (on the concertina) and played it for a church. You may not think this is a big deal, but I NEVER played with people, let alone 3 solos. Anyway, I probably never analyzed how I learned the songs because I was just so grateful that I did learn them. The amazing part for me is I learned the songs, never looked at the written music again, and played them by the sound. Heard the sound in my head, did not see the dots in my head. Corrected when I made a mistake by hearing the wrong sound not visualizing the wrong note. Well golly gee. I may just be on my way to playing by ear.

 

I don't think I'm explaining this very well. But boy Alan, you sure got me thinking. A lot of you would talk about hearing the tune you were learning by ear. I don't think I played them enough to notice that before. But I am playing tunes I am learning for the piano accordion a lot. Comes from having a teacher whom you don't want to face without really knowing the tune. I am playing the tunes or sometimes they are songs, quite a bit. And I do hear them in my head. I am not visualizing the dots at all.

 

I learned to read music when I was very young and reading music is very easy and fast for me. I never learned to play by ear although I always wanted to. I can understand a little better now how you play something over and over and then get it in your head and have it come out through your hands. Pretty neat. I'm not there yet, but pretty neat.

 

I'm tempted to delete this whole message, but I'll let it go through.

 

Helen

 

edited to add - I hear the tunes in my head at night now, wake up and hear them and play them without the instrument. I dunno, I think you guys are messing with my mind. This kinda stuff never happened before. Could be because I am playing a whole lot more than I ever did before or Alan is making me crazy. But since I started playing piano accordion a lot the hearing the tunes at odd times has been happening. You are doing it Alan, I know you are. Don't stop, it's kinda nice.

Edited February 28, 2004 by Helen

[d.elliott]

Intrigued,

 

in the UK there are laws against using a mobile phone whilst driving, people have been prosecuted for unwrapping a chocolate bar, or eating a banana whilst controlling a vehicle.

 

playing a virtual concertina, no evidence! unless one sings (loudly) to it too.

 

Dave

[JimLucas]

in the UK there are laws against using a mobile phone  whilst driving, people have been prosecuted for unwrapping a chocolate bar, or eating a banana whilst controlling a vehicle.

An interesting point, and more so with regard to playing tabor pipe while driving, I would think.

 

There was an interesting case a number of years ago in Connecticut (one of the "United" States) where a man was charged under a similar law (I don't remember whether it specified "full attention on driving" or "both hands on the steering wheel", or exactly what) for eating a sandwich while driving. His defense was interesting: He admitted having done so, but claimed that enforcement of the law was prejudicial, and thus unconstitutional:

 

The Defense: "Officer, have you ever observed drivers smoking a cigaret while driving?"

Officer: "Yes."

The Defense: "Often?"

Officer: "Yes."

The Defense: "Have you ever given such a person a summons for doing so?"

Officer: "No."

The Defense: "But according to the wording of the law, they were doing the same as this man you have charged. Is that not so?"

Officer: "Well, yes."

The Defense: "Your Honor?"

The Judge: "I see your point. Case dismissed."

[Alan Day]

Dear Helen,

Thank you for your lovely comments.

The best is yet to come as Irish and English session players will tell you that if you know the tune you can play it,obviously not with some tunes which are more difficult or in an unfriendly key.The way then is to experiment as you play try this or that on the A or B if it works great if it doesn`t do not play it next time around.It is how sessions tunes develop,they are rarely played the same way,the same group of musicians will sound different every time they play.It is because we are not tied exactly to the dots as written but obviously to the tune, it is the arrangement which varies.

As you play more by ear the notes come automatically and you will start to play English Country Gardens at three in the morning in your mind.

Al

Edited February 28, 2004 by Alan Day

[David Barnert]

in the UK there are laws against using a mobile phone  whilst driving, people have been prosecuted for unwrapping a chocolate bar, or eating a banana whilst controlling a vehicle.

An interesting point, and more so with regard to playing tabor pipe while driving, I would think.

There are many things we do while driving that might be thought of as distractions. Some are considerably more disracting than others. I am convinced that speaking on a cellular telephone, be it hand held or not, is way ahead of the rest of the list. Talking to passengers in the car, mental activity, adjusting the radio, listening to the radio, using other dashboard controls, and smoking are considerably less distracting. Even eating a sandwich, which might be somewhere in between.

 

When I play tabor pipe in the car, I am concerned about what might happen in a collision, with the dashboard or the airbag possibly damaging the instrument ( ) but I do not worry about my ability to pay attention to my driving. It is much less of a distraction than talking on a phone.