Daniel Hersh Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 It's here on eBay. Might be a Carlsfelder rather than a Chemitzer but it's an unusual one either way. It's got an interesting case too. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Harrison Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 ...............is it's age.....about 1890 .......accurate , do you think ? Robin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirge Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Why isn't it a 3 row Anglo then, for me and others as ignorant? (And I also thought 'cobblers' when I saw the claimed age, Robin) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted June 29, 2007 Author Share Posted June 29, 2007 Well, I hope that Stephen Chambers or Ted Kloba will provide a more authoritative response, but I'll try... It looks German (from the perforated design on the ends, the long "sectored" bellows, the design of the air valve, the color of the bellows, the look of the endscrews, the fact that it's in Germany, etc.) and I've never heard of a pre-Suttner German-made concertina with more than 30 buttons in an Anglo-style fingering pattern. Also, the key layout (3 long rows on each side) does not look like any 38-button Anglo that I've seen except the rare Jones extended keyboard. And 38 buttons (Chemnitzer players would say "76-key") is a common number for an early or student Chemnitzer. [Though I only count 37 on this one, but the seller says 38.] It's hard to date because it's so unusual, but I don't think that 1890 is out of the question. From what I know, the pattern of perforations on the ends and the general look of the bellows could be consistent with that date. Why isn't it a 3 row Anglo then, for me and others as ignorant? (And I also thought 'cobblers' when I saw the claimed age, Robin) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirge Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Thanks for enlightening me, Daniel. (I looked at the 'incredibly cheap and nasty' finish and thought it must be newer. No science involved !) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marien Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 It looks like a bandoneon key layout. Also, there are only 2 screws to hold one end, and also the air release reminds me of a bandoneon. Tha case may be interesting for a concertina with 7" ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Timson Posted July 2, 2007 Share Posted July 2, 2007 I must admit I'm reminded of the Wheatstone concertina with a Chemnitzer layout that came up on eBay a couple of years ago (better build quality, mind!). Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted July 3, 2007 Author Share Posted July 3, 2007 Why bandoneon rather than Chemnitzer/Carlsfelder? It's my impression from this diagram and elsewhere that bandoneons already had four rows (not three as on this instrument) by the early 1850's. It looks like a bandoneon key layout. Also, there are only 2 screws to hold one end, and also the air release reminds me of a bandoneon. Tha case may be interesting for a concertina with 7" ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marien Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 In general it is true that the bandoneon developed to a bigger instrument through time, but not all newer bandoneons were big bandoneons. I have a 3 row 32 button bandoneon at home that was made around 1900, and they have been making instruments with much more buttons and rows before that time. The 15 buttons on the left hand side of my bandoneon have the same lay out as the dark blue buttons on the chart + the green one. Why bandoneon rather than Chemnitzer/Carlsfelder? It's my impression from this diagram and elsewhere that bandoneons already had four rows (not three as on this instrument) by the early 1850's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theodore Kloba Posted July 3, 2007 Share Posted July 3, 2007 All the Chemnitzers I've seen have had more treble than bass buttons. (E.g. a standard 38-button Chemnitzer has 22T/16B) This instrument has one more on the bass than the treble. No other insights to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted July 4, 2007 Author Share Posted July 4, 2007 (edited) Thanks, Ted and Marien. I stand corrected. Perhaps this one is a relative of the instrument discussed in this thread (photos of that one unfortunately no longer available). In general it is true that the bandoneon developed to a bigger instrument through time, but not all newer bandoneons were big bandoneons. I have a 3 row 32 button bandoneon at home that was made around 1900, and they have been making instruments with much more buttons and rows before that time. The 15 buttons on the left hand side of my bandoneon have the same lay out as the dark blue buttons on the chart + the green one. All the Chemnitzers I've seen have had more treble than bass buttons. (E.g. a standard 38-button Chemnitzer has 22T/16B) This instrument has one more on the bass than the treble. No other insights to offer. Edited July 4, 2007 by Daniel Hersh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Stout Posted July 4, 2007 Share Posted July 4, 2007 I notice that the auction ended with no bids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted July 6, 2007 Author Share Posted July 6, 2007 And now it seems to be back, at a lower price, with a listing now in German rather than English, and from a different seller! I notice that the auction ended with no bids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asdormire Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 And now it seems to be back, at a lower price, with a listing now in German rather than English, and from a different seller! Since the concertina was in Germany all along, maybe they decided to try to sell it in the US first. If Robin and I kept seperate ebay accounts, I could see trying something like that if I thought it might bring more somewhere else first, Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted July 6, 2007 Author Share Posted July 6, 2007 Yes, I think that it's something like that. I don't suspect fraud. And now it seems to be back, at a lower price, with a listing now in German rather than English, and from a different seller!Since the concertina was in Germany all along, maybe they decided to try to sell it in the US first. If Robin and I kept seperate ebay accounts, I could see trying something like that if I thought it might bring more somewhere else first, Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 I don't suspect fraud. Don't you? Would you like to buy the Brooklyn Bridge: I just happen to have one for sale.... MC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimLucas Posted July 6, 2007 Share Posted July 6, 2007 Would you like to buy the Brooklyn Bridge: I just happen to have one for sale.... Is that the Brooklyn Bridge in New York City, the Light Street Bridge connecting Baltimore to nearby Brooklyn, or perhaps a bridge to Brooklyn in Belgium or to Breukelen in the Netherlands? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted July 7, 2007 Share Posted July 7, 2007 Would you like to buy the Brooklyn Bridge: I just happen to have one for sale.... Is that the Brooklyn Bridge in New York City, the Light Street Bridge connecting Baltimore to nearby Brooklyn, or perhaps a bridge to Brooklyn in Belgium or to Breukelen in the Netherlands? Sorry, I misread the label. It's a Wheatstone Bridge.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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