Anglogeezertoo Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 For auction, 20th September at Capes Dunn & Co, 40 Station Road, Heaton Mersey, Cheshire. SK4 3QT Lot 172WHEATSTONE, LATE NINETEENTH CENTURY CONCERTINA NO. 30246 of hexagonal form with foliate scroll pierced electroplated end panels, oval plated tablet to one end stamped Wheatstone 30246, the other with brass oval tablet stamped Wheatstone and Co., Inventors patentees and manufact(urers), London, nineteen plated metal buttons to each end and playing on steel reeds, the ebonised wood frame with six fold black leather bellows, leather strap handles, one end of each screw fixed through a bone tablet, 7 1/4" (diameter (18.4cm) in red plush lined MAHOGANY BOX (a.f.) Estimate: £500 - £800 See here :– https://www.ukauctioneers.com/auction_catalogue.cfm?itemID=20E9CB0FD7D62EF5D1EFFECEFF5909EFEB2BAFC8&auction=21E8C308DF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick McMahon Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Looks like a rare concertina. Is that a Linota? Anybody know how you can tell? I wouldn't get too exited by the auction estimate. There was a Crabb at one of these auctions recently, quite similar to this. The auction estimate was £150 to £250. It went for £2,900 plus buyers premium and vat, which made it about £3,500 to take away. Maybe still ok at that price, but nothing like the estimate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicx66 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 (edited) Horniman ledgers put it at 1924? http://www.horniman.info/DKNSARC/SD02/PAGES/D2P0200S.HTM Edited September 16, 2016 by nicx66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Hare Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Looks like a rare concertina. Is that a Linota? Anybody know how you can tell? I have no intention of buying this instrument, but as I'm now living only a few miles away, I will probably stagger along on the viewing day (19 Sept) - just to have a look, and to see if it's playable. How do I tell if it is a Linota? What should I look for? Thank you. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDF Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Looks like a rare concertina. Is that a Linota? Anybody know how you can tell? I have no intention of buying this instrument, but as I'm now living only a few miles away, I will probably stagger along on the viewing day (19 Sept) - just to have a look, and to see if it's playable. How do I tell if it is a Linota? What should I look for? Thank you. Roger Those look like the original hand rests so they may have Linota stamped on them.if the reeds are in good shape it could be a really good concertina.David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimLucas Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Isn't 40 buttons the standard more-than-30 Wheatstone layout? Could this be a custom instrument with a Jeffries layout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jody Kruskal Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 Isn't 40 buttons the standard more-than-30 Wheatstone layout? Could this be a custom instrument with a Jeffries layout? This is close but not the same as the Jefferies 38. The standard Jefferies 38 layout has 5 buttons in the accidental far row and a single button in what would be a near 4th row. Still, looks nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick McMahon Posted September 17, 2016 Share Posted September 17, 2016 The 7.25 inches diameter is a bit unclear to me. Is that across the flats, or across the corners? If it's across flats then it's a bigger than standard concertina. How that would affect it's value I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex West Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Isn't 40 buttons the standard more-than-30 Wheatstone layout? Could this be a custom instrument with a Jeffries layout? Jim Even in the 1910 pricelist on concertina.com, the "standard" sizes were 30, 32, 36 and 40 keys and it was the same in the 1934 price list which Stephen Chambers referenced in a post in 2004. Model type 61 indicates that it's the very best quality ("...finest finish, .... extra superior steel reeds, improved action...") so whether it's stamped as a Linota or not, it's the equivalent of one. I used to have a 30 key of similar vintage (30948) and it was a terrific concertina Alex West Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDF Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 The 7.25 inches diameter is a bit unclear to me. Is that across the flats, or across the corners? If it's across flats then it's a bigger than standard concertina. How that would affect it's value I have no idea. Yes that will be across the corners.That will make it 6 1/4" across the flats which is normal and will not affect the value the most important thing is whether anyone has mucked about with the reeds.David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoffrey Crabb Posted September 18, 2016 Share Posted September 18, 2016 Just a few quick comments. 7.25 inches point to point = 6.25 across the flats. Besides the date, the Ledger (SDO2 Page 20) shows 30246 to be a Model 61. This places the instrument within the Linota range according to contemporary Wheatstone pricelists and an impressed *LINOTA* may be present on a handrest face. Whilst the pricelists describe the Model 61 as having 36 keys, other ledger entries indicate that this model number was used to cover instruments having 36-39 keys inc. Examples being 28068 (36k), 28069 (37k), 28070 (39k), Ledger SDO1 Page 123, and 28364, (a special 38k), Ledger SDO1 Page 135. As the 30246 Ledger entry also includes ‘37 keys’ , it is very probable that the Auctioneers have included the wind key in the button count. Unfortunately, due to the absence of a picture of the right side we cannot know how those buttons are arranged. Some 20 plus, 37 key Model 61’s were made between 1919 & 1924 Geoffrey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Hare Posted September 19, 2016 Share Posted September 19, 2016 (edited) For auction, 20th September at Capes Dunn & Co, 40 Station Road, Heaton Mersey, Cheshire. SK4 3QT Lot 172 WHEATSTONE, LATE NINETEENTH CENTURY CONCERTINA NO. 30246 of hexagonal form with foliate scroll pierced electroplated end panels, oval plated tablet to one end stamped Wheatstone 30246, the other with brass oval tablet stamped Wheatstone and Co., Inventors patentees and manufact(urers), London, nineteen plated metal buttons to each end and playing on steel reeds, the ebonised wood frame with six fold black leather bellows, leather strap handles, one end of each screw fixed through a bone tablet, 7 1/4" (diameter (18.4cm) in red plush lined MAHOGANY BOX (a.f.) Estimate: £500 - £800 See here :– https://www.ukauctioneers.com/auction_catalogue.cfm?itemID=20E9CB0FD7D62EF5D1EFFECEFF5909EFEB2BAFC8&auction=21E8C308DF OK, I dragged my weary body along to look at this this morning. It is as described, plus: There is no indication that it is a 'Linota', externally at least. It is 6.25" across the flats. It is C/G. It is not 'playable' - there are some notes not sounding, and some seriously out of tune. There is some air leakage - I suspect from dodgy valves - the bellows (black papers) looked in reasonable condition to me. I did manage to get the first few bars of 'The College Hornpipe' out of the brute - not helped by the fact that the right hand strap is broken (got the auction room staff dancing though... ). I took some fairly dodgy photographs which are attached. I'm not yet expert enough to give a definitive opinion, but I think that with a lot of TLC this might be a nice instrument, though I certainly wouldn't even consider doing it myself. I don't intend to return to the sale tomorrow, but the staff tell me that prices realised should be available via their website on Wednesday... Roger Edited September 19, 2016 by lachenal74693 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick McMahon Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Sold for £3,100 hammer price. Which equals about £3,800 including fees. It sounds a lot, but if it's exactly what someone wants, and they've been waiting a long time for one to come up, then it's not a lot for a good player who enjoys performing. It's a lot for someone like me, who could and would make it sound awful. I'm assuming that the buyer went to see it and confirmed for themselves that it's a C/G . But the auction does confirm that there's no point in getting exited over a low auctioneer's estimate. I've gone through the motions of registering with one of these auction companies, but baulked at the conditions, whereby they don't deliver, they just refer you to a third party, and they want your credit card details, including the security three digit number, just to register you to bid. Has anyone else done this, and are your details secure, giving them to an unknown company online? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Hare Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 (edited) Sold for £3,100 hammer price. Which equals about £3,800 including fees....But the auction does confirm that there's no point in getting exited over a low auctioneer's estimate.... I went along to the auctioneers free valuation day today (4/11) with one or two items, and was a little surprised by the £3100 hammer price (I hadn't seen PMMs post until just now). Regarding the estimate, the auctioneer told me that the low estimate was due to the fact that he came up with the estimate before he opened the instrument up and saw the insides. He seemed to be saying that had he seen the insides first, he would have put a higher estimate on the instrument in the first place... I will be keeping an eye on this auction house, they are only a bus ride away... Roger Edited November 4, 2016 by lachenal74693 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Looks like a rare concertina. Is that a Linota? Anybody know how you can tell? How do I tell if it is a Linota? What should I look for? Thank you. Roger LINOTA was simply Wheatstone's trade mark for their whole range of Anglos, which were introduced by Edward Chidley junior after the death of his father in 1899. I haven't established what year it was registered, but it appears as "Trade + LINOTA + Mark" in the earliest Wheatstone Anglo catalogue I have seen, from c.1910, and they seem to have continued to use it up until World War 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Any ideas for the significance of the choice of the actual word ' Linota' ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Any ideas for the significance of the choice of the actual word ' Linota' ? I'm wide-open to better suggestions, but Linota is the genus of (the singing bird) the linnet...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted November 5, 2016 Share Posted November 5, 2016 Well done Stephen. ' Linota Cannabina ( the common linnet ) . A plain, but melodious member of the Finch family '. An excellent suggestion. Go to the top of the class ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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