malcolm clapp Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 (edited) Attached photos sent to me by the owner of a 48 key English with some unusual features. It appears to have not been used or repaired for many years. I am unable to view the instrument personally, and unfortunately internal photos are not availble. Bellows papers appear similar to Crabb/Jeffries style, with some nice gold tooling on the frames. Even the bellows itself appears to have that look, being a little more chunky than that found on Lachenal and Wheatstone English models of the period. End covers look like amboyna or similar. Note the brass(?) bindings at the corners. The right hand oval bears the name "Alfred Hays, 4 Royal Exchange, London", who I believe was a musical instrument dealer and publisher. I recall seeing his name on wooden flutes and sheet music in the past. There is an intriguingly low number, 12, on the left, stamped onto the baffle. The depth of the bellows frame suggests perhaps a double chambered reedpan with an internal baffle. Yes, I know it would perhaps be nice to have a look inside, but that is not possible at present. I'm thinking, but not convincingly, Case or Scates with a replacement Crabb bellows.... Or perhaps Nickolds? Or...or...or... Any ideas??? Edited to add that the owner has advised that there appears to be a date visible through the fretwork: 23/2/1875. Edited November 23, 2012 by malcolm clapp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex West Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Malcolm The fretwork ends look like the fancy Simpson model which Neil Wayne shows in his Concertina Collection - see the link here (http://www.concertinamuseum.com/CM00363.htm) but the bellows gilding looks more like a Jones Not sure if that's any help Alex West Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirge Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 You may have thought of this Malcolm but the corner treatment reminds me of a campaign chest; you know, one of those Victorian chest of drawers made to be part of an army officers travelling kit? Brass corners and edges everywhere to protect against knocks. I wonder if it was commissioned by a soldier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDF Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Hi Malcolm,This may be of interest.David. http://www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13263&st=0&p=128473&hl=campaign&fromsearch=1entry128473 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirge Posted November 23, 2012 Share Posted November 23, 2012 Hi Malcolm,This may be of interest.David. http://www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13263&st=0&p=128473&hl=campaign&fromsearch=1entry128473 Oh I'd quite forgotten we'd been there before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted November 25, 2012 Author Share Posted November 25, 2012 Hi Malcolm,This may be of interest.David. http://www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13263&st=0&p=128473&hl=campaign&fromsearch=1entry128473 Oh I'd quite forgotten we'd been there before. According to the owner, not the same instrument as he has owned his for "many years".... But very much a twin/triplet/quad.... Thanks for pointing out the earlier thread, David. Owner has some thoughts of selling, but I have little interest in it myself. Maybe one for the collector. Mr Wayne???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 Hi Malcolm If the owner is interested in selling ask him to email Neil at neil.wayne<at>free-reed.co.uk best wishes chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLDNICKILBY Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Malcolm This looks a lot like the one that I let Chris photograph for his paper on Rock Chidley. Have a look. Although the photos of this Tina are a little fuzzy I think that it might just be She Oak as Chidley was at some point in his career a Timber Merchant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 Malcolm This looks a lot like the one that I let Chris photograph for his paper on Rock Chidley. Have a look. Although the photos of this Tina are a little fuzzy I think that it might just be She Oak as Chidley was at some point in his career a Timber Merchant The o.p. one in Australia certainly isn't she-oak. Definitely amboyna veneer. Nothing about it points me towards Chidley as the maker; pretty convinced it is by George Case, though Jones is an outside possibility...but the intriguingly low serial number 12 perhaps indicates othewise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 (edited) I now have (temporarily!) possession of this concertina. In pencil is inscribed, on the underside if both end covers, "Maker J Potter" and the date, 23/2/75. A bit of a Google led me to this passage from George Jones' recollections: "...an account of the progress of others who commenced business for themselves. Mr. Scates sold his business to Mr. George Case, the Professor. His shop was in Bond Street. Not being a practical man failed, sold his interest and business to Messrs Boosey and Co. who manufactured Concertinas under the management of Mr. Giles, tuner, with the assistance of Bankham, Card, Potter, Parish and others. Mr. Rock Chidley started in Oxford Street, also made harmoniums. Mr. Dove started in Poland Street but made no headway and arranged with Keith Prowse who purchased the tools etc. and who produced good instruments by the employment of Bankham, Card, Potter and Parrish. " Interesting. Anything further known about Mr Potter? Edited December 13, 2012 by malcolm clapp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Hi The date 23/2/1875 seems a bit late for the manufacturer of the concertina, especially given its similarity to the Simpson - as pointed out by Alex earlier. I don't know if it's an optical illusion, but the bellows frame looks deep enough to take double pans - if this is the 'case' then it may have been made by Case, Boosey & Sons - would like to see the action tho' - it may help chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 (edited) Hi The date 23/2/1875 seems a bit late for the manufacturer of the concertina, especially given its similarity to the Simpson - as pointed out by Alex earlier. I don't know if it's an optical illusion, but the bellows frame looks deep enough to take double pans - if this is the 'case' then it may have been made by Case, Boosey & Sons - would like to see the action tho' - it may help chris Not convinced about the Simpson connection. The "holly leaf" cartouche I have seen on both Jones and Case/Boosey labelled instruments. And there would seem to be some doubt as to whether Simpson ever was a maker, but perhaps just a dealer. The bellows frame is deep, but the reed pans do not have double chambers. However, there is an internal wooden baffle on the bellows side of the pans, raised 1/4" or so on pillars above the reeds. These would necessitate the extra bellows depth. Photo #1 shows the internal baffle; photo #2 the signature; photo #3 the action board. Chris, please let me know if you would like any other angles or parts photographed. Happy to post them here, or pm/email if you like.... Edited December 13, 2012 by malcolm clapp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 Interesting button design too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcoover Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 The internal baffle is very unusual - does it make it any louder perchance? Screw threads would make the button height easily adjustable, but that sure is a lot of extra machining to accomplish that. Any other interesting pecularities? Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 interesting concertina! the action looks like Case, or Jones. Neil Wayne has a Case - earlyish ie with the 32 New Bond Street label http://www.concertinamuseum.com./Images/Concertinas_T-Series/C184g3c.jpg that one also has a similar baffle! It may have been an experimental design that Case tinkered with prior to his involvement with Boosey & Sons - they went on to make the 'full' double pan system that we know and love, but wonder why they bothered! The fret work design is not one that I've seen on a concertina with a Case label - maybe he made it to someone else's pattern Don't you wish they used better glue to stick labels in!! chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 "...an account of the progress of others who commenced business for themselves. Mr. Scates sold his business to Mr. George Case, the Professor. His shop was in Bond Street. Not being a practical man failed, sold his interest and business to Messrs Boosey and Co. who manufactured Concertinas under the management of Mr. Giles, tuner, with the assistance of Bankham, Card, Potter, Parish and others. Mr. Rock Chidley started in Oxford Street, also made harmoniums. Mr. Dove started in Poland Street but made no headway and arranged with Keith Prowse who purchased the tools etc. and who produced good instruments by the employment of Bankham, Card, Potter and Parrish. " In view of the state of flux that these makers seemed to have been in, does it really mean much to ascribe a makers name? It could have been worked on by several people, and possibly even in more than one shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 13, 2012 Author Share Posted December 13, 2012 "...an account of the progress of others who commenced business for themselves. Mr. Scates sold his business to Mr. George Case, the Professor. His shop was in Bond Street. Not being a practical man failed, sold his interest and business to Messrs Boosey and Co. who manufactured Concertinas under the management of Mr. Giles, tuner, with the assistance of Bankham, Card, Potter, Parish and others. Mr. Rock Chidley started in Oxford Street, also made harmoniums. Mr. Dove started in Poland Street but made no headway and arranged with Keith Prowse who purchased the tools etc. and who produced good instruments by the employment of Bankham, Card, Potter and Parrish. " In view of the state of flux that these makers seemed to have been in, does it really mean much to ascribe a makers name? It could have been worked on by several people, and possibly even in more than one shop. Yes, it does seem that messrs Potter and friends put thenselves around a bit. The thought that occurs to me is that perhaps Potter was the specialist woodworker for a number of "makers" and that his "Maker" signature on the o.p. concertina referred only to the end covers. The signature appears on both ends. I read somewhere that Mr Card was the bellows-maker to several makers...and quite an appropriate name too, imho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolm clapp Posted December 14, 2012 Author Share Posted December 14, 2012 The internal baffle is very unusual - does it make it any louder perchance? Gary Impossible to say, due to the current lack of airtightness caused by worn/eaten/compressed pads, plus one non-functioning (stripped) end bolt collar. My gut feeling is that no, it wouldn't. I think the aim was to equalise the tone between push and pull reeds rather than to increase volume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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