johnobuttons Posted May 1, 2009 Share Posted May 1, 2009 One of the difficulties of playing a concertina is that it's very hard to hear yourself in a group. All the sound comes out the sides of the concertina and not much gets to the player. I plan to describe one solution to this problem here and give enough technical information so you can build it yourself. The basic idea is a headphone amplifier providing "plug in power", two tiny electret microphones placed under the wrist straps of the concertina, and a set of headphones, preferably relatively inconspicuous. For this post, here are pictures of the electret microphones slipped under the wrist straps. Also pictured is the inside of an amplifier that I built and a schematic diagram for the amp. I will add more details as time goes by. The other application for this amplifier would be as a way to use these inexpensive electret microphones in a performance. I spent some effort in adjusting the amplifier to get the right volume and gain for this close up miking of a concertina. The microphones were bought on e-bay for about $20 for the pair. A recent listing is http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...em=260295643634 John Hamilton PS I had trouble attaching schematic and picture of amp. I'll put them in next post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnobuttons Posted May 1, 2009 Author Share Posted May 1, 2009 (edited) Here's the picture of the amplifier and the schematic for it and the basic layout of the circuit board. John Edited May 5, 2009 by johnobuttons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I certainly identify with the problem - hearing yourself in a loud session is especially difficult when you're uncertain of a tune and want to play quietly while you find your way around it. But I'm not attracted to the idea of mics, amps and headphones in such circumstances. I wonder whether a purely acoustic solution would be better - little reflectors like wing mirrors on the ends of the tina and angled to reflect some of the sound up towards the player. Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Ghent Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 (edited) I certainly identify with the problem - hearing yourself in a loud session is especially difficult when you're uncertain of a tune and want to play quietly while you find your way around it. But I'm not attracted to the idea of mics, amps and headphones in such circumstances. I wonder whether a purely acoustic solution would be better - little reflectors like wing mirrors on the ends of the tina and angled to reflect some of the sound up towards the player. Ray I tried passive reflectors attached to the concertina, angled to reflect towards the head. I found they made very little difference, whereas wearing a hat with a stiff wide brim makes a large difference. Another low tech solution would be to use Gosport tubes. Gosport tubes are those early aeroplane intercoms as used in the DH82 Tiger Moths, and used in jumbo jets for headphones until about fifteen years ago. Best solution is a good loud concertina. Chris Edited May 3, 2009 by Chris Ghent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Crossland Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 I know where you can get good loud concertinas! Contact the above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnobuttons Posted May 3, 2009 Author Share Posted May 3, 2009 (edited) I certainly identify with the problem - hearing yourself in a loud session is especially difficult when you're uncertain of a tune and want to play quietly while you find your way around it. But I'm not attracted to the idea of mics, amps and headphones in such circumstances. I wonder whether a purely acoustic solution would be better - little reflectors like wing mirrors on the ends of the tina and angled to reflect some of the sound up towards the player. Ray I actually agree with your philosophy. I could hardly bear to wear this gear at first. However as time rolls by, I'm coming to accept the electronic solution. The bottom line in my book is that if it helps you play better with other folks then it's a good thing. I admit that I tend to use this gear only with long term friends. I'm curious whether anyone else decides to build one of these things (or already uses something similar). John PS Unfortunately, buying a louder concertina is not always an option. Not to mention the arms race that ensues if everyone tries to get louder instruments! Edited May 3, 2009 by johnobuttons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aprelias Posted May 4, 2009 Share Posted May 4, 2009 I've used a set of small microphones clipped to the handles of my anglo, fed to a personal amp on my belt, and then used one 'earbud' and it worked fairly well. Then I had Bob Tedrow at Homewood Musical Instruments build a 'Fretless' Anglo for me and it works better than any electronic method. Here's the link" http://hmi.homewood.net/fretless/ The sound comes out the sides, rather than the ends, and I can hear it fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted May 4, 2009 Share Posted May 4, 2009 One of the difficulties of playing a concertina is that it's very hard to hear yourself in a group. Isn't the simplest answer just to sit a little further away from the louder musicians? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnobuttons Posted May 5, 2009 Author Share Posted May 5, 2009 I've used a set of small microphones clipped to the handles of my anglo, fed to a personal amp on my belt, and then used one 'earbud' and itworked fairly well. Then I had Bob Tedrow at Homewood Musical Instruments build a 'Fretless' Anglo for me and it works better than any electronic method. Here's the link" http://hmi.homewood.net/fretless/ The sound comes out the sides, rather than the ends, and I can hear it fine. The Tedrow looks like a great solution! When I ordered my Dipper, Colin offered to put holes in the top side of the concertina to let sound out. I was reluctant to order something so unusual, but it does look like a perfect fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Besser Posted May 5, 2009 Share Posted May 5, 2009 I've used a set of small microphones clipped to the handles of my anglo, fed to a personal amp on my belt, and then used one 'earbud' and itworked fairly well. Then I had Bob Tedrow at Homewood Musical Instruments build a 'Fretless' Anglo for me and it works better than any electronic method. Here's the link" http://hmi.homewood.net/fretless/ The sound comes out the sides, rather than the ends, and I can hear it fine. Do you lose much in overall volume? Bob says the upper frequencies are less pronounced with the fretless. Do you find the higher notes are weak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asdormire Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 I've used a set of small microphones clipped to the handles of my anglo, fed to a personal amp on my belt, and then used one 'earbud' and itworked fairly well. Then I had Bob Tedrow at Homewood Musical Instruments build a 'Fretless' Anglo for me and it works better than any electronic method. Here's the link" http://hmi.homewood.net/fretless/ The sound comes out the sides, rather than the ends, and I can hear it fine. Do you lose much in overall volume? Bob says the upper frequencies are less pronounced with the fretless. Do you find the higher notes are weak? The volume is fine. I've got the first of those fretless concertinas, and you can look at the construction of it over in the Instrument building and repair area of this forum. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnobuttons Posted May 9, 2009 Author Share Posted May 9, 2009 I certainly identify with the problem - hearing yourself in a loud session is especially difficult when you're uncertain of a tune and want to play quietly while you find your way around it. But I'm not attracted to the idea of mics, amps and headphones in such circumstances. I wonder whether a purely acoustic solution would be better - little reflectors like wing mirrors on the ends of the tina and angled to reflect some of the sound up towards the player. Ray I tried passive reflectors attached to the concertina, angled to reflect towards the head. I found they made very little difference, whereas wearing a hat with a stiff wide brim makes a large difference. Another low tech solution would be to use Gosport tubes. Gosport tubes are those early aeroplane intercoms as used in the DH82 Tiger Moths, and used in jumbo jets for headphones until about fifteen years ago. Best solution is a good loud concertina. Chris The wide brim hat would also work to block the distracting sound of the concertina bouncing off of ceiling fans. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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