Reading With Anglo

[m3838]

I was contacted by C.net member with question whether I have the tabs for the tune I submitted, "Forgotten". (real title "Amids the Steppes").

I'd like to use this opportunity to firstly thank everybody, who uttered kind words regarding my more than modest rendition of the tune, and secondly to raise the topic of reading.

I spent some time learning chromatic accordion. Lots of reading, difficult reading. Then I quit and came back to diatonic. Intentionally learning by the ear and by the tabs. But recently I designed semi-chromatic 20 button Anglo and all of a sudden I feel the need to reed again. Lots of music is available through the reading, mostly because when playing in varios keys on the Anglo, the push/pulling becomes hectic and not intuitive. Once again, I found that reading with C/G Anglo Concertina is very easy!!! Much more easy than with chromatic accordion.

I would urge anyone not to rely on tablature, but learn to read with a concertina.

Your hand is strapped, few buttons are conviniently under your fingers, you always know where you are and the range is pretty good.

[Nigel]

II would urge anyone not to rely on tablature, but learn to read with a concertina.

I totally agree. I tried tab with one of Mick Bramich's books ( for the 20 key concertina). I found you had to take in 3 different pieces of information for each note - the button number, push or pull and the length of the note. It doesn't take too long to learn the notes on the stave and to apply that to the buttons(keys!) on the concertina, particularly if you only try to learn one row at a time. I found it useful to mentally split the stave in half between A and B, to correspond with the left/right hand side of the C row. On the left hand side, all the notes on a line on the stave are push notes and all the notes in a space are draw notes. On the right hand side the notes on a line are draw notes and the notes in a space are push notes. This doen't quite work for the last 2 buttons but it is good enough for the majority of notes that you'll encounter in most tunes. Of course on the G row it is the other way round

Edited March 7, 2006 by Nigel

[Mark Evans]

I agree. My first instrument was an Anglo-German 20 button and when my folks kindly paid for lessons, I learned from a tutor by Schirmer. The diatonic box and I in the end were not a fit, but learning to read music was a gift that has continued to benefit my musical life.

 

I tried tab on bluegrass banjo...once. Ugh! Too complicated. It felt like deciphering chant neumes. Bad example however. Bluegrass banjo and reading? What was I thinking? Just young I guess.

[Rhomylly]

I agree, too!

 

I had a very wise musician friend tell me, "When you're just starting out, don't even worry about note names. Just focus on, 'this note on this line is this button/action.' Note names will come later."

 

He was quite right.

[Henk van Aalten]

I had a very wise musician friend tell me, "When you're just starting out, don't even worry about note names. Just focus on, 'this note on this line is this button/action.' Note names will come later."

 

He was quite right.

Thanks Rhomylly for this reaction. For some (mainly Dutch concertina beginners) I made this tiny web-space. Most of them have no clue about notation. Others might wonder.... a G can be played at different buttons.... but which one should I take??

For all those questions tablature might be a big help.... to come to a level where tablature is no longer needed!!

[Paul Read]

I agree, too!

 

I had a very wise musician friend tell me, "When you're just starting out, don't even worry about note names. Just focus on, 'this note on this line is this button/action.' Note names will come later."

 

He was quite right.

 

I couldn't agree more. However, I stil have to stop and think if someone says -give me an A etc.

[CaryK]

Since taking up the anglo concertina I've been struck by how many examples of tablature there are in the different tutors. I had expected this to be standardized, like for guitar. Knowing very little music, I made up my own tablature, modified from the Bertram Levy tutor, and write it down above the notes themselves. As I beginner I found this useful, because it gave me the immediate sight connection between note and button/action, which by daily repetition has helped me to learn to sight read without the tablature. I'm still slow at this, but its coming along and I'm miles ahead of where I started 12 months ago. I still find tablature very useful in the learning stages of a song with chords or left hand accompaniment to right hand melody. I recognize that tablature can become a crutch though and expect that within a period of time I will be able to do without it entirely. But it has been a great aid at the beginning for me.

[Mark Evans]

I recognize that tablature can become a crutch though and expect that within a period of time I will be able to do without it entirely. /quote]

 

Not just tab, standard notation can become a crutch as well.

[Rhomylly]

I agree, too!

 

I had a very wise musician friend tell me, "When you're just starting out, don't even worry about note names. Just focus on, 'this note on this line is this button/action.' Note names will come later."

 

He was quite right.

 

I couldn't agree more. However, I stil have to stop and think if someone says -give me an A etc.

 

I do. too. But not for as long as I used to

[Samantha]

Any system of notation is going to have to be learnt. As there is a far greater amount and variety of music available written with "dots" on "lines" in "staves" I can't help feeling you might as well learn to read that, as it will save time transcribing things in the longer term (who really wants to to transcribe a Bach two part invention into tablature?). Why not attack the task separately from learning to play the concertina for a while? Consult with music teachers or music book shops about basic theory books and spend 10 minutes a day studying "traditional" music notation. Or work with your concertina assigning buttons/directions to the written notation and devise you own "theory handbook", and then work from that independently of your instrument for a few minutes a day. Whichever system you play, make a map of your keyboard and link the buttons to notes on a stave ... Find the method that suits you and stick with it for a while.

I can't remember learning to read music (I can remember learning to read words) - so maybe it's easy for me to hold this view, but my experience of teaching Russian (with its alien alphabet for English speaking people) indicates that it really is not that difficult, even for adults in middle age or later, to learn a new set of symbols. And the advantage of using a set of symbols that is widely used by others is that it enables you to share knowledge with others.

Samantha

[JimLucas]

...the advantage of using a set of symbols that is widely used by others is that it enables you to share knowledge with others.

Absolutely! I have read mandolin and banjo tablature, as well as various anglo tablatures on the English, but it's not much fun. The point of standard notation is that it's about music, not about buttons, or any particular instrument. I don't think I've met anyone who can sight-read tablature, i.e., read the tablature -- whether for concertina, guitar, or whatever -- for a tune they've never heard, fast enough to play it "at speed". Tablature seems to be more of a technique for memorizing music, not for playing music.

 

One exception, perhaps, is the fiddle notation/tablature (it's hard to know how to characterize it) in a couple of books I have of Norwegian fiddle tunes. It tells how to tune the strings, then uses "standard" notation for the fingering as if the fiddle were in standard tuning. I.e., if the tuning is A-D-a-e (as opposed to the standard G-D-a-e), then A-B-C# on the lowest string is written (on a standard staff) as G-A-B. But D-E-F# on the D string is written as D-E-F#, because that particular string is in standard tuning. Let me just say that it takes a bit of concentration to read that and play the right notes on a concertina where I can't temporarily retune a subset of the buttons. It may work beautifully for the fiddle, but it's anti-helpful for anyone who plays just about any other instrument.

 

Tablature may be useful for beginners on the anglo for teaching them particular sequences, techniques, and styles, but for someone who's reached the point of being able to decide for themselves which bellows direction and which button to use, it's a hindrance.

 

To head off anyone who feels like jumping in to promote ABC notation as an alternative to standard notation, I will agree that it shares the advantage of being more oriented toward music generally than toward a particular instrument, but I'll ask... is there anyone who claims to be able to read multi-part music "at speed" from ABC notation? The advantage, in my opinion, to "standard" music notation is that it is multidimensional, while ABC is 1-dimensional and thus needs to use concatenated strings to represent inherent multidimensionality (pitch, harmony, duration, etc.) in a linear fashion.

 

That's my view. Your turn.

[m3838]

I think that tablature is a working tool in the land of diatonic accordions. Out of G/C, C/F, D/G, A/D accordions one can't learn so many keyboards in spare time. I use Bernard Loffett's tab system, combining tab and music in a nicely thought out manner. His tabs are all for G/C, Mally Melodeon is all in D/G. Tab makes you overpass this and learn the tunes on any system. With DBB the reading isn't such a convinient tool, unless you are going to stick to one tuning, which very few people do, actually.

Concertinas are not that varied, so learning to read is an asset.

(speaking only about Anglo, EC is the ultimate reading machine)

[Larry Stout]

...the advantage of using a set of symbols that is widely used by others is that it enables you to share knowledge with others.

Absolutely! I have read mandolin and banjo tablature, as well as various anglo tablatures on the English, but it's not much fun. The point of standard notation is that it's about music, not about buttons, or any particular instrument. I don't think I've met anyone who can sight-read tablature, i.e., read the tablature -- whether for concertina, guitar, or whatever -- for a tune they've never heard, fast enough to play it "at speed". Tablature seems to be more of a technique for memorizing music, not for playing music.

 

One exception, perhaps, is the fiddle notation/tablature (it's hard to know how to characterize it) in a couple of books I have of Norwegian fiddle tunes. It tells how to tune the strings, then uses "standard" notation for the fingering as if the fiddle were in standard tuning.

 

That's my view. Your turn.

 

It is reasonably common for lute players to sight read French tabulature (and maybe Italian tab as well, but probably not the German tab which developed much earlier and actually assumes a smaller number of strings than the lute usually has) at speed. Scordatura (like the Norwegian fiddle mentioned above) was common for viola d'amore-- an instrument usually played by violinists but not tuned like a violin; indeed, often tuned differently for different pieces (standard tunings are either a D major chord or a D minor chord: ADADFAD or ADADF#D covering 3 octaves).

 

For Anglo concertina I'd think something like what Paul de Ville used in his tutor is a useful crutch-- he gives the notes in a standard staff with an indication of which button that note is and whether it is push or draw. His tutor is for a 20 button C-G, so there are not a lot of alternate fingerings available. That said, I didn't manage to figure out the instrument using that tutor!

[Dan Worrall]

Thanks Rhomylly for this reaction. For some (mainly Dutch concertina beginners) I made this tiny web-space. Most of them have no clue about notation. Others might wonder.... a G can be played at different buttons.... but which one should I take??

For all those questions tablature might be a big help.... to come to a level where tablature is no longer needed!!

 

This is a fascinating topic that gets to the essence of the peculiarities (and strengths) of the anglo.

There are two reasons one might use tablature, to my way of thinking. One is in the beginning, as Henk mentions. In Bertram's tutor, for example, the tablature comes in handy for discussing things like ornaments and runs, where adding a note off the central row helps with flow. This cannot be shown with just the notes on the page, of course.

A second reason would be for those studying the style of a particular player, or in looking at arrangements (rare to have these written out). If one is only concerned with developing his/her own particular style, without worrying too much about other earlier players, this would not be too much of an issue. But knowing how Player A puts his fingering choices together, and how that affects his overall sound, is both interesting and sometimes useful, depending upon how you want yourself to sound.

Consider the impossible situation of having Chris Droney, Noel Hill, Scan Tester, and William Kimber in the same room (now THAT would be a hoot!). If you asked them each to play the scale of G, you would likely get four different methods of playing what are the same notes:

Chris Droney would likely play the scale along the bottom row.

Noel Hill would likely use his cross row scale, which is slightly different in a couple of places, and imparts a different bellows rhythm.

Kimber would play the scale mostly on the right hand (he would start with the G on the top of the C row left, proceed to the first two buttons of the C row right, and end on the G row right). He does this to better accomodate chords on the left hand.

Scan Tester might play the scale like Chris Droney, but then add a parallel octave above at the same time, also on the G row. Or he might add an octave to the scale as played by Kimber...it depends on the needs of the tune.

 

These subtle or not so subtle differences are deeply ingrained into their individual styles, and permeate the way they play and sound. It can be very helpful to know this, and tablature is the only easy way to sort this out, unless you get the chance to meet a particular player in person. This is why I like the admitted luxury of a simple tablature of button numbers written above or below the written music....it adds another dimension to understanding style and technique. Nonetheless, I agree totally with the comments above that it is also useful to just read written notes, wherever those buttons reside.

 

There was some discussion last month on this forum about Kimber's somewhat counter-intuitive drawn C at the end of the C scale, and how that impacted his personal style. With just the melody notes written, and a knowledge that a C chord was merited at the end of a particular tune, one might put the intuitively obvious puch C chord on the C row in play, and then wonder why it doesn't quite sound like Kimber. The anglo is all about choices, and with most seasoned players there is a pattern to their own choices...it isn't random behavior of course.

 

Not to stray off topic too much (I hope!), but I've noticed several comments over the last few months about chorded arrangements for harmonic playing, and how useful it might be to have more of them written out for anglo. I enjoy seeing all the notes written out, especially when lovely countermelodies and bass runs are put together...and appreciate very much when someone shows which button choices they have made. Piano players learn music largely by learning arrangements of others, whilst anglo players usually hear the melody by ear and are left to piece it all together on there own.

 

Does anyone else out there share that appreciation for written arrangements?

[Nigel]

I would love to see some chords, counter melodies or bass runs written down in conventional notation. So many people say that the anglo is great for learning by ear, but my ears do not seem to agree! I can pick out a simple melody, if I'm lucky and if it is in C or G, but it is a slow process. I am completely lost when it comes to anything more complex. Without the opportunity to watch or talk to other players it is a struggle. I appreciate that one of the beauties of the anglo is the ability to develop an individual style and not be a slave to written music, but for a beginner it would be very helpful to have some examples to give me a start. Otherwise my style might end up being more individual than I would want it to be.

[Boney]

I would love to see some chords, counter melodies or bass runs written down in conventional notation.

Well, when I made my simple arrangement of "Whistling Rufus" for Anglo, I did it on a sheet music program, so I can post my Whistling Rufus sheet music. No button numbers, but no surprises there, I think -- if anything is confusing, just ask. Of course the exact rhythm and "bounce" aren't notated, and I'll generally make a few variations whenever I play it. Here's my own audio rendition of Whistling Rufus (as on Henk's Recorded Tunes Link Page). Oh, and I play the first part once through (use the first ending) after the second part and before the third (that's in the original 1899 sheet music too).

[Charlotte]

Why not attack the task separately from learning to play the concertina for a while? Consult with music teachers or music book shops about basic theory books and spend 10 minutes a day studying "traditional" music notation.

 

 

Exactly my approach. I found this site with interactive drills I find of use....http://www.emusictheory.com/aboutStudent.html (I think this site is only of interest for people new to basic theory. )

 

charlotte

[Dan Worrall]

I would love to see some chords, counter melodies or bass runs written down in conventional notation.

Well, when I made my simple arrangement of "Whistling Rufus" for Anglo, I did it on a sheet music program, so I can post my Whistling Rufus sheet music. No button numbers, but no surprises there, I think -- if anything is confusing, just ask. Of course the exact rhythm and "bounce" aren't notated, and I'll generally make a few variations whenever I play it. Here's my own audio rendition of Whistling Rufus (as on Henk's Recorded Tunes Link Page). Oh, and I play the first part once through (use the first ending) after the second part and before the third (that's in the original 1899 sheet music too).

Boney,

 

Nice job; it is a wonderful arrangement. I especially like the short unidirectional bass runs. These are the sort of thing I find hard to remember when I'm first trying to build an arrangement for myself. I might find a nice one by chance, think "aha!", but by the next time I pick the instrument up, I've forgotten what the 'aha' was all about. Written notation is a great memory boost.

 

It also is great to see the individuality put into this or any arrangement. Even though much of the chording is pre-ordained, things like the bass runs and the octave runs are not, and that is all part of the artistry. Button tablature or none, written arrangements can be little gems with lots of value for other players.