seanc

There are a lot of 50+ button Crannes and Maccans out there. But specific to the Hayden system.. At least IMO.. a 37b (in the range something like an Elise is in) is great, if you want to play in C/ F/ G but after that as you move away from C, you get really limited. All concertinas run into issues as you move away from their "natural" center.. IME.. paying in B or C# (maj) on the english or Crane tends gets wonky as the relative positions of notes get shifted. and takes more thinking about those "black: keys are now "white" keys, etc.. but at least on the systems the notes are there.

I would really urge you to look at one of the Jay concertinas. Not sure what your price range is. I know you said you have been able to get away with the 37. But as you get better and your repitoire grows you are very likely to really wish you opted for more range. the way a Hayden is set up. 37 buttons is extremely limiting. It is near impossible to play anything farther from C than 2 sharps or flats.

Question.. And this may NOT be practical at all.. But what if you used the Bowden cables through out? IF you did that then would the need of positioning of the reeds in relation to buttons go away? Could you then, potentially, extend the range way down in the bass as the relative positions are no an issue? And might you also be able to have substantially more notes on either side? Possibly a radial pattern where the lowest reeds are along the outer most edge. and possibly add in highest notes where possible and have concentric hexagons/ octagons of reeds?

that case is really amazing

Less than a year ago. I picked up a TT Aeola from Button Box. All gone through, serviced, with warranty and returns ability for @ $3500. Not knocking the price. As market may have changed since all of this inflation. Just throwing it out there as a point of reference.

There is a lot to consider here. And a lot of variables. But, one thing to seriously consider is tradition. look, feel, history, etc.. If the aim is to play polka music at your house. or a solo busker gig. Or, assemble your own polka band. Then all is open and you can do what ever you want. But, if the intent is to learn a bunch of tunes and then join an existing band a concertina may very well be a non starter. Hypothetically.. If an existing polka band were looking for a "bass". A PhD and professor of Polka history and performance applies for the gig. but, he plays only a synth and expects to dress in a space suit? Even though he may be perfectly capable of nailing every sound, nuance, grace note and expound on the derivation of every song. Or, a bass guitar player is 100% capable, knows all the material has good gear and a fantastic sound. But the gig goes top a guy that has been playing a short time shows up with a beat up Upright that has holes in it. But arrives at the gig in lederhosen a feathered cap and his own liter beer mug. Presentation, Look and feel, can be as important if not more important than ability and sound.

It may be possible with any concertina….. but, I would look really hard at what most polka bands use. Their standard set lists. Keys the songs are in. And also, what part(s) you want to play. For example… if your intention would be to take the tuna role, you might look at a baritone English. For trumpet, sax, clarinet, possibly an English. If you plan to take the role of accordion, with melody on the right and oom pan on the left.. maybe an Anglo, depending on keys and chords. Or possibly a duet. but if that is the role you intend to take you may best off with a piano accordion. even if you are able to play the parts on whatever concertina you pick. It is very possible that polka bands may be turned off, or resistant to add “non traditional” instruments.

I am not sure if it is possible. But all questions of math distance and frequency aside. If there were a way to put the mic/ db meter inside the earphones to get a better and more accurate reading would be useful. as mentioned. Having the meter directly next to the source is definitely problematic. 90db is generally not considered to be dangerous or problematic. Given the OP’s concern and threshold limitations. Getting an accurate reading seems pretty important.

Yes. Check the buy sell forum. saguaro_squeezer

Apologies for being obtuse. but is the issue the level of the concertina? Or, is more a question of your hearing and needed threshold? I understand they are a combination. But, is the root cause that you need to be under a certain perceived db level? depending on what you are doing. Maybe you can do what a lot of shooters do and wear foam plugs. And the put your headphones over them? Solutions of baffles may make sense. but, you may just opt for more earmuffs for now. And once you are ready to move up. Look specifically for something like a brass reed and wood end box. There can be a huge volume difference between wood, metal and plastic. I had girlfriend related volume issues with my metal ended Wheatstone. Once I picked up a wood ended model, most of the whining went away. Some boxes are just plain LOUD.

I think it is more like a pair of shoes. Unlikely, that my shoes for you. Or yours fit me. maybe I have average size hands and am either stupid, stubborn or ( more likely) both. But, I have only used the stock set ups and adapted myself to the instrument rather than swapping anything.

I think you might ask saguaro squeezer. Iirc he had 2 small cranes for sale. if that is the direction you want to go, it may be worth asking him.

HOLY ZOMBIE THREAD RESURRECTION, BATMAN! 7 Years later!!

Wouldn't you be better off to use something like a plywood. or other laminated type of thing from a stability point of view? I have heard from many guitar luthiers that single pieces of wood are prone to warpage, shrinkage etc. Maybe the reed pan has enough bracing to stabilize it? But I would think also that using a single log/ piece would possibly have much more variation/ inconsistencies sonically? You could easily have Hot/ Cold spots due to the nature of a single piece (knots, graining and such) . Or, you could easily end up with a "good" sounding piece or a "bad" sounding piece. But, you would not really know either way until the build was completed.

Vince, it may be helpful if you let us know know specifically what kind of info you are looking for. What I would say (in my limited experience) is that of the "major/ common" duet systems (Hayden/ maccan/ Crane). You are likely to find that Crane is the least popular. Hayden is the current "modern" offering. And could be ramping up with modem builders making current instruments. This will generally, lead to more learning resources and teachers. Maccan, which ( I think) was the most popular in the Concertina heyday. You will find the most offerings of instruments at the least pricing. Crane, tends to be the black sheep. Offerings are slim. Learning resources are not plentiful. BUT, at least to me coming from EC. The system just makes sense and clicks. And I feel like I am making progress. And I really like it. If you are looking for a Crane, Look here, Facebook, Barley corn, etc. But, those will all be vintage/ old and used instruments, so quality, use/ abuse, repairs will all be part of the journey. You may seriously consider looking at Edward Jay's modern offerings. It is NOT traditional. But would be a brand new instrument. And That does have a lot going for it. As Cranes tend to be difficult to find. Putting down the money up front (rather than starting cheap and trading up) may be a better short/ medium term solution.

I am definitely finding quite a lot of times where due to lacking lows. And then inverting chords. I am running the left hands chords into the melody line. Or just as often, I am diving onto the left side I find myself diving onto the left side to complete right hand chords.

There are all valid considerations . but IMO. Hands down the biggest advantage to more buttons is if you are reading and playing from a sheet is to be able to play as written. and there is far less chance of getting lost as you are not trying to transpose on the fly. There are many instances where I find a 5-1-3, moving to a 1-3-5 and then 3-5-1. Or 7-1-3, 7-1-4 to 7-1-5. Places where flipping just does not sound right. And numerous times where doing a walk down is what you really need 5,4,3,2,1 not 5,4,3,9,8.

From my limited experience. I think that after establishing your repitoire, playing style and kind of getting an idea of how you play your chord voicings. I think that you may come to an ideal amount of buttons. but, until then, at least for me, I think I am always wanting more buttons. Speaking from a 55b crane experience. I am always wanting it to go lower on both sides. Ideally, I’d like to see both sides go down from C to a G.

Just listened.. found it interesting on one hand. But overall, disjointed and annoying. kind of reminds me of those late 60s Beatles and others records. Where many times they were just too focused on “hey we got STEREO! Look what we can do!”

What is this? It looks like a Maccan on the left and a Crane on the right.

I would say.. with an EC. You can play chords, and you can get some really complex chords. Or, you can easily, plug in an EC for anywhere a violin, viola could go. but, depending on the nature of what accompaniment means here. It is really difficult to do both at the same time well. And that is where the duets shine.

All systems have plus and minus. Depending on what you want to do, music wise a duet can be the most versatile. BUT, if you intend to sing along with it. You really need to be aware of what key(s) are needed to support vocals. with the small duets, especially something like an Elise. Due to layout and number of buttons. You may find that it is not adequate to support vocals. The more sharps and flats you need (example singer is most comfortable in Eb or Ab) the more limited you will find them to be. but everything is a trade off. And you just need to take the plunge. It sounds like you have done a ton of research. But there is a point where analysis paralysis hits. It may be that is where you are now. You just need to realize that what ever you buy now, is not likely to be what you’ll be playing down the road. grab something. Practice, learn and with some experience you will be able to make a more informed decision when you trade up.

Not to steer this way off topic… but based on my (admitted) limited experience. I don’t understand the hate for the late period 50-60s Wheatstones. The one I owned and the few I have tried have been really nice.

Why not just take the brass handle you have have and wrap it with leather or paracord? You keep the brass look and give it a little easier carry. As an upside. it is easily undone/ changeable. And very cheap to experiment with to find the right fit.

You should be able to use it.. A lot depends on the size of the case and clearances you have. But, if it were me, I would opt for closed cell foam. it is easy to cut, to a more fitted shape. stack it up in layers and more thickness on top and bottom. More protection in terms a shock, and less particles to get inside of everything.