High quality concertina made of all man-made composites/synthetics?

[m3838]

Thinking that Plastic material will save the environment is silly. I guess nobody is thinking that. If the two piece mold for the durable and inexpensive instrument not an issue, than there is no issue at all. As been noted many times before makers are not interested in producing cheap playable instruments. It's not as rewarding as to make one of a kind artifact.

[Woody]

If you got a breakdown of the components it should be possible to arrive at an approximation of the instrument's ecofootprint using published data.

Seems to me that the result could depend significantly on who published the data.

Well there's obviously likely to be some differences between assessments and it depends upon the boundaries applied but there has been a lot of academic effort over a period of years looking at what goes into producing each material including the amount of fossil fuel energy and pollution caused. The result will also be based upon averages, so it would only be an indicator, but it would enable the pollution ecofootprint of individual products to be compared against each other as long as the same source tables were used for all cases. After all an ecofootprint is at the end of the day just a tool for comparison used to inform choice.

[Woody]

Thinking that Plastic material will save the environment is silly. I guess nobody is thinking that.

"Plastic" is just a name for a group of materials. Used intelligently many can be good for the environment. Unfortunately for a lot of the things they tend to get used for at the moment they become a source of environmental damage and pollution.

[JimLucas]

As been noted many times before makers are not interested in producing cheap playable instruments. It's not as rewarding as to make one of a kind artifact.

Is Wim Wakker not a "maker"? So was Rich Morse. (To name but two.)

Wim makes high-end, individual instruments. He is also responsible for the production -- and even existence -- of the Jackie and Jack Englishes, Rochelle anglo, and Elise duet, which are the cheapest concertinas of reliable quality today.

 

Rich is responsible for the Albion Englishes and the Ceili anglos, both excellent and standardized instruments of good quality at reasonable prices ("reasonable", as in "a relatively small profit margin").

 

Both of these spent years (at least in Rich's case, decades) and thousands (probably tens of thousands or more) of dollars/euros, specifically researching ways to reliably produce decent instruments more cheaply, and the above-mentioned models are the best they were able to accomplish.

 

Okay, they did throw in additional criteria: durability and ease of repair. And I think their respective prices reflect the instruments' expected lifetimes. Neither was interested in producing a "playable" instrument that would be unplayable after only a year or two of use.

 

It's true that some people get personal satisfaction from hand-crafting an instrument (others get it from bungee-jumping, breeding roses, racing horses, or trading in the stock market), but that's not the only reason for doing so. Mass production methods are economical only if one can produce and sell masses of instruments. So far there has been no indication that that is possible for the sorts of concertinas that we're talking about.

 

But Misha, I think you're badgering the wrong group of individuals here. There are people in the world who are motivated not by a love of the concertina, but by a love of producing, promoting and selling masses of an item, regardless of its utility: e.g., pet rocks, various toys, and -- the latest that I've heard of -- deep-fryers for turkeys. Yet they don't seem to have shown much interest in the concertina. Why not? Have they considered it and decided that it's really not as easy and profitable as you imply? If it's just that they're not yet aware of the concertina and its potential in this regard, then I think you should be directing your efforts toward them, not us.

[bellowbelle]

Actually, what I will probably do is someday get an old, 'vintage' concertina. I've seen some I certainly like, at the Button Box. Those are already made and just need to be placed in loving homes!

 

That's not to say I'd never go for a new one, but, realistically speaking, I probably won't get many more concertinas in this lifetime.

 

I love the Morse Albion I play, don't regret choosing it at all.

[jggunn]

Well, the S-Wave Midi is made entirely of synthetics.

[david_boveri]

I remember the Dippers telling me about a concertina that had been made from some plastic material, probably Perspex, and it sounded terrible!

 

You need something with similar harmonic resonanses (spelling?) to wood but easier to work with and preferably cheaper.

 

Robin madge

 

good luck making such a material!

Edited November 30, 2009 by david_boveri

[m3838]

As been noted many times before makers are not interested in producing cheap playable instruments. It's not as rewarding as to make one of a kind artifact.

Is Wim Wakker not a "maker"? So was Rich Morse. (To name but two.)

Are you implying that for Wim and Rich it was more rewarding to make "cheap playable instruments"?

Is Albion/Ceili "cheap"?

So you named only one so far. The remark you quoted was taken from the post of one of the makers a few years ago.

 

Wim makes high-end, individual instruments. He is also responsible for the production -- and even existence -- of the Jackie and Jack Englishes, Rochelle anglo, and Elise duet, which are the cheapest concertinas of reliable quality today.

Are you speaking for many on the basis of just one example?

 

Rich is responsible for the Albion Englishes and the Ceili anglos, both excellent and standardized instruments of good quality at reasonable prices ("reasonable", as in "a relatively small profit margin").

"Reasonable" is rubbery term. Albion and Ceili are very expencive instruments, far from uniformly mass produced.

 

 

 

But Misha, I think you're badgering the wrong group of individuals here.

I'm not badgering anyone at all, nor I'm addressing wrong group of individuals. The question was about possibility of making the instruments out of composite materials. My quotation was not my opinion, but one of the makers during similar discussions some time ago.

 

Have they considered it and decided that it's really not as easy and profitable as you imply?

I'm implying what??

 

If it's just that they're not yet aware of the concertina and its potential in this regard, then I think you should be directing your efforts toward them, not us.

My efforts?? I'm not asking for composite materials, I'm satisfied with Jackie made of plywood. I'm not satisfied with single reed voice and 6-sidedness, but if I had free $6000 I'd ordered Bandoneon shaped double reed English from Harry Geuns years ago. He was very interested in the idea and told me he already has plans to make such instruments. His point was if I could come up with 10 people who want it, he would start production and the price would be somewhere $1000 +/-.