Jump to content


Photo

Anglo, English, Duet Subforums?


  • Please log in to reply
31 replies to this topic

#1 gwhlevy

gwhlevy

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 37 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Costa Mesa, California, (Orange County) USA

Posted 21 January 2004 - 02:39 AM

How about a subforum for each type of concertina that we all play? That way players could use these areas to discuss issues unique to their particular flavor of instrument. (Playing styles, key layouts, etc.)

Grant :^)

#2 Chris Timson

Chris Timson

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3490 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bradford on Avon

Posted 21 January 2004 - 02:52 AM

For me, this would be a specialisation too far as you lose the element of serendipity from reading the experiences of others who play other systems. I suspect for most of us it will mean reading 3 fora covering much the same ground instead of 1. However I could live with it if it happened, though I wouldn't like it.

Chris

#3 JimLucas

JimLucas

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10128 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 21 January 2004 - 03:26 AM

The trouble with separate Forums for each instrument type is that the Forum structure is a single fixed hierarchy, with no cross-indexing. With two independent structures, it would be difficult to know where to look for -- or post -- something on, e.g., "Teaching & Learning" "Anglo". Currently you know that you should look under "Teaching & Learning" for a Topic that contains the word "anglo"... and maybe for more general themes, too.

It's far from ideal, and people don't necessarily always post items where you might expect them, but at least you wouldn't have to look both under "Teaching" for "anglo" and under "Anglo" for "teaching",... and even under "English" and "Duet" for comments that may be more generally applicable, but which occurred as parts of instrument-specific Topics.

#4 Kurt Braun

Kurt Braun

    Chatty concertinist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 188 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Baton Rouge, Louisiana

Posted 21 January 2004 - 12:21 PM

I think this is a great idea. At least a subfolder for duets. I'd like to go even deeper -- Cranes!

#5 JimLucas

JimLucas

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10128 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 21 January 2004 - 02:20 PM

I think this is a great idea.  At least a subfolder for duets.  I'd like to go even deeper -- Cranes!

Another "whooping" Crane player? Talk to me. (Don't bury your head in a sand hill.) :)

What sorts of things about Cranes do you want to discuss? Why not just start a "Crane" Topic under one of the other Forums? "Teaching & Learning", perhaps?

#6 Kurt Braun

Kurt Braun

    Chatty concertinist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 188 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Baton Rouge, Louisiana

Posted 21 January 2004 - 04:01 PM

It isn't so much what I'd like to discuss as it is who perspective I like to have access to. I'm mostly interested in the perspective of people who play duets, or Cranes, more or less exclusively -- people who have choosen the duet as the primary tool to express themselves musically. To me, that is my journey and I'd like to share it will fellow travelers.


On the saxophone (saxontheweb) forum there are categories for alto, tenor, bari. They also have categories for different genres (clasical, jazz, etc.) The point is that the three breakouts of Duets, Anglos and English is a reasonable request


This isn't the first time I've read a decent post here only to see it quickly challenged by one or more of the regulars (curiously labeled "experts") as a bad idea. Clearly this is not a one man, one vote environment. Nevertheless, my vote is that the idea is reasonable and deserves open consideration to the advantages of such a scheme.

#7 Chris Timson

Chris Timson

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3490 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bradford on Avon

Posted 21 January 2004 - 05:40 PM

This isn't the first time I've read a decent post here only to see it quickly challenged by one or more of the regulars (curiously labeled "experts") as a bad idea.  Clearly this is not a one man, one vote environment.  Nevertheless, my vote is that the idea is reasonable and deserves open consideration to the advantages of such a scheme.

You are wrong, this is a "one man, one vote" forum, and Paul is the man - the vote is his. In this benevolent dictatorship you can be sure that Paul has shown no favoritism to any individual, he just doesn't work that way, to our benefit.

I have said that I don't care for the proposal, and I don't. I'm not saying that it is unreasonable - I would have said so if I thought so, but I don't. But I do disagree with it. In the end, Paul will make up his mind based on the arguments and his own opinion. Like it or not (and I am not unhappy with it) that's the way it works. And for what its's worth I too find the "advanced member" tag currently attached to my name somewhat invidious. But I don't have a vote on that!

Chris

#8 JimLucas

JimLucas

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10128 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 21 January 2004 - 05:45 PM

I'm mostly interested in the perspective of people who play duets, or Cranes, more or less exclusively -- people who have choosen the duet as the primary tool to express themselves musically.

That would exclude several of us, including me. The English is my "main squeeze", and I'm a relative latecomer to the anglo and duet(s). So far my preference in duets is the Crane, and I've been experimenting with different styles and techniques on it. Chris T. plays anglo, but recently got a Crane. Pontus T. is also an anglo player who has been working on the Crane for about a year. Leslie L. also plays English, plus I believe some on both Crane and Maccann. There are others.

This isn't the first time I've read a decent post here only to see it quickly challenged by one or more of the regulars (curiously labeled "experts") as a bad idea.

Who, specifically, has been labelled an "expert" by whom?

So far Chris Timson and I are the only ones who have expressed our lack of enthusiasm for this idea, but I don't believe either of us has either "challenged" it or called it anything like "bad". We have merely pointed out what we believe might be difficulties. I have done the same with the existing Forum structure.

Clearly this is not a one man, one vote environment.

Absolutely not. If Paul and Ken decide to add the requested new Forums, they will do so, otherwise not. It is their show. The rest of us, "expert" or not, can only express our opinions.

Nevertheless, my vote is that the idea is reasonable and deserves open consideration to the advantages of such a scheme.

I agree. I, for one, am pleased that you are expressing your opinion. I wish more people would. In this context, disinterest is nearly the same as a "no" vote.

#9 gwhlevy

gwhlevy

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 37 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Costa Mesa, California, (Orange County) USA

Posted 21 January 2004 - 09:00 PM

Thanks for your input everyone!

I just was thinking it might be nice to be able to discuss playing my Hayden with other Hayden players without "bothering" players of other concertina systems. But, hey, it is a good idea to be able to see posts of others who play other systems. They, too, have applicable things to say!

(I love being able to bounce ideas off other people's heads!)

Grant :^)

Edited by gwhlevy, 21 January 2004 - 09:01 PM.


#10 Kurt Braun

Kurt Braun

    Chatty concertinist

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 188 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Baton Rouge, Louisiana

Posted 21 January 2004 - 09:10 PM

Tim and Jim,

I was over reading your less than enthusiastic responses to the idea. Sorry.

My point is this. I don't play much Irish music. I'm only moderately interested in concertinas themselves (collecting, history, minute facts of construction and maintenance). I *am* interested in people who play concertinas of any kind and I'm very grateful to have this forum, though I mostly just read it. I generally stay out of the History, and so on subforums. I find it helpful to have them because I don't have to wade through those posts unless I am really in the mood.

Perhaps the problem is that while it it possible to talk about concertina conctruction, collecting, history, it is either too difficult or impossible to discuss in a meaningful way, playing concertinas or concertina music or the experiences of learning, playing and performing. When these sorts of posts do appear, they seem to be centered on anglo/English players of Irish music. In my gut, I think the player I'd like to hear from are here and not posting.

I'm still hopeful that the Learning and Playing forum will more meet my needs than the General Discussion. Those are the two I scan daily.

Finally, I wanted to support the original idea with some moderation. I don't want to argue too strongly for it, because it may very well may fall on its face. I *would* however, like to encourage anyone else who thinks it might be a good idea to speak up and say why. These may be people who have needs not met by the current sub categories --- people who do not currently post with regularity.

Again, sorry for the tone of the previous post.

Kind regards,

Kurt

#11 David Barnert

David Barnert

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3051 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Albany, NY, USA

Posted 21 January 2004 - 11:08 PM

I just was thinking it might be nice to be able to discuss playing my Hayden with other Hayden players without "bothering" players of other concertina systems.

You are aware (aren't you?) of the Hayden mailing list that Jax (Jack Woehr) has set up? It gets very little traffic and it's not nearly as much fun as this forum is, but it's available. I don't see the info on how to join on Jax's web site, but you can e-mail him through the site for the info:

http://www.well.com/~jax/index.html

Meanwhile, post a message anywhere on the existing c.net forum with the word "Hayden" in the title and I'm there. There are at least 3 or 4 Hayden players who post regularly here.

#12 Chris Ghent

Chris Ghent

    Heavyweight Boxer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1056 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Blue Mountains NSW

Posted 22 January 2004 - 01:30 AM

I would like to float a different idea, which is that the number of forums be reduced, rather than extended.

As it is, the general discussion is about very little. If you started a forum called "events" and also put the misplaced threads in the forums where they belong the general discussion forum would hardly exist. Meanwhile the other forums are so specific the thread can't be maintained without wandering off topic and theoretically belonging somewhere else.

Having it all in one forum would not mean everyone had to read everything, as the thread topic is usually sufficiently accurate to warn off disinterested parties.

regs

Chris

#13 JimLucas

JimLucas

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10128 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 22 January 2004 - 02:31 AM

I love being able to bounce ideas off other people's heads!

As long as it's just ideas. :)

#14 Chris Timson

Chris Timson

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3490 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bradford on Avon

Posted 22 January 2004 - 02:39 AM

(I love being able to bounce ideas off other people's heads!)

I have to admit, having ideas bounced off my head can hurt, but it's usually mind-expanding...

I would like to float a different idea, which is that the number of forums be reduced, rather than extended.

Completely agree, for the reasons you give. But happy to be convinced otherwise if the arguments are strong enough. And either way I am much more happy with the forum than I would be without it.
Cheers,

Chris

Edited by Chris Timson, 22 January 2004 - 02:47 AM.


#15 JimLucas

JimLucas

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10128 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 22 January 2004 - 04:26 AM

I would like to float a different idea, which is that the number of forums be reduced, rather than extended.

That's a considerable expansion of the subject beyond the specific proposal for separate Forums according to concertina type.
....So I've started a new Topic, "Forum Structure", to continue the broader discussion.

#16 Chris Ghent

Chris Ghent

    Heavyweight Boxer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1056 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Blue Mountains NSW

Posted 22 January 2004 - 08:02 AM

Jim,

thought I was right on topic, and while in this case it was a matter of thread subjects rather than forums, can't help but think you have proven my point somewhat by shifting to another thread.

Thread drift (including forum drift) is the most natural thing in the world, in fact it happens in all the best conversations, including concertina ones. It is a major source of discovery and education both here and in real life. I would rather lie back and let it happen than be constantly tidying up.

I'm not breathless over this, just thought the idea worth throwing in the mix.

And to answer your question, yes I would be happy with the forums all rolled into one, but then I tend to read it all (sad isn't it..?) I did have an idea of a larger community rather than a group of disparate ones. Either way, much as Chris said, I am happy enough that the forum exists.

Another glorious summers day here, 32C

regs

Chris

#17 Chris Timson

Chris Timson

    Ineluctable Opinionmaker

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3490 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Bradford on Avon

Posted 22 January 2004 - 11:23 AM

Another glorious summers day here, 32C

Oh now that's below the belt. I'm sorely tempted to report you for that. it's 4.20 in the afternoon here and it's going dark outside, raining, not too cold but they're promising snow next week. And you say 32, that remark could have cheerfully been consigned to another forum.

Yours shiveringly,

Chris

#18 Richard Morse

Richard Morse

    Heavyweight Boxer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1211 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Western Massachusetts, USA

Posted 22 January 2004 - 04:57 PM

Hah! And I was not going to respond, but to make you feel better Chris, right now it's 9F outside (that's -13C) and expected to get considerably cooler tonight. And actually, that's not so bad. In the last couple of weeks it's been down to -15F and if you include the windchill on a couple of particularly cold nights, -45F (which is almost the same in Celsius!).




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users