The Clare Set

[michael sam wild]

This may have been asked and answered before but I can't find it on a search.

I have been listening in more detail to one of the CDs -Irish Traditional Concertina Styles first recorded in the 70s.

 

A lot of the tunes played by the 12 players are in unusual keys.( compared with those commonly used) Is that because of the keys of the Anglos owned, recording quality or what?

 

I notice that some eg by Chris Droney seem to be in F ('ish') whereas on The Flowing Tide CDthey are in G

 

I realise keys like C and F were common but were they played on various keyed boxes or C/G which is common today. Or were they concertinas played to get on with older flutes and pipes? Has there been a loss of variety and more uniformity since these older players were active?

 

What type of concertina would people play to get the key of Fnatural?

 

 

Unless it's my CD player that's dodgy?

 

Mike

[JimLucas]

What type of concertina would people play to get the key of Fnatural?

If you take tunes that you normally play in D and G on a C/G box and play them with the same fingering on a Bb/F box, they'll come out in C and F.

[michael sam wild]

What type of concertina would people play to get the key of Fnatural?

If you take tunes that you normally play in D and G on a C/G box and play them with the same fingering on a Bb/F box, they'll come out in C and F.

 

 

Thanks Jim

 

Maybe there were boxes like this around for playing along with old tuned pipes. Made in England for singing accompaniment ?

 

have quite a few been concerted to C/G?

[JimLucas]

What type of concertina would people play to get the key of Fnatural?

If you take tunes that you normally play in D and G on a C/G box and play them with the same fingering on a Bb/F box, they'll come out in C and F.

Maybe there were boxes like this around for playing along with old tuned pipes. Made in England for singing accompaniment ?

 

have quite a few been concerted to C/G?

I'd advise you to Search for prior posts and threads -- there are many, -- but the search facility rejects "Bb" as having too few characters. Maybe a more subtle search (e.g., "other keys") would help? You might experiment.

 

I think Bb/F may have been the second most common key-pair for English-made anglos, but others here know more than I. As for why they were made in those keys, you should not assume that the majority of concertinas were used for the same purposes 50 or more years ago as they are in Ireland and England today.

 

Edited to correct a careless error.

Edited August 7, 2009 by JimLucas

[Stephen Chambers]

I think Bb/Eb may have been the second most common key-pair for English-made anglos, but others here know more than I.

Jim,

 

I think you must mean Bb/F ? It seems to be the ideal pitch for an Anglo, not as sharp as C/G, but still with plenty of punch and carrying power - my late friend Paul Davies found it perfect for busking with.

 

But thank goodness the Salvation Army wanted all those Ab/Eb's too, or we'd have nothing to convert to G/D...

 

Mind you, Bb/Eb was the second most common key-pair for German-made Club accordions...

Edited August 6, 2009 by Stephen Chambers

[JimLucas]

I think Bb/Eb may have been the second most common key-pair for English-made anglos, but others here know more than I.

I think you must mean Bb/F ?

Absolutely!

That's another "oops!", and not even in the middle of the night. I guess it comes from trying to do concertina.net in the cracks between other things. I'm not a modern multi-tasker. Than again, I wasn't traumatized when Twitter stopped working for a while yesterday. I read about in in the news.

 

Anyway, I'll go back now and correct my erroneous post. Thanks, Stephen.

[michael sam wild]

I think Bb/Eb may have been the second most common key-pair for English-made anglos, but others here know more than I.

Jim,

 

I think you must mean Bb/F ? It seems to be the ideal pitch for an Anglo, not as sharp as C/G, but still with plenty of punch and carrying power - my late friend Paul Davies found it perfect for busking with.

 

But thank goodness the Salvation Army wanted all those Ab/Eb's too, or we'd have nothing to convert to G/D...

 

Mind you, Bb/Eb was the second most common key-pair for German-made Club accordions...

 

 

 

A nice 1930s Bb/Eb Hohner Erika accordion/melodeon is great for singing to. Played up and down the rows mainly like a D/G or C/F but you can get some other keys by cross row playing

[david fabre]

On "traditional music from East Clare", Marry McNamara plays several

tunes in C, F and related minor keys on a C/G Wheatstone.

The liner notes say that it is quite common in this area to play those

keys on a C/G.

I've practived some of these tunes. I find it easier to play in C than in D,

mainly because there is a "natural" fingering that you can use in any case without any

risk of twisting your fingers, contrary to playing in D.

Playing in F can be more difficult than in G, except that

many tunes in F miss the awkward Bb (when playing in G these tunes will

miss the C note ; think about it, there are many!)

 

David

[michael sam wild]

Ispoke to Neil Wayne last night at our session at the Royal at Dungworth near Sheffield. Neil said they didn't keet detailed records of the types and keys of the concertinas in those days (the 70s). Most people were playing by themselves or in low key sessions with other instruments so would fit in with what they had or what was going on. This was when traditional music had been through a 'low' period and before the latest revival of interest and wide popularity of C/G instruments

[michael sam wild]

I spoke to Neil Wayne last night at our session at the Royal at Dungworth near Sheffield. Neil said they didn't keep detailed records of the types and keys of the concertinas in those days (the 70s), or of the tune keys, when they did the recordings. Most people were playing by themselves or in low key sessions with other instruments so would fit in with what they had or what was going on. This was when traditional music had been through a 'low' period and before the latest revival of interest and wide popularity of C/G instruments.

 

I'm sorry the sleeve notes weren't updated with a bit more info on the reissue of the CDs. Maybe we could do something to fill in the gaps on this forum.

Edited August 12, 2009 by michael sam wild