synchopepper Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 Questions about this interesting concertina - From it's size is it a baratone or base? What are the ends so thick? Why are there "manufactured holes" in the bellows? Why would all notes not work in one direction of the bellow? Is it perhaps single action? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 Questions about this interesting concertina - From it's size is it a baratone or base? What are the ends so thick? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It is hard to know just from the photos, though I suspect that it may be a bass. It would need a lot of room for those large reeds, which may be "double-decked" inside. Why are there "manufactured holes" in the bellows? Why would all notes not work in one direction of the bellow? Is it perhaps single action? It is indeed single-action, and the holes in the bellows are the single-acting valves to allow it to "take a breath" rapidly between phrases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Harrison Posted March 28, 2005 Share Posted March 28, 2005 Can any-one tell me the difference between a bass and a contra-bass ? Is it simply the range it goes down ? Thanks Robin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 Can any-one tell me the difference between a bass and a contra-bass ? Is it simply the range it goes down ?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> It is based on the violin family, so a treble has the range of a violin, a tenor has that of a viola, a bass is a cello, and the contra is a double-bass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Harrison Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 .............where does that leave the tenor treble and baritone treble concertina ? Were they later developments ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted March 29, 2005 Share Posted March 29, 2005 .............where does that leave the tenor treble and baritone treble concertina ? Were they later developments ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The baritone, one octave lower than the treble, was an early development but does not fit into the "violin-based" family I was describing. A tenor-treble is simply an instrument that combines the range of a treble with that of a tenor, and a baritone-treble likewise adds the range of a baritone to that of a treble, but they seem to have developed only in the 1890's, and most were built in the early 20th century. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimLucas Posted March 30, 2005 Share Posted March 30, 2005 Questions about this interesting concertina - From it's size is it a baratone or base? I think not. Assuming that the button spacing is standard, the ends are only about 7" across the flats. A standard 48-button treble is 6-1/4" across, and my 64-button tenor-treble is 7½", while my 64-button baritone-treble is 8-5/8" and my 56-button bass is 9½". With 43 buttons, maybe it's a baritone, but I think it's more likely to be a single-action tenor made special for marching band use. It's not the first I've seen like that, even in a tenor range. Why are there "manufactured holes" in the bellows?Why would all notes not work in one direction of the bellow? Is it perhaps single action? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As Stephen said, it is single action, and the "manufactured holes" are one-way valves (I call them "gills") that allow the bellows to be opened out in a fraction of a second, so that the one-way action is very little handicap. What are the ends so thick? I'm not really sure, but it's a feature I've seen in a couple of other single-action tenors, as well as single-action concertinas of lower range. I would guess that it has something to do with greater volume, but I'm not sure. If extra-long reeds were used, it might be needed to give adequate room for them to vibrate (you might be surprised at how far the reeds actually swing when sounding), but that's almost pure speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Questions about this interesting concertina - From it's size is it a baratone or base? I think not. Assuming that the button spacing is standard, the ends are only about 7" across the flats. A standard 48-button treble is 6-1/4" across, and my 64-button tenor-treble is 7½", while my 64-button baritone-treble is 8-5/8" and my 56-button bass is 9½". With 43 buttons, maybe it's a baritone, but I think it's more likely to be a single-action tenor made special for marching band use. It's not the first I've seen like that, even in a tenor range.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I did say that It is hard to know just from the photos, and the perspective makes it very hard to estimate the dimensions, but it is obviously in a "stretched" shape and the overall length appears to be about 10 inches, so my money is still on it probably being a bass. I have asked the seller for measurements. What are the ends so thick?I'm not really sure, but it's a feature I've seen in a couple of other single-action tenors, as well as single-action concertinas of lower range. I would guess that it has something to do with greater volume, but I'm not sure. If extra-long reeds were used, it might be needed to give adequate room for them to vibrate (you might be surprised at how far the reeds actually swing when sounding), but that's almost pure speculation. As I mentioned, the reeds may be "double-decked" inside, that is to say, they may be in two layers in order to make the instrument more compact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimLucas Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I did say that It is hard to know just from the photos, and the perspective makes it very hard to estimate the dimensions, but it is obviously in a "stretched" shape and the overall length appears to be about 10 inches, so my money is still on it probably being a bass. I have asked the seller for measurements. I originally thought the apparent stretching was due to perspective, but more careful measurement of the two end pictures indicates the opposite, i.e., that it's more stretched than it appears to my eye. That would also be consistent with the stretched sides having two bolts, rather than one. In fact, my rough scaling indicates nearly 11½" point-to-point in the long direction. If it weren't stretched, that would convert to just over 10" across the flats, quite a bit more than the 7" that I still measure the short way, even when perspective-compensated (the disparities either side of the center line seem to cancel). Getting the actual measurements from the seller is good. Meanwhile, I've asked him/her to try to identify the lowest note, not just by pitch, but by octave. As I mentioned, the reeds may be "double-decked" inside, that is to say, they may be in two layers in order to make the instrument more compact.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> You have apparently seen such "double-decking". I haven't, but I'll take your word for it that they exist. I guess that could substantially reduce the size of the ends. Meanwhile, my comments were based on the fact that I have seen single-action tenors with deep ends, so I know that such a configuration doesn't have to be a bass. I hope we can find out more from the seller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 As I mentioned, the reeds may be "double-decked" inside, that is to say, they may be in two layers in order to make the instrument more compact.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> You have apparently seen such "double-decking". I haven't, but I'll take your word for it that they exist.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I have, and they do. I hope we can find out more from the seller. She has replied to me, but all she has said so far is : "Yes I will measure those for you. Thank you!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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