How do people play the anglo ? :):)

[Lorie Tracey]

Hello,

 

I really enjoyed reading the thread. I will have to read it again much closer in regards to playing the "A" either before or after the "D". I left the chart at work which allowed me to follow along quite well. Of course I only to a quick peek or two during my break. I also attended Noel's camp. I was the "stellar" raw beginner. hehe. I learned very much and am now progressing very nicely at home. In fact I am working on a tune currently called "The Glenbeigh" in 110 Irish concertina Tunes on page 60, # 94 CD 2, Track 39. This tune has a lot of the d to a with also G3 to B. (I ran our to the care and got the music and the chart that I remembered to grab as I raced out of work). My concern is that I have been playing the G3, #26 and then the B2#14, because I did not want to "chop". But now as I sit in front of the computer and reread the tread it seems as though it may be permissible to play the B2 #21, which does give the tune a bounce in a very important place. The second measure goes: G-26, then a B2? then a doted D3 -15 followed by a quarter B2? But here is the next rub, the next measure goes: C3, -14 E3 -15 then an A right now I can play either the A2 -13 or the A2 -10. then the B2 - 21, followed by a dotted C3 -14 doted quarter then an a eighth. This is pretty much the patterns in question. I know that the A immediately before the A# must be the A2 13. I think at least for me it would be impossible to play the A210 before the A#. I sure would like some help before I really learn the fingering any further. Hope this is not to confusing.

Edited September 8, 2011 by Lorie Tracey

[david_boveri]

Hello,

 

I really enjoyed reading the thread. I will have to read it again much closer in regards to playing the "A" either before or after the "D". I left the chart at work which allowed me to follow along quite well. Of course I only to a quick peek or two during my break. I also attended Noel's camp. I was the "stellar" raw beginner. hehe. I learned very much and am now progressing very nicely at home. In fact I am working on a tune currently called "The Glenbeigh" in 110 Irish concertina Tunes on page 60, # 94 CD 2, Track 39. This tune has a lot of the d to a with also G3 to B. (I ran our to the care and got the music and the chart that I remembered to grab as I raced out of work). My concern is that I have been playing the G3, #26 and then the B2#14, because I did not want to "chop". But now as I sit in front of the computer and reread the tread it seems as though it may be permissible to play the B2 #21, which does give the tune a bounce in a very important place. The second measure goes: G-26, then a B2? then a doted D3 -15 followed by a quarter B2? But here is the next rub, the next measure goes: C3, -14 E3 -15 then an A right now I can play either the A2 -13 or the A2 -10. then the B2 - 21, followed by a dotted C3 -14 doted quarter then an a eighth. This is pretty much the patterns in question. I know that the A immediately before the A# must be the A2 13. I think at least for me it would be impossible to play the A210 before the A#. I sure would like some help before I really learn the fingering any further. Hope this is not to confusing.

 

hey lorie,

can you please post a copy of the music, or minimally a link to the tune on thesession.org (that fits at least in that part)? it is hard to fully address your issue without seeing the music. or, if you could type up a rough ABC notation version, that would suffice. i do not normally recommend jumping in this situation, so i cannot determine whether i would do it myself without a full tune for context. until then...

 

i wrote a very detailed post, and there is a lot to it. one point that is easy to miss is that the natural movement of the fingers is an essential consideration in whether or not chopping is a good idea (but not the only consideration). moving outward, e.g. from the C to the G row, is not as efficient a movement as from the G to the C row. this is a problem, because you end up getting a sloppy, dull note or--worse--losing time! moving outward necessitates getting to the button and passing it up, so that the pad of the finger can get to the button (you can't press a button with the top of your nail). moving inwards, however, allows you to grab with a point higher on your finger, all the way up to the first joint (as in my picture). this means that there is less distance traveled, and that you can more easily position a playing surface ahead of time.

 

this is just an example of how jumping is not a good habit to get into, because there is just so much to consider! it is an easy way out if you are in the process of learning an alternate fingering and are not used to it, and can have disastrous results. my recommendation is when in doubt, master the alternate fingering BEFORE you try to permanently choose jumping between two buttons with the same finger. the worst thing that happens is you have flexibility.

 

i am not going to say that i never jump from f# (26) to pull B (21), but i would say that push B (14) is my preferred fingering in this situation. i did learn this from noel. f# to B on the same finger is EXCESSIVELY difficult to pull off in most situations, even in hornpipes and jigs. i do not really recommend it, nor would noel. pull B (21) to f# (26) is easier, but much less common; in this situation i would still advocate B (14) push.

[Lorie Tracey]

Thanks David,

 

I am rushing off to work, so I will see about the post of the music later tonight when I return. Have a great day. May be we can do a SKIPE lesson on this tune at some time.

[Azalin]

The way I interpreted Dave's post is that you still SHOULD NOT jump notes when learning and improving on concertina, but apply jumping at strategic places after you mastered playing without jumping. It seems to me that to jump some notes with good effect require lot of skill and practice, and should be avoided at early stages. That's the way I see it anyhow. I religiously try to play without jumping (in some rare cases I don't know a way around) but I feel Dave's post opened up some advanced technique to be explored.

[Michael Eskin]

Daiv,

 

I'm in completely agreement with you on your interpretation of Noel's occasional use of jump fingering, nice to see such a concise description.

 

Thanks for asking Noel specifically this question! I've found it very useful when learning from Noel to understand the "why" behind the "what". Knowing why and when he deviates from his own general guidelines to students is as interesting to me as the guidelines themselves, like you said it's all about shaping a specific sound or feel, but I think in performance Noel does far more than can be taught or codified.

 

Michael

[michael sam wild]

David B.I'm glad you did come back to it. Since the original thread a few years ago I've adapted quite a lot and now I have got my head round the Wally Carroll layout numbers it makes more sense! I will keep that chart to hand for these sortds of discussion.

 

For each tune it seems necessary to think out how to get a smooth flow for ornaments or for the best bellows direction the best lift and all the methods described have been helpful within the strictures of my 26 button Jeffries (which has only one c# pull on #16 button)

 

I have never thought about the virtue of the A pull on #13 as opposed to pull #10 this discussion has persuaded me to give it a go and to see whether it is useful.

 

 

I use the 'pull off' method you describe in going from c# pull (draw) to B pull so that's another tip to study.

 

 

I can see how to a beginner or someone who plays Anglo for other than ITM it is all a bit arcane but , in the absence of any regular instruction by skilled ITM players in my area, it is very helpful. My request for names of teachers in the UK has drawn a blank.

 

 

I'm finding it useful to plan my ornaments and then use runs in the same bellows direction on appropriate buttons whilst avoiding jumping te fence from row to row on the equivalent button.