papawemba
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Posts posted by papawemba
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My second impression: I hear that all buttons are not "equal". Some takes more air (not necessarily the higher or lower) or no sound coming out. I have a feeling the reason might be because it is brand new and reeds need to work themselves out...(hope so !). Angle of bellows might also have something to do with it...(but it is very sensitive then).
I added 2 more holes in the strap, right hand feels tighter/better now.
Wondering for the duet: Should the push/pull done with the right hand or left hand like a diatonic accordion ?
I find out the tune I was playing that "hurts" my right hand is played in harder part of the layout: the right side of the buttons layout which activate a lot the pinky (Unfortunately not possible in other key, so I leave that tune for the future :-) On second impression, the number of buttons is more than enough, at least for a beginner. More button would be harder to reach !!
Improvisation: I understand what Anglo-Irishman means, on the same row, you take any notes on the push/pull and won't sound out of tune ;-) After a while you can find the right note more easily... I tried both concertina this week end and had a lot of fun with Anglo, you are right completely different instrument. Yes some tune are much easier (and sound better) and the anglo :-) I shouldn't decide between one or the other, but have fun with both :-) Time will tell.
The Hayden is very intuitive for improvisation and also can have longer note….
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Thank you Don ! Like you the problem is more on the right hand, strange !!
Good idea, I will raise it a bit and see how it work... Else I just make one more hole...
Ha ha great idea for the commission, it is true there aren't too much video with the Elise concertina.
Let's hope for the Minstrel equivalent but I think the Duet sale is far behind the Rochelle and Jackie....maybe on day but now I have a few years with the Elise anyway !
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Hello,
I finally received the duet Elise from concertina connection J
“But he bought an anglo concertina 6 weeks ago !?” Yes that’s true but while I really liked the anglo concertina, I wanted something more versatile.
Have to say, I never looked too much for the duet concertina as I read somewhere it is harder to learn…
Then I saw this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djQCJqOSA-U which make me look again into the Elise !
I just play it a couple of hours and I am already impressed ! The overall quality seem very good for the price, even the strap leather does not look cheap.
The note on the right side sound very sweet, really like it !
The bass note on the left sound much better than expected (It does sound better with a note on the right hand than alone).
It is bigger than the 20 buttons anglo but that’s ok, I can deal with that.
It sound loud. Bellows is stiff, a good sign for a new concertina J
The bellows being stiff, I probably need to push/pull more than necessary…
After a few try: I could get quite easily a melody on the right hand, lots of fun. Need to play with the bellows (push/pull) to make the tune more soulful, this is more difficult than I though. While it is automatic on the anglo (you need the note !), I have to think about it on the duet. Again just 2 hours of playing. I tried some easy played slow Irish tune and I can see it is possible to mimic the anglo but probably not with the same result. Also tried a tune with one drone note, also easy as the drone finger does not have to move J It does take more air of course…
Also tried a waltz left hand rhythm and melody on right, this is also more difficult than I though ! (coming from an Anglo where I can play the tune “easily”).
Because of button placement I need to get used to. But I could get the tune (with error) after a while.
Also tried some counterpoint tune…just killing J I won’t have time ever for that.
I will stick to right hand tune trying to add soul, Drone tune, some blues and waltz, and other Beirut stuff J.
My concern/small issue is the strap length !! I screwed the pin to make the strap shorter, I have big hand and it is still too large. So of course it was not very comfortable…I guess I have to add more holes in the strap…but then I imagine 90% Elise owner have this problem !?
I can already see having both system (Anglo and duet) is not a good idea: Bellows technique, buttons placement, finding notes… So I still have to make a choice between those 2. And I’ll probably choose the Duet for the versatility and easier to improvise as many scales are possible. Coming from guitar world (first instrument), the possibility for improvisation is essential for me to keep interest. To play fast Irish tune, the anglo is definitively the right choice.
Nicolas
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Well played Jody Kruskal ! I really like that sound, round low notes.
Why not put some quality reeds like that on a cheaper concertina, would it make sense ?
Best
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He he Tarquin Biscuitbox, we had the same idea ! I don't have the Elise yet (but on its way here !), I let you know what I think.
As I understand from this thread, it is not possible to put "lower note" reeds (like Baritone) as chamber is too small. But it is possible to put same pitch reeds which is good news.
Meanwhile I saw on Connection site that they even explain how to do it !
Thanks inventor, I wonder if kit sold by Wim Waker are of better quality than the one already set in Elise...I'll probably ask someday when I feel like changings reeds lol First thing is to test the Elise….but it is always good to know it’s possible to change reeds in the future !
Nicolas
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Thank you RP3 for the clarification ! (Personally I am not looking for a Dippers concertina
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Can't help but I have the same question :-)
If I buy a cheap concertina like the Elise (duet) from connection, will I be able to change reeds to a better quality reeds ? And where to find them :-)
What concertina do you imply ?
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That is crazy !! Apparently it was sold for $6,495.95, with no description except this "One of the reeds came loose inside and needs to be opened and reattached.".
It's true that I don't really know the value of "dipper" …What justify that price !?
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Hey TimTim....I already ordered the Elise, I can't wait !!! (about 6 weeks to get here grrr).
In Concertina range, this seem the perfect instrument for me. Unfortunately, I don't have much time to learn a new instrument and the Hayden layout is very intuitive and easy (same shape of chords fingering all around the 2 side !! Never heard of this isomorphic layout before).
I can easily see myself playing around some simple "medievalesque" melody with a drone note :-)
The video above is just awesome, I get back to it a lot !
Yes I did some research and find out exactly there are no middle range for the duet...but that's ok because concertina is kind of my second instrument and won't have time to invest a lot !
Agree with the app, that was a little tease ;-) But still I don’t' like the continuous exchange between left/right side...I find that stressful lol.
Eventually we can meet so you can try the Elise to make up your mind ;-)
Nicolas
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Yes huge gap between those 2 ! (I can easily imagine lol)
Choice of tune by Edel Fox on OIAM are very good taste I think.
Have fun !
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Hello Gorwel,
Here is my opinion on the Wren 2. Keep in mind that I am a beginner and my only reference is 20 buttons Lachenal (for 3 weeks).
I can already say that comparing the Wren 2 and Lachenal would not be fair.
Should be compared to a similar concertina like the Rochelle...
From the outside, nothing special (probably like the Rochelle). Leather strap look kind of cheap but can easily be replace if necessary.
Size is good as you can see on the video (not huge) and not too heavy, again this the first 30 buttons in my hand so I can’t compare J
Buttons seem of good "quality" and I think won't stick like we often hear for Hohner concertina. I heard a small click sound but nothing special or disturbing.
Below is kind of stiff but probably because it is brand new. It has better air volume than my Lachenal: For the same tune, I reach the extremity with my Lachenal and was good with the Wren 2.
Sound is more synthetic than Lachenal, again it is brand new so I think reeds will soften with time.
It is louder than my Lachenal which was a good point. My lachenal sounded pretty shy after...(So I tend to go back to the Wren :-)
Middle range note sound quite good and with an acceptable response/sensitivity.
I (really) didn't like the lower note, and you need to push the button all the way to hear something.
But beginner tune mostly play in middle range. I never use higher note (my ears !) so I can't really tell.
Overall, I think this concertina is not junk (like Chinese stuff, again but reading internet, not really my opinion) but is not as good as my expectation (coming from Lachenal). It as a 3 years warranty which is a strong point and probably a gage of solidity.
The Wren does not have many concurrent so I would say at this price for a very first concertina, this should do it !
The most important aspect for me is the sound and sensitivity. Since I already have a Lachenal at home...I'll stick to it the warm tone and good sensitivity.
Hope that help !
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So I am not interested in Rochelle anymore !
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Thanks TimTim !
I already have an Anglo Lachenal 20 buttons which I really enjoy J I can’t afford a 30 buttons so I was looking for the Rochelle…This week end, I discovered on internet the Elise duet Hayden concertina, I have to say I am completely attract to it lol (even just to learn this tune ! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djQCJqOSA-U).
Yes I already subscribe to OIAM, nice tune there ! (for anglo).
For the Jackie, I didn’t consider it… I have an app called “Englitina” on my smartphone, great app which is a virtual English concertina . After a few try, I had severe headache J Could not find the note for an easy tune and even when I got it down (with many mistakes), my brain completely forgot it in next try J So not intuitive to me.
Best
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Thank TimTim ! I also live in Brussel ;-)
That is great news, I can't believe google never showed me Harry Geuns site !!?? This is indeed great news, I will certainly buy it there.
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Hello,
I like to buy a used Rochelle concertina (in good condition of course
).I live in Europe (Belgium) so I prefer a seller from Europe, cheaper postage...
Thank you !
Nicolas
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As I read on the internet, Rochelle is probably a sure buy for beginner.
I am myself a complete beginner (max 3 weeks) ! I found a nice Lachenal 20 button and decide to go for it (better resale value in case I am not sure about concertina).
I like it so much that I decide lastweek to order the Wren 2 (30 buttons) as a second concertina …I’ll probably receive it this week and I let you know what I think if you haven’t decided yet ;-)
Best
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This topic can be closed, not searching for it anymore...But I can't delete this thread
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Hello, I am really interested in this DVD, price is high but I don't mind if the teaching and information is valuable for me
Unfortunately, I don't find many information...help ! :-)
Reading this thread, I know now there are some embellishment which is what I am looking for.
But I am curious about the tunes, can anyone provide the list of tune in that DVD ?
Thank you for your help !
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Hello cryptastix !
I wonder did you get the book at the end ? If yes, do you like it ?
Thank you !
Nicolas
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I finally had time to try it
What a great instrument !!! I am already addict.
I really like the small size/loudness ratio. With a warm sound coming out, a real pleasure.
I can see how higher model can improve the thing, but I am very happy with this student model.
Comparing to diatonic accordion (which I tried), I think concertina is somehow more expressive.
I have a booklet written by a French diatonic accordion player (in French only) named Gilles Poutoux.
He decide to not use the left Chord bass button anymore because you need to fit the right hand melody to the bass rhythm and this kind of kill the expression you can inject (like “uneven” playing, short/long/…). I though he was 100% right. And concertina bring just that ! I love it. I confess I did try a simple waltz rhythm on left hand and melody on right hand…that sound great on concertina, very “cute”
Nice to eventually do both. I had a Castagnary Giordy once which sound close to a concertina but I much prefer this warm sounding Lachenal.I did try some beginner Irish tune (Maggie in the woods and Sporting paddy), a great enjoyment
Can’t wait to learn it by heart, I just don’t have much time
For my next step, I’ll probably go with "Frank Edgley’s How to Play the Anglo Concertina" DVD which I heard was a very good resource for beginner.@ Phil: Thank you, I agree with you ! What is Le voyageur ?
Nicolas
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Thank you Don ! Reading your post, I can't wait to put my hand on it even more.
Unfortunately, I am going on holiday now so I'll have to wait a little longer...patience patience.
best
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Mikefule, very sorry about that. I have to confess, I really laughed reading this
Of course this was not done on purpose.I can easily imagine you worked hard to get there ! I can never imagine getting to that level (I know from experience with a diatonic accordion, it quickly become very hard...). I see that the concertina in your video has 5 folds, so it is possible to work out complex tune out of it (probably a good push/pull managment
). I guess slow air gets much harder.Nicolas
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Yes you are 100% right, it is bone and not Ivory.
My mistake ! Sorry about that. I will edit my post.
And I am happy it is not Ivory !!!
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Thank you everyone for your help ! It comfort me in my choice and I'll probably let you know what I think after a few try...
Unfortunately I don't have much time (full day job and second job with children at home), but I really want to learn it (I'll go for OIAM to learn first tune with charming Edel Fox ;-)
Yes I see what you mean Heavyweight Boxer ! Same thing for guitar, a "trashy" guitar can play wonderful blues ! Each guitar gives a different feeling and offer a different style of playing...I guess it is the same with Concertina, except much more $$$ for a collection ;-)
Good advice learning the scale ! I'll check the Teaching and learning forum to find a good source (let me know if you got one ;-)
Wow you can play very well !! Complex tune !! Bravo :-) I see that I have years and years of learning curve with a 20 buttons :-)
Nicolas
Concertina Connection Elise – First Impression
in General Concertina Discussion
Posted
Concerning my question "Wondering for the duet: Should the push/pull done with the right hand or left hand like a diatonic accordion ?",
Never mind, from the youtube video in initial post, I see the left hand is the chosen one :-) So i'll go with that.
You are right rebus ! That is the main problem with the Hayden duet. Eventually the Elise can be tuned up with new buttons, new reeds, new bellow...