Choosing The 'right' Buttons On Anglo...

[david_boveri]

Looking at the original question, I think maybe part has been missed. Azalin had played mainly c row left and c & g on right, maybe using about 7-8 buttons for 95% of the time. When he wanted to play a G or B etc., he had mostly one option and it was 'easy' to train the muscle memory to get that note.

 

However, when you are playing across the rows and varying whether you use a push or pull for a given note, it gets harder for the brain to handle. You really should be able to play music without having to think too much about it, just like speech. I often find myself playing on one row or the other when I should have switched - my autopilot tends to favour that as a means to hitting the note rather than switching to another row.

 

But to resolve this, I think it's all a matter of practice - you figure out what style of playing you like - you look at your tunes more slowly and see what is the most efficient way to play the phrases. You play these and over time they become second ature. Since music and ITM in particular is made up of many similar phrases and patterns of notes, it follows that the more tunes you learn, the more phrases fall under your fingers and the easiest way to play passages becomes second nature. That is why good musicians play so effortlessly and pick up new tunes so quickly on the fly .. they've heard it all before.

 

I too was getting some concertina lessons during the summer and I asked our tutor about their general approach to fingering a tune as I was looking the tunes we had done and what was suggested. Their approach seemed in the main to use the C row LH and C & G on RH as you described for the 'default' choice. I think this is because the C row is most comfortable to reach. However they would go to the G row LH or row of accidentals, frequently to hit a note for various reasons (1) the get a triplet running same direction insofar as poss. e.g. EF#G (top row), BCD etc. (2) to balance the air, reverse the bellows etc. and (3) for convenience, say you had just played B inside row LH, and the following notes were a d or e, you might just use the adjacent button to follow on etc. They also mentioned they rarely if ever used the A/G button on the G row, LH as it's a duplicate of the normal one - they would of course use the A/G on the top row as it offers a reversal.

 

that is not an across the row style. that sounds like what is commonly called "in the rows." both styles are valid. if you do one, the other seems unintuitive. A/G on the G row is quite useful if you use push D on the left hand, first button. if you use pull D, there is little reason to use third finger A. however, pull D makes it difficult to use second finger, pull A on the second button, right hand side. same with push E. so you have to end up swapping fingers or using an alternative button anyways, no matter what style you use.

 

edit:

 

it looks like i did not address your comment.

 

you just need to retrain your mind and your muscles. i agree that it should be as natural as speaking. for a non native speaker, chinese would not have the same ease as it would for a native. but after time, speaking chinese can become as natural as engilsh is to a native speaker of english. so it is with across the rows--which ever you are not used to is difficult. you may find it difficult to play across the row without thinking of it, but i find it difficult to play in the rows without planning beforehand.

 

as my example below shows, if you work hard enough, you can make fingering decisions on the fly. i often times chose to use a push C instead of pull so that i may hit a C chord. i do not make these sort of decisions ahead of time.

 

also, there are patterns for fingering across the row that are very standard. i know when to use a third finger A instead of first. i also know when pull d makes better phrasing. i dont have to think about it. if i am learning a tune by ear at a session, i finger it the same as i will that tune after i have spent a good year or two getting comfortable with the tune. consider foxhunter's in the key of A, where i switch back and forth between third and first finger A for phrasing (often unnecessarily, as in bucks of oranmore)--i have been doing that since the first day i played the tune. there are very few times when i change how i finger things, and when i do, it usually becomes a new habit that goes straight in--automatically--to new tunes.

 

you are right that it gets harder for the brain to handle at first. but just like anything, the brain adapts very quickly. it is hard for me to play in the rows, while across them is intuitive for me now. but as i have been trying more lately, i can learn new tunes at the session across the row easier than just a few weeks ago.

Edited August 12, 2008 by david_boveri

[david_boveri]

I'm a Noel Hill camper, with my experience modified by several other teachers.

 

The RH pull B is my "primary" B. I tend to cross rows on the D. If the tune is ascending with a D following a LH G or A or a RH B, I'll pull the D and play any subsequent higher notes on the G row. I'll look to play a LH push D on descending parts of tunes.

 

I'm pretty sure Noel would say I use the RH pull D too much, not to mention my use of the RH push C & E.

 

One option to keep in mind is the LH 3rd finger pull A which allows an easier LH push D.

 

I agree there's no "right" fingering. Some fingerings are preferable because they may give a better "Irish" sound, but it always has to fit the rhythm. I'm thinking on one tune in particular that will sound more Irish with a particular fingering. But if I use that fingering, it won't sound Irish at all because I can't hold the rhythm. So, for now, I'll forego a bit of Irishness in favor of a steady ryhthm. Maybe a year from now, I'll be better able to play it as I'd like to.

 

i use both pull and push D. in the bucks of oranmore, for example, i use both in the same phrase. in this phrase,

 

|Adfd edfd|Adfd edBd|Adfd edfd|gefd edBd|

 

in the first measure, i take the first A on the first finger, the first d on the pull. but then, when i get to the second measure, i pull the first A on the third finger, and then push the d. i alternate between the two. at first, this would seem counter intuitive, but i change it to change the phrasing. this is because i model my version of the bucks after matt molloy ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHcDY76a_eY ). if you notice, at 35 seconds in, the A is accented differently (where i would pull the d) then the A is accented start of the next measure (during 36 seconds in). the A and d take a back seat as that pattern is repeated every time, except the first. it doesnt sound right to me to play the pull d every time, and it doesnt sound right to use the push d every time either. it all depends on phrasing.

 

the reason, i think, that you cant hold the rhythm with any fingering is because of bellows control. in siobhan o'donnel's, i used to use pull G (outside row, right hand), for this phrase: def A2 G|FED cA. i could not manage to do push G, pull F, push E. it was too many bellow changes for me. but now, as i have spent considerable time working on my bellows, it is no problem. bellows control comes from the shoulders, not from the wrist and fore arm.

[Azalin]

Looking at the original question, I think maybe part has been missed. Azalin had played mainly c row left and c & g on right, maybe using about 7-8 buttons for 95% of the time. When he wanted to play a G or B etc., he had mostly one option and it was 'easy' to train the muscle memory to get that note.

 

However, when you are playing across the rows and varying whether you use a push or pull for a given note, it gets harder for the brain to handle. You really should be able to play music without having to think too much about it, just like speech. I often find myself playing on one row or the other when I should have switched - my autopilot tends to favour that as a means to hitting the note rather than switching to another row.

 

Yeah, that was my reasoning when I started. I knew it would be easier if I knew only one fingering for a specific note. I played whistle for six years before starting the concertina so I was used to one position of my finger playing one note, and the only way to play the note. I was too lazy to learn alternative ways and wanted to learn as many tunes as I could. I think it was my biggest mistake, because phrasing is important to me, and a single fingering won't allow me to get good phrasing going for many tunes.

 

I still seem to play my Dminor tunes the same was as before though, mostly with the C row, but now that I know how to play rolls, or at least attempt playing them, it makes the phrasing a bit better I think.

Edited August 11, 2008 by Azalin

[Greg Jowaisas]

Right now, in this discussion, I am reminded of one of my favorite Noel Hill lines:

 

"The concertina is a minefield. A minefield!"

 

Greg