Woodworm in the soft parts of a Lachenal

[nkgibbs]

Dear All,

I have just aquired a lovely rosewood Lachenal Anglo (circa 1881) that has about 15 woodworm hold in one of the action pan. There was a little dust evident when I opened the end but I suspect that this had been trapped there so is not necessarily evidence of recent activity. The 2mm diameter holes were only in the action pan (mainly the edges) and not in the bellow frame or reed pan below.

 

I have read that freezing (perhaps with afew freeze-thaw cycles) is used to treat woodworm. Does anyone have experience of this technique?

Many Thanks,

Neil

[Alan Day]

Dear All,

I have just aquired a lovely rosewood Lachenal Anglo (circa 1881) that has about 15 woodworm hold in one of the action pan. There was a little dust evident when I opened the end but I suspect that this had been trapped there so is not necessarily evidence of recent activity. The 2mm diameter holes were only in the action pan (mainly the edges) and not in the bellow frame or reed pan below.

 

I have read that freezing (perhaps with afew freeze-thaw cycles) is used to treat woodworm. Does anyone have experience of this technique?

Many Thanks,

Neil

You have to be very careful that any action you take would create warping. Freezing, or a couple of minutes in the microwave would kill anything off, but I would treat the wood in the area affected with woodworm killer.Available from any hardware store

I have known moth larvae to munch their way out through the bellows and it is usually moth grubs that eat the felt between the pads. If you do use treatment then assemble it back in the instrument. When unscrewing work as if you were taking the head off an engine each screw release a bit at a time and across the flats - 1 3 5 2 4 6

Al

[nkgibbs]

Dear All,

I have just aquired a lovely rosewood Lachenal Anglo (circa 1881) that has about 15 woodworm hold in one of the action pan. There was a little dust evident when I opened the end but I suspect that this had been trapped there so is not necessarily evidence of recent activity. The 2mm diameter holes were only in the action pan (mainly the edges) and not in the bellow frame or reed pan below.

 

I have read that freezing (perhaps with afew freeze-thaw cycles) is used to treat woodworm. Does anyone have experience of this technique?

Many Thanks,

Neil

You have to be very careful that any action you take would create warping. Freezing, or a couple of minutes in the microwave would kill anything off, but I would treat the wood in the area affected with woodworm killer.Available from any hardware store

I have known moth larvae to munch their way out through the bellows and it is usually moth grubs that eat the felt between the pads. If you do use treatment then assemble it back in the instrument. When unscrewing work as if you were taking the head off an engine each screw release a bit at a time and across the flats - 1 3 5 2 4 6

Al

Dear Alan,

Thanks for the advice.......I have got some moth strips that I hope will work against woodworm if I seal the affected end in a freezer bag (not in the freezer).

Neil

[spindizzy]

For moths (in wool or suchlike) the idea is to run through a few freeze thaw cycles.

A domestic freezer should kill moths and grubs but not always the pupae and maybe eggs. A nice warmup after the freeze ecourages moths to emerge from pupae and eggs to hatch, whereapon you bang it back the freezer .. maybe a few days to a week in then ditto out then repeat ....

 

Probably wouldn't be good for an instrument!

 

Another non-chemical method (misnomer really 'cos everything in the world is pretty much chemicals :-)) for wool moths and flour moths etc.... is to seal it in a plastic bag with dry ice and suffocate the b******* (keep the plastic bag flattened to start and make the seal loose so as not to explode it!) I'm not sure where you get the dry ice though.

[DDF]

Hi Neil, Once you have used your chosen method of treatment you could do something we used to do with furniture once treated.Take a piece of bees wax and a hot nail or a pointed soldering iron put the tip of the iron just entering the worm hole and touch the bees wax against it.The wax will flow into the cavity.Remove the iron and let the wax cool if the hole is not quite full apply a little more.Once cool remove any excess with your nail or a chisel.If you do not feel confident with a heat source you can warm the bees wax roll into a cone between your fingers then push that into the worm hole.The main purpose for doing this on furniture was that you can the check in the future whether you have stayed on top of the problem as they only make surface holes on the way out.Regards David.

 

PS freezing works well but needs a very low temperature and quite a bit of time.Condensation can be a real nuisance between freezes.If you are not keen on injecting the proprietary killers fumigating with the same killers in a plastic enclosure works well but really takes the longest of all. I wouldn't use a microwave but if you are tempted make sure you remove any metal.

[michael stutesman]

I've never heard of woodworm (except with ocean going wooden boats in the tropics) until this forum. Is it something that is found in the U.S. also?

[asdormire]

I've never heard of woodworm (except with ocean going wooden boats in the tropics) until this forum. Is it something that is found in the U.S. also?

 

Yes, we have a woodworms here as well.

 

Alan

[Marien]

Putting it in a Microwave works for old fiddle parts.

The Microwave kills all woodwurm incl. the eggs in seconds.

The plate itself should be dry.

Fiddle makers (at least the one who told me this) uses this trick succesfully.

 

For concertina parts, all metal would have to be removed before using the microwave.

This may be suitable for a reed pan, but for action plates it involves a lot more, removing the levers and pillars etc.

The bellows have some metal parts (for holding the end bolts), ideally one should remove them before putting it in a microwave.

[Marien]

I've never heard of woodworm (except with ocean going wooden boats in the tropics) until this forum. Is it something that is found in the U.S. also?

 

Yes, we have a woodworms here as well.

 

Alan

 

 

Some European woodworms like to eat spruce, they are small. The chance that they are present in a concertina is low if the instrument has always been played (wood wurms don't like concertina music), or when it has been kept in a closed concertina case.

 

If there is a woodwurm, there must have been an insect that has put an egg in it.

If you see holes in spruce, there is a great chance that it is made by wood wurms that already died a long time ago.

[Theo]

If you see holes in spruce, there is a great chance that it is made by wood wurms that already died a long time ago.

 

But they will almost certainly have emerged, laid eggs, and their children and grandchildren will be busy inside the wood. The holes are not evidence that the insects died, only that they successfully reached adulthood and emerged to lay eggs and repeat their life cycle. There may be only a small number of holes visible at the surface, but the interior of the wood may have been reduced to a sponge.

 

In the UK woodworm will attack many different species of timber, softwoods and hardwoods, the will certainly attack maple and pine, but they tend to avoid wood that is very dry. They prefer cool, humid and dark undisturbed places, so an instrument stored inside a case for a long period is more at risk than one that is played regularly. If, during the course of a restoration project I find evidence of woodworm I use a solvent based woodworm killing fluid before any other work. Once the fluid has dried thoroughly any external surfaces, that could come into contact with the players skin, are lightly sanded or scraped to remove any surface traces of insecticide, and then the surface is refinished. That way the insecticide remains inside the wood, but the surface is free of it.

[Marien]

In the UK woodworm will attack many different species of timber, softwoods and hardwoods, the will certainly attack maple and pine, but they tend to avoid wood that is very dry. They prefer cool, humid and dark undisturbed places, so an instrument stored inside a case for a long period is more at risk than one that is played regularly. If, during the course of a restoration project I find evidence of woodworm I use a solvent based woodworm killing fluid before any other work. Once the fluid has dried thoroughly any external surfaces, that could come into contact with the players skin, are lightly sanded or scraped to remove any surface traces of insecticide, and then the surface is refinished. That way the insecticide remains inside the wood, but the surface is free of it.

 

Theo,

 

You are right that in UK and the rest of Europe this kind of woodworm you are talking about is a bigger problem in instruments. About the case, I was thinking it can prevent a woodworm to get in in the first place. They can´t live in open air, so the eggs have to be laid in the wood and afterwards they can eat them selves further in the same piece of wood. But you are right, once it is in the concertina, it will keep eating spruce and maple and multiplying. There are different woodworm types. Some are acting like this, eating the inside of the wood fiber, the softest to eat. It weakens the wood. You can often see traces of that on centuries old stringed instruments (such as light weight violins). Other species are eating themselves a way out of the wood, to undergo a methamorfosis, and then you will see more round holes.

 

But, to return to the topic of a remedy against these woodworms, what do you think about the microwave strategy on reedless reed pans, wooden ends and bellows? For an action plate it is complicated to remove the metal, but for the other parts it should work, as it does fo fiddles, and no poison involved... What do you think?

 

Marien.