English International Lineup

[PeterT]

If my Country loving friends call their baby Dolly, I won't be the one who says: "But she has no tits at all!"

I'll just congratulate them with their beautiful daughter ..........

Pardon?

[Leonard]

If my Country loving friends call their baby Dolly, I won't be the one who says: "But she has no tits at all!"

I'll just congratulate them with their beautiful daughter ..........

Pardon?

After month of work Alan comes up with a great collection of English concertina music, and he calls it after "Anglo International".

Time to enjoy what's there, not to nag what should be on a CD called "English Concertina International"

[Alan Day]

I have just looked back on my Emails regarding this project and the first Email went out to discuss this project on the 25th Oct 2005

The first of the invitations to play on the collection was to Alistair Anderson on the 1st Feb 2005. I have been working on this project ever since

Al

[m3838]

I understand the idea, but it clearly didn't work. Unless you have close to 50% of players been of different culture, offering different approaches to EC playing, demonstrating ethnic divercity, it's not really International.

The title of the cd is English International not English Global. An English, or even American , dictionary will clarify the difference.

 

 

An International gathering: New England, Oregon, California, Massatchussets, Wales, Scottland, England, Australia, New Zealand.

Nice try though. No need for interpretors and everybody know the songs. A bit one sided though as far as International goes. And it's quite Global, if to consider that by miracle Australia and New Zealand don't fall off the Earth on the other side.

Give me Spanish vs. Moor, African vs. European, French vs. English, East European vs. West European, - that would be classified as having International agenda. What's the hoopla if international gathering of musicians in tail suits play Bach? Australian aborigenies and African slaves playing accordion - it's hoopla all right.

What then is the purpose of the collection? To show that Regondi can be played in many countries? Was there any doubt? But even this is marginal, as line-up clearly shows majority of musicians claim English as their Mother tongue. It reminds me Soviet Internationalism: 50% represented by 15 republics and another 50% by Russia.

I also understand that for English speaker, who is accustomed to everybody in the world speking English, inclusion of someone who doesn't would seem quite international.

Now, call it as you wish, I don't mind. Just expressed an opinion other than outright praise and can't wait to get my copy of the compilation. It will be my final test of whether proceed with EC or drop it in favour of Bandoneon. Exactly for this reason, as I observe Concertina, both Englsih and Anglo, to be very British Isles oriented instrument. Great for Irish, Englsh, but is it so great for Russian and French? Spanish and German? I'm all anticipation.

[Mark Evans]

Misha, I think the EC is great for everything (I would). The line-up is a bit more International than you might think...our lovely Juliette is very French, Pauline and Wim are Dutch and Henrik is a Swede if I'm not mistaken. Juliette, Pauline, Wim and Alan Atlas are reviving the art of classical music on this instrument. What could be more international?

 

Stay with the Albion. If your instrument is as fine as the new one I had the chance to play earlier this week, you are indeed blessed.

 

Why not Bandoneon as well?

[Paul Read]

What then is the purpose of the collection? To show that Regondi can be played in many countries? Was there any doubt? But even this is marginal, as line-up clearly shows majority of musicians claim English as their Mother tongue. It reminds me Soviet Internationalism: 50% represented by 15 republics and another 50% by Russia.

I also understand that for English speaker, who is accustomed to everybody in the world speking English, inclusion of someone who doesn't would seem quite international.

Now, call it as you wish, I don't mind. Just expressed an opinion other than outright praise and can't wait to get my copy of the compilation. It will be my final test of whether proceed with EC or drop it in favour of Bandoneon. Exactly for this reason, as I observe Concertina, both Englsih and Anglo, to be very British Isles oriented instrument. Great for Irish, Englsh, but is it so great for Russian and French? Spanish and German? I'm all anticipation.

I'm not sure whether there are actually any words on the CD so what does it matter? Concertinas play tunes. Also, stop ignoring Canada. There's at least one Canadian on it who lives in a country where french is an official language and who often plays Quebecois tunes.

Edited February 20, 2008 by Paul Read

[Alan Day]

I understand the idea, but it clearly didn't work. Unless you have close to 50% of players been of different culture, offering different approaches to EC playing, demonstrating ethnic divercity, it's not really International.

The title of the cd is English International not English Global. An English, or even American , dictionary will clarify the difference.

 

 

An International gathering: New England, Oregon, California, Massatchussets, Wales, Scottland, England, Australia, New Zealand.

Nice try though. No need for interpretors and everybody know the songs. A bit one sided though as far as International goes. And it's quite Global, if to consider that by miracle Australia and New Zealand don't fall off the Earth on the other side.

Give me Spanish vs. Moor, African vs. European, French vs. English, East European vs. West European, - that would be classified as having International agenda. What's the hoopla if international gathering of musicians in tail suits play Bach? Australian aborigenies and African slaves playing accordion - it's hoopla all right.

What then is the purpose of the collection? To show that Regondi can be played in many countries? Was there any doubt? But even this is marginal, as line-up clearly shows majority of musicians claim English as their Mother tongue. It reminds me Soviet Internationalism: 50% represented by 15 republics and another 50% by Russia.

I also understand that for English speaker, who is accustomed to everybody in the world speking English, inclusion of someone who doesn't would seem quite international.

Now, call it as you wish, I don't mind. Just expressed an opinion other than outright praise and can't wait to get my copy of the compilation. It will be my final test of whether proceed with EC or drop it in favour of Bandoneon. Exactly for this reason, as I observe Concertina, both Englsih and Anglo, to be very British Isles oriented instrument. Great for Irish, Englsh, but is it so great for Russian and French? Spanish and German? I'm all anticipation.

 

Well I think you have made your point regarding the name.My main objective like Anglo (International) is to show the versatility of the instrument and that really is what you can judge me on.

As for your interest in its capabilities for playing music from other countries ,when you get your copy have a listen to Raphael a Balkan who on the strength of the success of Gregori Matusewitch (who is included in the collection ) was taken to America to play in the Music Halls. On English International (sorry to repeat the International bit) he plays "Doina" a Hungarian Shepherd tune and "Russian Medley" you will never have heard playing like this unless you have this record. Also included is Mark Gilston USA ,but he specialises in music from Eastern European Countries he is playing" Oppskrivi" and District Court March. I could not find anyone playing French or Spanish music ,but it will be included in Duet with Jean Megly and others if I find them.

Hopefully players like yourself m3838 will hear this music on the English start playing it and inspire others to do the same.

OK not INTERNATIONAL ,but even you may be catered for in a section of this collection.

Al

[Laitch]

An International gathering: New England, Oregon, California, Massatchussets, Wales, Scottland, England, Australia, New Zealand.

Nice try though. No need for interpretors and everybody know the songs. A bit one sided though as far as International goes. And it's quite Global, if to consider that by miracle Australia and New Zealand don't fall off the Earth on the other side.

Not being as accommodating as Alan, I refuse to accept definitions of words in the English language by learners or speakers with weak grasps of the language and its nuances.

 

The first definition of "international" is "between two or more nations". "Global" means "worldwide".

[Alan Day]

An International gathering: New England, Oregon, California, Massatchussets, Wales, Scottland, England, Australia, New Zealand.

Nice try though. No need for interpretors and everybody know the songs. A bit one sided though as far as International goes. And it's quite Global, if to consider that by miracle Australia and New Zealand don't fall off the Earth on the other side.

Not being as accommodating as Alan, I refuse to accept definitions of words in the English language by learners or speakers with weak grasps of the language and its nuances.

 

The first definition of "international" is "between two or more nations". "Global" means "worldwide".

I am accommodating Laitch, to a point ,but I shall shortly be re commencing work on the final collection Duet INTERNATIONAL .

Al

[m3838]

Misha, I think the EC is great for everything (I would). The line-up is a bit more International than you might think...our lovely Juliette is very French, Pauline and Wim are Dutch and Henrik is a Swede if I'm not mistaken. Juliette, Pauline, Wim and Alan Atlas are reviving the art of classical music on this instrument. What could be more international?

 

Stay with the Albion. If your instrument is as fine as the new one I had the chance to play earlier this week, you are indeed blessed.

 

Why not Bandoneon as well?

I think Juliette is from US originally.

Wim and Pauline play mainstream classical music (not that it's bad, of course). So yes, it is International by the letter, but you know what I mean.

My Albion had some problems as new instrument and had to be sent back twice. It doesn't feel like a fine one, but rather like a workable one. Esp. the higher reeds, that keep silent on low pressure, rendering my attempts at crescendo futile, but that's beside the point.

I didn't say it's either EC or Bandoneon, did I? No, it's more whether I will concentrate on EC or Bandoneion. I almost decided on that Hybrid with Russian B system from Harry Geuns, as Bastari Hayden doesn't seem to be up where I'd like it to be quality wise. Another idea is to hunt for transposing EC in lower pitch. Most of the music I learn is a bit too high for EC. Sounds a bit Whimpy, and the music suggests force and power - dilemma.

[Pete Dunk]

I'm finding the change of tone in this thread increasingly annoying, effectively racialist in fact. Grouping together a number of countries spread over an area in excess of half of the globe and suggesting they are one and the same because they happen to share a common 'main' language is nonsense. Expressing the opinion that this isn't a truly 'International' project because a great many nations aren't represented is a misnomer.

 

The 'English' concertina was invented in England by an English physicist, fact. That it's use spread beyond these shores is testament that it was well conceived and worthy of general use. Diversification into duet patterns and the creation of 'Anglo/German' types to offset the challenge of European mass production proves that the portability and versatility of the instrument was popular and therefore profitable, to a degree.

 

So what is Alan to do in his quest to produce a representative collection of the best in 'English' concertina playing, offer the best players he can find with the most diverse repertoire, or pander to the sensitivities of someone with a chip on his shoulder a mile wide who doesn't want to believe that this is a worthy instrument, largely but not exclusively played by English speaking or western European nations? In saying this I am incredibly aware of the concertina enthusiasts from other parts of the world who contribute so much to this forum and without whom we would be so much the poorer.

 

All are welcome here and all are equal; but some just might, if they push it far enough, be more equal than others.

[m3838]

I'm not sure whether there are actually any words on the CD so what does it matter?

Actually, none at all.

Also, stop ignoring Canada. There's at least one Canadian on it who lives in a country where french is an official language and who often plays Quebecois tunes.

Now I'm totally satisfied.

[m3838]

Not being as accommodating as Alan, I refuse to accept definitions of words in the English language by learners or speakers with weak grasps of the language and its nuances.

 

The first definition of "international" is "between two or more nations". "Global" means "worldwide".

 

As Alan pointed up, and as everybody understood it, the purpose of the CD is not to follow Dictionary's definition, as though such definition bears any positive meaning, but to demonstrate versatility of the instrument. My concern was that formal Internationalism between two nations: England and Scottland, may fail to acheave such goal, esp. considering that large bulk of the music, associated with the EC, is European Classical, that is uniform in style.

I may add that "between two nations" is "by-lateral", and "...or more..." approaches "Global". It has nothing to do with English language, as such concepts exist in many other tongues too.

[Mark Evans]

Wim and Pauline play mainstream classical music (not that it's bad, of course). So yes, it is International by the letter, but you know what I mean.

 

I don't know what you mean Misha. My time spent as a classical singer if it taught me anything other than I'm way too crazy and contrary to be involved with it, was that this large genre is indeed international. I worked and studied with colleagues from all over the world: Korea, China, Japan, Kenya, Russia, South and Central America, many Europeans and one particular French Canadian . It should be no suprise that "classical" music was the only international language we could speak to one another with with any certain fluency.

Edited February 21, 2008 by Mark Evans

[Henrik Müller]

...Henrik is a Swede if I'm not mistaken...

Gosh, what a terrible, terrible mistake - I am Danish but I live in Sweden (just to confuse people).

 

/Henrik

[chris]

Hi

As it's Alan's creation I think he can call it by any name he chooses. I think we should just be grateful that he has chosen to create it. Sod the semantics just enjoy the music.

chris

[Dan Madden]

...Henrik is a Swede if I'm not mistaken...

Gosh, what a terrible, terrible mistake - I am Danish but I live in Sweden (just to confuse people).

 

/Henrik

 

I have learned to be very careful distinguishing between people from Scandinavia. I once had a girlfriend who was Scandinavian, but I didn’t know her nationality. I told her she had a Swede smile, but a face like a Norse. She said it was Finnish and I never saw her again.

 

I am sorry, I just couldn't restrain myself.

 

Dan Madden

[allan atlas]

OY............... this thread is becoming a little silly now. . . . .the title ENGLISH INTERNATIONAL does not raise moral problems (at least not really profound ones). . . .nor is it something that needs the attention of the United Nations. . . . .

 

i think there are two very good reasons for calling it ENGLISH INTERNATIONAL:

 

(1) it belongs to the same series as -- and follows hard on the heels of -- ANGLO INTERNATIONAL. . . .it will in turn be followed by DUET INTERNATIONAL. . . .in other words, it is part of a series for which which Graham and Alan have WISELY kept a uniform title. . . . .

 

(2) i do not think i'm going beyond the bounds of propriety if i divulge the following information (in the hope that it will get the doubters and the nay sayers to stop doubting and saying nay): if we consider only those concertinists on the CDs who are still alive and sort of kickin', we find that they represent no fewer than EIGHT quite sovereign nations. . . . . .that is, the live performers are either native to or are now residing in that number of countries. . . . . . .(i hope i didn't miss one along the way). . . . . .if we add into the mix those players who are now deceased, we add at least one more country where two of them were born before eventually coming to the USA. . . . . . finally, we might add still one more country (sovereign in spirit only) on the grounds that one of the alive-and-sort-of-kickin' guys (i say "sort of" on the grounds that he became a senior citizen this past tuesday) lives in the suburbs of NEW YORK CITY. . . .whose mayor many of us hope will still throw his hat into the presidential campaign as a third-party candidate. . . . . .

 

in other words: i think the presence of the word "INTERNATIONAL" in the title in no way violates any codes of truth in advertising..........

 

so can we stop the griping and the carping and simply say thank you to Graham and Alan for a lot of hard work..........Allan

Edited February 21, 2008 by allan atlas