Stuck Button.

[Alan Caffrey]

I have a Jeffries C/G anglo with a sticking button - it's the B/C first button middle row on the right side. I took the cover off and it appears that the button is physically getting stuck in the hole, not everytime it's played but frequently. I don't want to start pulling leavers out until I know what I'm getting into - I don't even know what's on the bottom end of the button or what's in the hole. Can anyone walk me through this repair?

 

Best wishes, Alan Caffrey.

[PeterT]

I have a Jeffries C/G anglo with a sticking button - it's the B/C first button middle row on the right side. I took the cover off and it appears that the button is physically getting stuck in the hole, not everytime it's played but frequently.

Hi Alan,

 

It could be a variety of reasons. The makers/repairers on this Forum will probably have a more specific idea based on experience, but it strikes me that this is one of the most frequently used buttons on the Anglo whether the instrument is played in an Irish or English style. It could be wear and tear on the lever, a spring about to break, a worn bushing making the locating pin at the base of the button catch at the side of the hole in the action board.

 

Any chance of a close-up picture? That would certainly help reduce our conjecture. I recall a similar problem with my first concertina, which was a Lachenal. However, that had the "slotted post" action.

 

Peter.

[Alan Day]

This problem could be as simple as replacing a pad.If the pad is higher the button sits lower in the hole.

It could also be the felt where the button joins the arm is too tight,a little ream with a slightly larger drill (done by hand ) or replace it. Likewise the felt where the button goes up and down. As Peter says there are many possibilities these are the first ones I would look at look at.

Al

Edited January 26, 2008 by Alan Day

[Frank Edgley]

Is it really the button getting stuck, or the action getting stuck at the fulcrum rivet? Does it continue to be stuck with the grill removed? The guide pin and guide pin hole are not really a tight fit, so I can't see the pin sticking in the hole.

[Alan Caffrey]

It 's sticking with the grill off; I removed the spring and added a little tension and the spring seems to be in good shape - extra tension didn't help much. I guess I need to remove the lever: I've done that on a dipper before - is it the same process on the Jeffries? It really does appear to be sticking in the hole, I guess we'll find out if I pull the lever.

Sorry! No pics, I'm a techno numbskull I'm afraid.

 

Thanks, Alan.

[david robertson]

I guess I need to remove the lever: I've done that on a dipper before - is it the same process on the Jeffries? It really does appear to be sticking in the hole, I guess we'll find out if I pull the lever.

 

 

I wouldn't even think about removing the lever. Being a riveted action, you'd have to pull out the pivot post too, which is fraught with possibilities of damage. Much easier to remove the pad, so that the button will rise right out of its locating hole. Then you can see if there's any miscellaneous cack (technical term) in the hole or around the pin, as well as checking if there's enough play in the bushing (where the lever passes through the button) to allow the button to remain vertical when pressed down.

[Alan Caffrey]

Yes, excuse me - I actually meant 'remove the pivot post' - I realize dismantling the lever from the pivot post might be a disaster.

 

Alan.

[Pete Dunk]

Read that again Alan, I'll think you'll find it says that attempting to remove the pivot post would be fraught with disaster! Far, far easier to detach the pad from the end of the arm which will give you all of the free movement you need to investigate the problem.

[Greg Jowaisas]

Once you have checked the bushing where the button goes through the end to make sure it isn't too tight, (sound like this is not your problem if the button binds with the end off) then...

 

I would take a good look at the bushing of the button where the action arm goes through. I've seen a few recently rebuilt instruments that had bushing felt so tight that the button could not aline properly with the end hole and pin hole. This produced a binding that slowed or hung up the button. Once the bushing was freed up the button worked fine with nor further repair.

 

This may or may not be the source of your problem but it is a good place to start. Next step would be to check the pin hole that the button guide slips into and see if there are any rough edges inside catching on the button's pin guide.

 

Then on to the spring. Slip the spring off the action arm and see if the arm works easily up and down by hand. If it isn't binding check the spring. Sometimes a spring's position can effect how easily and effeciently an action arm works. Look at the springs and arms that work smoothly and see if the troublesome one is different.

 

An action arm hanging up at the pivot point is a tougher nut to crack. You could try a little graphite (scraped pencil lead will do) to lubricate the contact point. If the rivet still seems too tight or bound up I would turn it over to a pro.

 

Good luck,

 

Greg

[Theo]

Is the button sticking in the down position, leaving a note playing, or is it sticking when you attempt to press it? Answers so far assume the former.

[Alan Caffrey]

The former: it sticks down leaving a note playing. Alan.

[Alan Day]

Have you tried removing the button completely and just pushing down the lever by hand? This will show you if you have a problem with the button or the lever or the spring.

Unusual problems could arise by

The pad sticking on the side of the wood surround.

The spring turning as the button is depressed and not lifting the arm.

The arm pivot has corroded and is not working.(I have never known this happen)

The felt bushes being too tight on the button in two positions ,where the arm fits into the button and where the button goes into the end plate (both common reasons for your problem)

The spring tension not being sufficient or the spring in the wrong place to lift the arm.

If I think of any more I will add them on.

Al

[Bob Tedrow]

I have a Jeffries C/G anglo with a sticking button - it's the B/C first button middle row on the right side. I took the cover off and it appears that the button is physically getting stuck in the hole, not everytime it's played but frequently. I don't want to start pulling leavers out until I know what I'm getting into - I don't even know what's on the bottom end of the button or what's in the hole. Can anyone walk me through this repair?

 

Best wishes, Alan Caffrey.

 

Here is my punchlist for that problem

 

 

 

1. Button has to pass nicely through top button hole/bushing without binding

2. Button "hole" must be concentric with the pin "hole" look down from the top, old warped instruments can be out of alignment.

3. Lever must neatly bisect the plane of the buttonhole/pinhole

4. button should be able to rock on the lever about 5-7 degrees

5. lever should move easily throughout its entire range of motion. with and without spring attached.

6. spring should have even tension and of course be "springy" They can die.

7. pad should not hang on adjacent pads or on the wood case work. It can hang up on the underside of the top when completely assembled and look ok when the top is off

8. the plane of the lever fulcrum should be perpendicular the the action board. If a riveted lever is leaning over a couple degrees, the button can hang up on the top as it can not move exactly perpendicular to the top with out the lever turning a bit in the button aperture

 

Hope that helps

 

Bob

[Alan Caffrey]

This is what I've done: took the pad off and gently reemed out the hole the pin goes into. Question: I have a new pad and washer, what kind of glue should I use to fix pad, washer and leather stirp together?

 

Thanks to all for your help, Alan.

[Pete Dunk]

what kind of glue should I use

PVA (Elmer's) will do the job.

 

Pete.

[Adavis]

This thread is very helpful to me as my anglo G/A button is playing even when not pressed. I've figured out that my pad is getting hung up on an adjacent pad. What is the fix for this? Is it the spring? Thank you in advance!

[SIMON GABRIELOW]

I get similar problems on my concertina, and have the middle C button sounding when should not; I will open my instrument up and probably find a button is slipping, or possibly, some part of lever part catching on opposite lever ;

My make is Italian made ( sold under Hohner brand in 1999).. there is never one answer to the problem. You cannot tell until you look inside!

Sometimes the barest change in position of lever, button ( in my own) can either cause or remedy the problem!

If unsure, get someone experienced to repair it for you and watch them and learn, as they do the job.

Edited August 25, 2022 by SIMON GABRIELOW

[Richard Mellish]

If one pad is catching on an adjacent pad, one or other of them must be slightly out of position. I would think the first step would be to see whether one of them is falling off its lever. If not, the next step would be to look through the holes to see which one is no longer centered on its hole. Then try to work out why.