David Helmore Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 Hi everyone! I am lucky enough to own two quite late 'Louis Lachenal' concertinas - one English (S/N 16741) and one anglo, 20 key (S/N 26651). I have read some really good articles by Wes Williams, William Meredith and Stephen Chambers regarding the issues around dating these instruments. What I have yet to find is any record online of the highest 'recorded' serial numbers for instruments marked 'Louis Lachenal' or a record of the lowest 'recorded' serial number for instruments marked 'Lachenal & Co' Firstly, does anyone know of any research which I might have missed?! According to Stephen Chambers, it was sometime in 1874 that the company become 'Lachenal & Co' If this is linked into the research undertaken by Wes Williams, we could assume that the changeover for 'English' would be sometime between serial numbers 18450 and 19230. Can anyone help to prove this assumption?! The info for the anglos seems more tricky - one method shows mine (S/N 26651) as 1856, the other as 1875. Does anyone have a 'Louis Lachenal' anglo with a serial number higher than 26651? As always, any comment appreciated! Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wes williams Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) Dave, Unfortunately its not possible to give accurate changeovers for 1873/4, because labels were changed during repair, and many of the instruments reports don't have label details. Many Anglos also have dealers labels rather than Lachenal ones. But as a guide, the changeover numbers from reported Lachenal instruments (currently about 2500 including duets) working from the last 'Louis Lachenal' are around: English: 23000 Anglo: 27250 although instruments with Lachenal & Co labels exist with numbers less than these. So your anglo would seem to fit into the early 1870s. The English would be around the mid 1860s, based on some very recent discoveries. Edited September 7, 2007 by wes williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Helmore Posted September 7, 2007 Author Share Posted September 7, 2007 Thanks Wes - most helpful! More complicated than I first thought! What about if an an instrument still retained the original 'Louis Lachenal' label throughout it's life? - but I guess even these might have been added on at a later date..... Appreciate this could be a lost cause for the instruments sold on through other supliers, but with the 'English' system the labels on the reed pans are either marked 'Louis Lachenal' or 'Lachenal & Co'. Would these generally ever be changed when an instrument was returned for a service...or could this be a way forward?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wes williams Posted September 7, 2007 Share Posted September 7, 2007 (edited) Dave, The information that people have provided usually only extends to the external features, which is why I gave the last 'Louis' labels rather than any other measure, as its more likely that this is correct. The labels would have been changed if the instrument was returned to Lachenal, but many internal markings suggest that repairs were likely to be made by local dealers or repairers, who would usually have kept the customers original label. I've also corrected the first post - the last English 'Louis' is around 23000, not 21100. The earliest '& Co' label English is around 20400. If you make up your own formula from these figures, remember that the series is thought to start at around 6000, as the very few numbers below this point that have been reported could be misread. Its also possible that Lachenal numbering could have the same kind of 'range line' characteristics that are shown in this article - after all Lachenal was Wheatstones main supplier. That would be an alternative explanation for the low number '& Co' labels. Edited September 7, 2007 by wes williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hielandman Posted September 8, 2007 Share Posted September 8, 2007 QUOTE "According to Stephen Chambers, it was sometime in 1874 that the company become 'Lachenal & Co' If this is linked into the research undertaken by Wes Williams, we could assume that the changeover for 'English' would be sometime between serial numbers 18450 and 19230. Can anyone help to prove this assumption?!" from DJPH72 QUOTE" But as a guide, the changeover numbers from reported Lachenal instruments (currently about 2500 including duets) working from the last 'Louis Lachenal' are around: English: 23000 " Wes Williams I have a 48 key brass reeded Lachenal English that has the Serial number of 20848, Marked "Louis Lachenal, London, which seems to fall in Wes' range for a "louis". Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Helmore Posted September 10, 2007 Author Share Posted September 10, 2007 Thanks for all the info - much appreciated! Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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