Chinese Concertinas

[stevejay]

Hi

 

I wonder- with all the concertinas assembled/manufatured overseas, the law of averages suggests that there are some chinese performing something interesting musically. Maybe on some 5 minutes between shifts?

 

Maybe some chinese in a factory somewhere actually LIKE the instrument and adapt it to either their traditional or pop music.

 

Wim of Walker Concertinas might know, having first hand experience of the factories. Perhaps the workers have no more interest than if it was a shoe. So.. I'd like to hear a standard anglo played by a musical chinese person who is approaching it from his/her musical and cultural experience.

 

I'd like to here "Zulu" concertina as well. Sounds exotic enough.

 

Now you know I'm a bit off, but I beat you to it.

 

Steve

Edited November 2, 2006 by stevejay

[Dirge]

Zulu concertina? Of course, it's something we've missed.

[Alan Day]

Two tracks of Zulu playing on Anglo International.

Al

[Wild Bill]

So in what keys are these Chinese concertinas?

Edited November 5, 2006 by Wild Bill

[stuart estell]

An interesting thought; I'd imagine that, like the Zulu squashbox players, if any Chinese people have been playing the instruments they're producing - particularly if they're anglos - then most likely they'll have begun mucking about with the layout too. As I understand it, the most commonly used scales in Chinese (and Japanese) music are pentatonic, so if you were designing an anglo layout with that emphasis in mind you might take the fourths out along the main rows and replace them with duplicates... maybe. It's fun to guess anyway

[stevejay]

An interesting thought; I'd imagine that, like the Zulu squashbox players, if any Chinese people have been playing the instruments they're producing - particularly if they're anglos - then most likely they'll have begun mucking about with the layout too. As I understand it, the most commonly used scales in Chinese (and Japanese) music are pentatonic, so if you were designing an anglo layout with that emphasis in mind you might take the fourths out along the main rows and replace them with duplicates... maybe. It's fun to guess anyway

 

That what I was thinking- Since the Sheng is the ancestor to modern reed instruments, the reed sound is well incorporated in chinese culture.

 

Just like players here complain about different layouts, someone trying to play traditional Chinese music would most likely find it possible but inconvenient.

 

I have a couple of tapes of Uhru or traditional 1 string violin music, but I doubt I will be attempting to reproduce this music on a concertina. I might however on a diatonic or chromatic harmonica.

 

Also, harmonica players are well know to customize harmonicas for specific genres. Examples are the harmonic minor lee oscar, and the Irish harmonica master Brendan Powers harmonicas for specific types of ethnic music.

 

It would come down to the ease and logic of the scale layouts. Maybe most would abandon the instrument, much like a diatonic harmonica player drops his diatonic down when his or her interests turn to classical music. The average player is not going to play a diatonic chromatically, and we can count on one hand those who can do it convincingly.

Edited November 5, 2006 by stevejay

[AnnC]

Recently while playing for a morris side a young Chinese lady visiting England got into conversation about my concertina, we got around the language problems with lots of smiles, although she hadn't seen a concertina before she was interested because her Mum plays accordian and she thought that a concertina would be easier for her Mum to manage, being a more compact instrument. She was pleased to hear that concertinas were being made in China. It would be great fun to have a 'cultural visit' to China with massed concertinas

[petec]

The ease of pentatonic scales on the concetina is why its great for irish music and much other trad music. Therefore I imagine the chinese would have little difficulty using it. But as you say the keys might not be right. The urhu has 2 strings incidentaly with the bow hair threaded permentantly between them.

Peter.

[ragtimer]

An interesting thought; I'd imagine that, like the Zulu squashbox players, if any Chinese people have been playing the instruments they're producing - particularly if they're anglos - then most likely they'll have begun mucking about with the layout too. As I understand it, the most commonly used scales in Chinese (and Japanese) music are pentatonic, so if you were designing an anglo layout with that emphasis in mind you might take the fourths out along the main rows and replace them with duplicates... maybe. It's fun to guess anyway

ISTR that Chinese music uses the hexatonic scale, meaning, in the key of C, they keep the F but leave out the B.

 

Now imagine an Anglo or harmonica without B's. You'd have 3 buttons or holes per octave, and each octave would play the same, since you no longer have that B forcing the blow/draw (push/pull) relationship to change in the upper octave. You could get a wider pitch range for the same number of buttons.

 

Not that the world really needs yet another button setup -- tho for 1.3 billion Chinese it might make sense

 

BTW, what really distinguishes Chinese traditional music from most Asian, is that the Chinese scale is the same pitches as ours (minus the B note), no quarter-tones or odd intervals. So we find Chinese music quite listenable.

--Mike K.

Edited November 13, 2006 by ragtimer

[m3838]

Sheng may very well has been the first known free reed instrument and an influence (arguably) for european accordion, but accordion culture itself was introduced to China by USSR and very close cultural ties between two "socialist" nations in the 50es. There is no direct descent from Cheng to Accordion at all.

Considering the extremely poor quality of chinese made instruments, I highly doubt that anyone in China would be tempted to fiddle with them. One thing is to use the difference in daily pay, and the other - cut corners in quality.

I'm sure accordions made for internal Chinese market, esp. for professionals, are as good as any Italian made. Or may be, due to intricacies of Chinese economy, pros in China use Italian or German Accordions.

Russians too make 20 button concertinas to compete with Chinese, but no knows players of such crap.

No wonder.

[Bernie Inakayak]

Hi

 

I wonder- with all the concertinas assembled/manufatured overseas, the law of averages suggests that there are some chinese performing something interesting musically. Maybe on some 5 minutes between shifts?

 

Maybe some chinese in a factory somewhere actually LIKE the instrument and adapt it to either their traditional or pop music.

 

snip

 

Now you know I'm a bit off, but I beat you to it.

 

Steve

 

Hi Steve,

 

There was a short programme on BBC Radio 4 recently which I only half listened to, about Chinese harmonica factories and their harmonica ensembles. If you are really interested I expect you could find the programme archived on the Radio 4 website.

 

Bernie

 

Oops, it was Japanese harmonica factories, so completely off-topic I suppose. Here's an article about it anyway though:

 

........

 

Golden oldies

 

Another musical instrument factory in Hamamatsu makes harmonicas. Among the staff is Michiko Takeya, who's 71 years old and is determined to keep working.

 

"I've been working here for many years and I really love the sound of the harmonicas," says Mrs Takeya. "I suppose most of my colleagues belong to a different generation but we still get on very well as friends."

 

Her colleague is 65-year-old Kamiya Yoshitaku says he stayed on because the company needed people with special technical skills.

 

Old Japanese woman [there was a picture here of an "old Japanese woman", not a terribly gallant caption is it, anyway, just use your imagination]

The elderly in Japan work in harmony with younger generations

 

He insisted he would rather work in the factory than spend time on his hobbies like hiking or fishing.

 

It is not just people who have been working for the company for decades who are allowed to stay on.

 

Suzuki Harmonicas has even hired new members of staff at the age of 60 according to Managing Director Takeomi Mishimura.

 

"Making musical instruments like harmonicas you need a lot of skill with your hands - computers can't do that," says Mr Mishimura.

 

"It's a great advantage for us to have older people working for us because they have got so much experience and can teach and nurture the younger generation."

 

The factory also offers a harmonica school for people who want to learn the instrument. Most of the students are in their sixties and seventies and go to lessons every week.

 

They also give concerts and invite their grandchildren to come to listen to the music.

 

Proof indeed that different generations can work in harmony.

Edited November 16, 2006 by Bernie Inakayak

[Missing Song]

Hi Steve,

 

There was a short programme on BBC Radio 4 recently which I only half listened to, about Chinese harmonica factories and their harmonica ensembles. If you are really interested I expect you could find the programme archived on the Radio 4 website.

 

Bernie

 

 

Matt and I sat and watched a Chinese harmonica player in Covent Garden the other weekend. He and the instrument were amazing, well worth a look/listen if you get the opportunity.

[m3838]

Hi Steve,

 

There was a short programme on BBC Radio 4 recently which I only half listened to, about Chinese harmonica factories and their harmonica ensembles. If you are really interested I expect you could find the programme archived on the Radio 4 website.

 

Bernie

 

 

Matt and I sat and watched a Chinese harmonica player in Covent Garden the other weekend. He and the instrument were amazing, well worth a look/listen if you get the opportunity.

 

Don't mix the two.

Chinese harmonicas are good. I had several, much easier to bend than Lee Oscar and overall sounded easier and with character. Plastic combs were of very good quality and airtight.