Which Is It?

[Pete Dickey]

So here we have a squeezebox on Ebay described by the seller as a concertina although clearly not. Two other "expert" opinions have also been given describing it as a Flutina and early French accordion respectively. Which one is correct? I lean towards the Flutina description personally.

 

Stephen where art Thou?

 

Pete

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...A%3AIT&rd=1

[m3838]

So here we have a squeezebox on Ebay described by the seller as a concertina although clearly not. Two other "expert" opinions have also been given describing it as a Flutina and early French accordion respectively. Which one is correct? I lean towards the Flutina description personally.

 

Stephen where art Thou?

 

Pete

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...A%3AIT&rd=1

 

Flutina. Two row C/G trebble on the right and two buttons chord/bass on the left. plus there must be a drone button or even two. Brass reeds. Very weird system of holding it.

[Stephen Chambers]

Stephen where art Thou?

Pete,

 

I've said it before, and I'll say it again :

 

What you have [there] is a "French accordion", of a type often, but incorrectly, described as a "flutina". (The flutina is a type of French accordion with the levers & pallets enclosed, unlike this example.)

... the correct, and original, name for all these instruments is "French accordion", and the "flutina" was only a variant of the style, with its levers and pallets (pads) enclosed, out of sight, under the end board. This produced a more muted tone, that was supposed to be more flute-like, hence the name.

 

However, "flutina" has become the accepted name for all these accordions in England, just as "melodeon" is now generally used to describe button accordions that are not [strictly] melodeons. The term "Anglo concertina" seems to be going the same way, with people starting to use it for German concertinas.

 

This eBay one looks like yet another example of the typical Busson model, and appears to bear his oval stamp. It's the commonest type.

[Stephen Chambers]

Flutina. Two row C/G trebble on the right and two buttons chord/bass on the left. plus there must be a drone button or even two.

'Fraid not , on the two-row instruments only the outside row is tuned to a given key (often, but by no means always, the key of C) with an inside row of semitones (like the third row of an Anglo).

 

The bascules d'harmonie on the treble keyboard can indeed provide a constant accompaniment, though it is not strictly a drone as it alternates between tonic and dominant, depending on bellows direction.

 

Brass reeds.

Actually, many of this model, at least of those sold by the Nottingham dealers in England, have broad steel reeds.

 

Very weird system of holding it.

Depends on which way you mean, there were several "approved" systems! There was considerable discussion of it here previously, and also here.

Edited August 31, 2006 by Stephen Chambers

[m3838]

Flutina. Two row C/G trebble on the right and two buttons chord/bass on the left. plus there must be a drone button or even two.

'Fraid not , on the two-row instruments only the outside row is tuned to a given key (often, but by no means always, the key of C) with an inside row of semitones (like the third row of an Anglo).

 

I tried probably 4 or 5 "Flutinas over years and invariably they were C/G with brass reeds. Mellow tone,but very slow. For sure there were other tunings, I have never ran into them.

The system of holding was indeed inconvinient and very soon changed to what we have today, much simpler and more reasonable. I have never seen Flutinas with enclosed palletts, where can I see a picture?

One Flutina I had in my hands wasn't an "accordion" at all, it didn't have bass/chord system. Just the air valve and drones. So I think Flutinas were opposite instruments from Accordions. What I really like about old instruments, is the cabinetry. Especially the Belgian system. Awesome. Now they started to be produced again. Too bad I have absolutely no time for an accordion.

http://www.shlomomusic.com/button_accordion.htm

http://www.leeuwaccordeons.nl/

Edited September 1, 2006 by m3838

[Stephen Chambers]

I tried probably 4 or 5 "Flutinas over years and invariably they were C/G with brass reeds.

Interesting, because I've got around 20 of them, and seen hundreds more, studied old patents, catalogues & tutor books, but never come across one in C/G.

 

I have never seen Flutinas with enclosed palletts, where can I see a picture?

Here's a picture of a fancy one, decorated with Boulle-work inlays:

 

 

One Flutina I had in my hands wasn't an "accordion" at all, it didn't have bass/chord system. Just the air valve and drones. So I think Flutinas were opposite instruments from Accordions.

Many French accordions (especially the earlier ones) don't have a bass/chord system, nor did the earliest accordions by Demian (the inventor), on which the French accordion was very closely based.

 

You will find pictures of early Demian accordions in this post.

[m3838]

One Flutina I had in my hands wasn't an "accordion" at all, it didn't have bass/chord system. Just the air valve and drones. So I think Flutinas were opposite instruments from Accordions.

Many French accordions (especially the earlier ones) don't have a bass/chord system, nor did the earliest accordions by Demian (the inventor), on which the French accordion was very closely based.

 

 

 

So technically speaking, Flutinas are melody instruments, and accoridons are harmony instruments. The two of them are ike opposite sides of one modern accordion.

I'll check, may be there still is one in Kimrick's shop in Oakland Ca

[LarsWilladsen]

As I am one of the "experts" who have replied to the eBay seller and now see the topic being brought up here, I think a comment would be in place. Yes - from one point of view it is a Flutina. BUT: The French builders at the time DID advertise their "Flutinas" as "Accordéons". And I do have facimile prints of the early 1800 ads from the manufactorers to back up that oppinion. So I guess that both the Flutina and Accordéon names are correct. Correct me, if I'm wrong. Cheers/Lars Willadsen

[JimLucas]

As I am one of the "experts" who have replied to the eBay seller and now see the topic being brought up here, I think a comment would be in place. Yes - from one point of view it is a Flutina. BUT: The French builders at the time DID advertise their "Flutinas" as "Accordéons". And I do have facimile prints of the early 1800 ads from the manufactorers to back up that oppinion. So I guess that both the Flutina and Accordéon names are correct. Correct me, if I'm wrong.

In the end, I guess it all depends on the point of view you take.

 

From what Stephen C. says, at the time it was built it would not have been considered a "flutina". But maybe "commonly accepted" distinctions have changed over time, as they have with "anglo" concertinas, and the majority of "experts" would now class that instrument as a "flutina"? 30 years ago, most of what we now call "anglos" would not have been included under that term. Specifically, any instrument using the German-style engineering would have been excluded. Those were generally classed as "German" -- even if made in Italy or Czechoslovakia, -- to distinguish them from the real, English-built "anglos", with English-style reeds and actions.

[LarsWilladsen]

Jup, Jim - one point I guess we all agree on is, that the "instrument" is not a concertina.