Big Mystery - Decide For Yourselves

[John Wild]

Having listened to the ‘Bluebell Polka’ link and a copy of the CD from Alan, I can say that I am 99.9% sure that the performer is my father, Henry Joseph (Harry) Crabb.

 

Although he was best known as a maker of concertinas, Dad was for many years an accomplished player and musician, having been ‘put to’ the concertina at the age of 8 years and studying music with the composer and arranger Sydney Baynes*.

 

I just have to say WOW!!

 

I was convinced there were at least two players there.

 

- John Wild

[Dan Worrall]

Hi all,

Having listened to the ‘Bluebell Polka’ link and a copy of the CD from Alan, I can say that I am 99.9% sure that the performer is my father, Henry Joseph (Harry) Crabb.

 

Although he was best known as a maker of concertinas, Dad was for many years an accomplished player and musician, having been ‘put to’ the concertina at the age of 8 years and studying music with the composer and arranger Sydney Baynes*.

 

The instrument used in this rendition was a 59 Key Crane Duet, which he purpose built to suit his own requirements circa 1950. This incorporated auxiliary low notes to suit his repertoire of opera overtures, Sousa marches and light popular music of the day. This instrument is now in the custody of Kurt Brauhn.

 

Geoff Crabb

Mystery solved. Your Dad was quite a player, Geoff, and we are fortunate to have these recordings of him.

I've seen and heard Kurt Braun play that same instrument, and I must say your answer surprised me. Not that I doubt you at all, Geoff; it must be the recording technology that made the bass sound a little less than fully concertina-like.

 

Here is a link that has nice photos of the instrument Harry Crabb played, and of Harry holding it, as well as recordings of Kurt playing it, and a good description of the instrument itself, from Kurt's own website: http://www.scraggy.net/~tina/

 

Nice mystery, and doubly nice to have a definitive answer.

 

Dan

[Alan Day]

This is fantastic news and many thanks Geoff for solving this mystery.

Wonderful playing.

Many thanks to all of you,great fun while it lasted.

You can all see now why I held back to let you know the answer.

I can tell Miss Marple and Poirot thier services are not required

Al

Edited July 8, 2006 by Alan Day

[JimLucas]

I was certainly convinced it was more than one instrument, in part because of what seemed to me the significantly different styles of the right and left hand parts, which convinced me they were being controlled by two different sets of bellows. On Colonel Bogey I'm amazed that the sustained notes in the left hand show no trace of the rapid staccato on the buttons in the right hand affecting the bellows pressure. I've worked on that, but there's always at least a small ripple from the impact of my fingers, no matter how gentle I try to be.

 

Well, it's superbly done, and a great inspiration! I obviously have a lot of practicing to do.

[JimLucas]

...have a listen to a little eleven-year old boy in Wisconsin play "The Concertina Hoedown". http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=330842

 

...The Hoedown number is very, very similar stylistically to the Bluebell piece...you get a very fluid right hand (so fluid as to sound like a two-handed English player), with a precise oom-pah arrangement on the left.

Just my opinion, and not to disparage Tyler, but I don't find his right- and left-hand playing to be anywhere near as distinct as on either Bluebell Polka or Colonel Bogey. IMO, both of his hands are playing mostly fairly staccato (which is good for dancing a polka).

[Gavin Atkin]

Well, I think it's just fabulous news. It's great that these excellent recordings exist - in a way it's a measure of how good the playing is that so many of us were scratching our heads...

 

Gav

[Dirge]

Geoff, you've only heard Bluebell Polka, haven't you? I still think there's more than one player on Colonel Bogey. If that's a solo duet then I'm really impressed.

[malcolm clapp]

Actually, Geoff doesn't actually say that there was no other (accompanying) concertina on the recording.....

 

MC

[Dan Worrall]

...have a listen to a little eleven-year old boy in Wisconsin play "The Concertina Hoedown". http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=330842

 

...The Hoedown number is very, very similar stylistically to the Bluebell piece...you get a very fluid right hand (so fluid as to sound like a two-handed English player), with a precise oom-pah arrangement on the left.

Just my opinion, and not to disparage Tyler, but I don't find his right- and left-hand playing to be anywhere near as distinct as on either Bluebell Polka or Colonel Bogey. IMO, both of his hands are playing mostly fairly staccato (which is good for dancing a polka).

Yes, there is certainly a difference in skill level. I was trying to point out (and could have said it better) that the fluidity of the right hand on Hoedown showed that it was not likely an anglo (lack of frequent or even occasional bellows direction changes), not an English (it didn't seem possible to chord that distinctly in an oom-pah style whilst such a fluid and rapid a melody was being played, given that both had to be shared amongst two hands, as Gordon Cutty's recording demonstrated), and that it might be done on a Chemnitzer. Theodore showed us some sheet music that suggests some players have mastered the Bluebell on that instrument; it would be great fun to hear them. In fact, since we already have recordings of first-class players doing the bluebell on an English and a Crane, wouldn't it be grand to hear some anglo, McCann, Jeffries duet and others try to tackle this piece too? Maybe Alan could release it as 'Bluebell International".

[Alan Day]

I have had a new Email from Geoff and it is in fact only Blue bell Polka that Geoff is attributing to his Father.

The others are possibly other players.

I have mis interpreted Geoff's Email and we are back to square one.

Other Mystery players could be Maurice Harvey etc.

Goodness knows how I could trace Maurice as from the train it looks as if his old house has been demolished.

Sadly I wonder if this mystery will now ever be solved.

Al

Edited July 8, 2006 by Alan Day

[Chris Timson]

I have had a new Email from Geoff and it is in fact only Blue bell Polka that Geoff is attributing to his Father.

And there's me sitting on the news like a good 'un!

 

Geoff, could you tell us if there are any others on the Cd that you think might be your father? Interesting to know for its own sake, and also to know which ones we don't need to worry / argue about.

 

Chris

Edited July 8, 2006 by Chris Timson

[Alan Day]

I have at last caught up with all my emails after leaving early this morning and driving to Wales and back,hence I only read Geoff's posting on C.net this morning and an Email posted to me at the same time which I read this evening.

Geoff has kindly gone through the whole CD and I am sure he will not mind if I post his thoughts and suggestions as to the players on this CD,(please refer to my previous track list)

 

1)Possibly Maurice Harvey (Stephen does this compare with the Maurice Harvey recording you have?) with

Don Gibbs (English Treble)

2)Tommy Williams (approx 1960)

3)Harry Crabb

4)?

5)Group of ICA sight readers who formed up at the meeting as an impromptu group on the day

6)?

7)?

8)?

9 to 14) Patrick Russell (circa 1978) aged about 13.Played English Treble a remarkable player,wherabouts now unknown, played a special Crabb 40 Key made for him (these are poor quality recordings but may be able to be cleaned up)

15/16) could be Tommy Williams

17/18) possible as 1

19) Could be Kensington Group (Which is who I thought it was)

20) Harold Cowlin playing Crabb made McCann Duet with couplers

21)North London Concertina Band early recording 1958 (only part of this recording exists)

 

I will follow this up with Howard Rosenblum as he may be able to use this information as a guide and if any other member of ICA can verify some of these suggestions I would be grateful.Iris Bishop also has early recordings and I will follow that possibility.

Not complete doom and gloom as I previously thought.

What would you all think if we used either some or all of these recordings as "attributed to"

If we can go no further ?

It looks as if our combined theories on what is being played is correct.I do not think a piano accordion would have been at an ICA meeting however.

I would like to thank Geoff for his help and suggestions.

Al

[John Wild]

Geoff has kindly gone through the whole CD and I am sure he will not mind if I post his thoughts and suggestions as to the players on this CD,(please refer to my previous track list)

 

2)Tommy Williams (approx 1960)

I

 

I have a copy of sheet music for 'Impudence', which corresponds closely to what I hear.

Under the title, it states: 'Arr. Tommy Williams (?) for Duet Concertina'. this note would support the above attribution for track 2.

 

Regards

 

John Wild

Edited July 9, 2006 by John Wild

[Chris Drinkwater]

Well, I've already weighed in on the Bluebell -- so far the only one I've heard -- that I definitely think it's at least two players, and possibly three, so I already disagree with you.

 

Perhaps the words "Humble" and "Pie", spring to mind, Jim. Nice to know that Harry Crabb is so accomplished, that he can be mistaken for at least two, possibly three players! From first hearing, I thought it sounded like a duet player but then I've only been playing English concertina for a year and am not very familiar with the intricacies of anglo and duet playing, so who I am I to judge, especially when it comes to the finer points of playing a particular instrument? Sometimes, the less you know, the better the conclusion! And often, one's first thought on a matter proves to be right in the end.

 

Chris

[David Barnert]

In fact, since we already have recordings of first-class players doing the bluebell on an English and a Crane, wouldn't it be grand to hear some anglo, McCann, Jeffries duet and others try to tackle this piece too? Maybe Alan could release it as 'Bluebell International".

I first heard the tune in 1985, played by Paul Van Arsdale on the Hammered Dulcimer.

[JimLucas]

Nice to know that Harry Crabb is so accomplished, that he can be mistaken for at least two, possibly three players!

Indeed. Were he alive today, I'd surely want some lessons from him. I'll certainly be studying that recording in the hope that I can learn something from it.

 

From first hearing, I thought it sounded like a duet player but then.... And often, one's first thought on a matter proves to be right in the end.

And often not. In this case my first thought -- which didn't change until Geoff's post -- seems to have been wrong, even though yours turned out to be right.

 

Sometimes, the less you know, the better the conclusion!

It can happen, but I don't believe that knowing less has ever increased the probability of a correct conclusion.

[Alan Day]

I am going to eat Humble Pie over these recordings ,to me it is the same style throughout,the same oom pah base etc.I thought it was one player hence my jump to conclusions.

It is very difficult as a player to hear fantastic playing and assume it is double tracked or a number of players.Andrew Blakeny Edwards for example playing Scott Joplin.I have some recordings here for English International and I really do not know if they are over dubbed.The abilities of some players never cease to amaze me and it is no wonder that we all reach different decisions when confronted with fantastic playing abilities.

I was hoping that I could find somewhere some unpublished playing of Tommy Williams for Duet International and it looks as though we have.Many thanks for the additional information John.

Al

Edited July 9, 2006 by Alan Day

[PeterT]

I am going to eat Humble Pie over these recordings ,to me it is the same style throughout,the same oom pah base etc.I thought it was one player hence my jump to conclusions.

Let's hope it's a big one, so you can share it around! As you'll see from one of my postings, I was convinced that the first half hour was all the same player.

 

At the time of the recordings on this CD, it probably didn't seem important to note down who was playing. This is a lesson to any of us who record material (as I know to my cost, trying to sort out the 1991 ICA Festival recordings!).

 

Regards,

Peter.