Alan Day Posted June 20, 2006 Share Posted June 20, 2006 I have listed another group of old players that I would be grateful for any information that any of you may know. Harry Boyd (who did bagpipe imitations ) Sam & Betty Aukland, who performed with "Tweet" the singing canary Dutch Daley, a Music Hall artist. Walter Dale, (1929) a superb English System player who I think may be Scottish.I have a wonderful Scottish set of this player that Jim Ward and I compiled this Morning. W. J. Mullaly Billy Roberts of Dublin (playing Claire tunes). Many thanks Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Chambers Posted June 20, 2006 Share Posted June 20, 2006 Al, I mentioned Harry Boyd (born about 1856) of Newcatle to you, in one of my emails, as a genuine Victorian classical concertinist on the English system, though I haven't heard his "bagpipe imitations" . He was performing at least as early as 1888, as he advertised his services as a performer in John Hill Maccann’s Concertinist’s Guide that year. He's best remembered as the man who had all those "H. Boyd" Lachenal's & Wheatstone's made; like Alistair Anderson's one. Sam & Betty Aukland played English too, and performed with "Tweet" the singing canary, there are C.net threads about them here, and here. Dutch Daley, a Music Hall artist, played Anglo, I think Percy Honri had one of his instruments. W. J. Mullaly, from Westmeath, was the first Irish player to record in the 1920's. Unusually, for an Irish player at that time, he played a Wheatstone 3-row Anglo, rather than a German concertina, but he had lived in Lancashire & my theory is that he might have been influenced by that "hotbed of Anglo playing" (thinking of players there similar to Fred Kilroy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peter Laban Posted June 20, 2006 Share Posted June 20, 2006 The Viva Voce cassette of Willie Mullaly's 78 rpms has detailed notes by Harry Bradshaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Day Posted June 20, 2006 Author Share Posted June 20, 2006 Many thanks for all your help Peter and Stephen. Stephen I have replied to you in more detail by Email . Sadly I cannot use the Anglo players on these compilations, but possible very useful information for future projects. I have also received an Email from another Cnet member who has given me additional information. Jim Ward has confirmed that he can clean up the recordings I am interested in from my first enquiry, so good news all round. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 ITMA now has a couple of Billy Roberts recordings from 1929 up on their site and available for listening. (Scroll down to the bottom of the page, then scroll down again within the little playback box.) Definitely worth a listen. Daniel I have listed another group of old players that I would be grateful for any information that any of you may know. Harry Boyd (who did bagpipe imitations ) Sam & Betty Aukland, who performed with "Tweet" the singing canary Dutch Daley, a Music Hall artist. Walter Dale, (1929) a superb English System player who I think may be Scottish.I have a wonderful Scottish set of this player that Jim Ward and I compiled this Morning. W. J. Mullaly Billy Roberts of Dublin (playing Claire tunes). Many thanks Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael sam wild Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hi Alan It's already been on the site about an imminent CD reissue with extra notes of the Mulalley material. Sounds interesting! Cheers Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Worrall Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I have listed another group of old players that I would be grateful for any information that any of you may know. Harry Boyd (who did bagpipe imitations ) Sam & Betty Aukland, who performed with "Tweet" the singing canary Dutch Daley, a Music Hall artist. Walter Dale, (1929) a superb English System player who I think may be Scottish.I have a wonderful Scottish set of this player that Jim Ward and I compiled this Morning. W. J. Mullaly Billy Roberts of Dublin (playing Claire tunes). Many thanks Al Al, Randy Merris wrote a whole article on Dutch Daly in PICA last year...check the ICA site.Randy has also written a bit about Betty Auckland--I think it is in the Appendix of his Dutch Daly article. Billy Roberts played the EC, by the way. He was nearly as early as Mullaly in being the earliest to record Irish music on concertina. (Presumably someone will now mention Irish tunes recorded by an Alexander Prince or some such....but I'm talking about Irish natives recording Irish music.) I wrote a bit about Mullaly's concertina (or not!) in a recent Concertina World, earlier this year (also ICA). I had made contact with Mullaly's grand-nephew in Pennsylvania. Cheers, Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Worrall Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 I have listed another group of old players that I would be grateful for any information that any of you may know. Harry Boyd (who did bagpipe imitations ) Sam & Betty Aukland, who performed with "Tweet" the singing canary Dutch Daley, a Music Hall artist. Walter Dale, (1929) a superb English System player who I think may be Scottish.I have a wonderful Scottish set of this player that Jim Ward and I compiled this Morning. W. J. Mullaly Billy Roberts of Dublin (playing Claire tunes). Many thanks Al Al, Randy Merris wrote a whole article on Dutch Daly in PICA last year...check the ICA site.Randy has also written a bit about Betty Auckland--I think it is in the Appendix of his Dutch Daly article. Billy Roberts played the EC, by the way. He was nearly as early as Mullaly in being the earliest to record Irish music on concertina. (Presumably someone will now mention Irish tunes recorded by an Alexander Prince or some such....but I'm talking about Irish natives recording Irish music.) I wrote a bit about Mullaly's concertina (or not!) in a recent Concertina World, earlier this year (also ICA). I had made contact with Mullaly's grand-nephew in Pennsylvania. There is information there on the imminent re-release of Mullaly's music by ITMA. Cheers, Dan edited to add---I just noticed that this was a 2006 thread, resurrected. For those who resurrect a thread, please mention it in your post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael sam wild Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hi Dan I suppose Alan had been working on the International CDs.. Don't time fly! Any snow in Texas yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Day Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Who resurrects postings from 2006 it's not far off 2010, someone has just done the same on Mudcat and there I was just about to reply and noticed I had done so already and a few posts further on, there I was again. I could remember nothing about it and then noticed it was only a year ago.My sons are jokingly (I think) saying I should have a homing device so that they can track me to see whether I have taken the wrong turning and heading for Scotland. Now what did I do with that canary. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Sorry about that! I will mention it if I bring another old thread back from the grave. I ran across those ITMA Billy Roberts recordings, went to c.net to post something about them, did a search to see if someone else had already mentioned them, found this old thread including Alan's query about Roberts and decide to attach my post to the old thread. Did any of you guys listen to the recordings? I thought that they were an interesting contrast to what Mullaly was doing in the same era, especially in light of the ongoing discussions of what really constitutes authentic Irish concertina playing. Dan, thanks for mentioning that Roberts played English concertina -- I suspected that from the recordings but wasn't sure. Daniel I just noticed that this was a 2006 thread, resurrected. For those who resurrect a thread, please mention it in your post! Who resurrects postings from 2006 it's not far off 2010, someone has just done the same on Mudcat and there I was just about to reply and noticed I had done so already and a few posts further on, there I was again. I could remember nothing about itand then noticed it was only a year ago.My sons are jokingly (I think) saying I should have a homing device so that they can track me to see whether I have taken the wrong turning and heading for Scotland. Now what did I do with that canary. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Worrall Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Hi Dan I suppose Alan had been working on the International CDs.. Don't time fly! Any snow in Texas yet? Well as a matter of fact, yes. Last week we had the earliest snowfall ever recorded in the 170 years or so since Houston was founded. We usually see snow only every four years or so. I'm sure some of those fellers in Copenhagen can explain why! My steer calves were none too happy with it...you can see them here, grumbling over all that unknown white trash falling on their nice green grass! Best, Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael sam wild Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Spooky Dan! Al I know how you feel I'm like that goldfish swimming round the bowl 'Hey look at that galleon and that treaure chest!'.......' Hey look etc etc. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asdormire Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Hi Dan I suppose Alan had been working on the International CDs.. Don't time fly! Any snow in Texas yet? Well as a matter of fact, yes. Last week we had the earliest snowfall ever recorded in the 170 years or so since Houston was founded. We usually see snow only every four years or so. I'm sure some of those fellers in Copenhagen can explain why! My steer calves were none too happy with it...you can see them here, grumbling over all that unknown white trash falling on their nice green grass! Best, Dan I didn't know you ran any cattle, Dan. How may head? Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Edgley Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Quote - Daniel Hersh: "...discussions of what really constitutes authentic Irish concertina playing." I guess that would depend on what you define as "authentic concertina playing." eg. traditional vs. ", authentic?", perhaps? Just about any of the "names" playing concertina in Ireland today would be authentic, in spite of their individual style. Traditional is another matter. Few of the modern era big names would be traditional-style concertina players, as their heavily-laden embellished style would not have been heard one or two generations ago. I won't mention any names, and this is certainly not meant as any form of criticism, but traditionally, embellishments were not a big part of the playing of concertinas a few generations ago. Some big names still play a simpler, very melodic style, like Mary McNamara, for example. I would say her style is traditional and authentic, while others are authentic. But maybe it just depends on how you define the terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael sam wild Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 (edited) There are several threads on this topic at the moment. All interesting. Peter Laban put his finger on the fact that the music mostly played was for dancing and therefore rhythm and lift were primary ( and I suppose volume!) Howver musicians like to get together and also to play at home on their own where other considerations apply. I wonder how much the competitions pushed embellishment and repertoire? Edited December 14, 2009 by michael sam wild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Worrall Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Hi Dan I suppose Alan had been working on the International CDs.. Don't time fly! Any snow in Texas yet? Well as a matter of fact, yes. Last week we had the earliest snowfall ever recorded in the 170 years or so since Houston was founded. We usually see snow only every four years or so. I'm sure some of those fellers in Copenhagen can explain why! My steer calves were none too happy with it...you can see them here, grumbling over all that unknown white trash falling on their nice green grass! Best, Dan I didn't know you ran any cattle, Dan. How may head? Alan Alan, One must never ask a Texan how many cattle he has...it is considered quite impolite! There must be an Buckeye-land equivalent for such a faux pas, but I cannot come up with it. The worst thing you can say about a Texan, by the way, is that he is "all hat and no cattle!" At least I have dodged that one...barely. Back on topic, what is "traditional" depends on the generation. A generation before Mary MacNamara, when concertina players in Ireland were playing even more simply, in octaves on German concertinas for house dances, her playing would have been considered fresh and new. And of course, back then--we're talking late nineteenth to very earliest twentieth century--the word "traditional" would have little meaning...they didn't much use it, from what I can see. Let's remember that set dances (= quadrilles), waltzes, polkas, the banjo and the concertina were all derided as modern "foreign" influences by the Gaelic League...hardly the stuff of tradition, let alone authentic. But lots of fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael sam wild Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 (edited) Good point Dan. It shows how a political movement can also force or encourage particular things into a national movement. I bet the sets were still being danced despite the politicos and the church though. I wonder if it was a new revival spurred on by recordings , TV Riverdance etc that led to the latest resurgance of set dancing and performance. Here in Britain we don't seem to have the same reaction to a foreign domination. Our revivals seem to reflect vaguer cultural threats to 'Britishness' Edited December 15, 2009 by michael sam wild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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