dpmccabe Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 I need to lubricate the action (riveted) on a button that's squeeking. What kind of lubricant is best for this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Stout Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 Everything I've read says that lubrication will attract dirt. I'd guess that you need to clean the action rather than lubricating it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickcyclist Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 Everything I've read says that lubrication will attract dirt. Is this really true? Meaning, is it something that people have tried and experienced, or a myth that is perpetuated because it's written down somewhere then oft repeated? My absolute first instinct would be to lubricate something that was sticking, albeit using a very cautious amount of lubricant. Why are concertinas an exception to this rule? By the way, I don't intend to come across as challenging or arsey, I'm just curious about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 May I suggest just a touch of Pledge Polish. It has a silicon base and will dry so as not to attract dust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 May I suggest just a touch of Pledge Polish. It has a silicon base and will dry so as not to attract dust. But because Pledge Polish is a fairly thick liquid it might not penetrate the joint effectivly. I've had good results using a tiny quantity of WD40 sprayed into a container and then applied with an artists fine paintbrush. Take great care not to let it run down the post and soak into the wood. The solvent carrier evaporates after a day or two and leaves a thin film of non-sticky lubricant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Barnert Posted June 6, 2006 Share Posted June 6, 2006 Two points: The dictum about not using lubricants has often been repeated by folks who should know, so I believe it even though I have no personal experience with it. DoN Nichols, for instance, says that any lubricant may find its way out of the place where you applied it and into places where it will undermine the glues that hold wood and/or leather together. Are you sure it's the riveted action that's squeaking? Look closely at the pads and make sure one isn't rubbing against its neighbor. That has been the source of every concertina squeak I have ever investigated. The treatment is to stop them from rubbing (i.e., gently bend a lever), not to lubricate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d.elliott Posted June 8, 2006 Share Posted June 8, 2006 I have experience of oiled pivots, they attract dust, well not attractas i to draw in, but any dust or fibre particles comming in contact stick, the whole lot gets very fuzzy. If needs must, I use (paint on as described above) silicon based electrical contact cleaner/ lubricant, and wipe off all excess. I would even tend to steer clear of WD40 in this application. Remember that even light machine and watch/ clock oils are designed to coat and stay forming a boundary lubrication film. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted June 8, 2006 Share Posted June 8, 2006 (edited) Without trying to second guess those that know more than me, (if it is a metal to metal squeak). In another hobby, in another industry we came accross a similar problem. Couldn't use liquid lubricant because of soft wood surrounding metal parts. We found a graphite based lube used for key/lock applications worked well. It went on dry. After a while we started to use a regular number 2 pencil and rubbed it onto the offending squeak and it went away. A pencil is also pure graphite. Now when we have a squeak, or the squeak comes back, we just "work it out with a pencil", and it don't cost much since the pencil lasts so long. The advantages: dry, no carrier, generally stays put, and if we got too much on the area we just blew it off and started over. After a few applications the graphite builds up and we didn't need to do it again, maybe 3 or 4 times. I think it bonds with the metal? The only detriment I can think of is if you get too much in your concertina, then it might mess up the electronics, since it's electrically conductive. ) Another pencil application we found useful is the eraser end is good for removing rust and polishing steel, (maybe reeds that start to discolor). It doesn't remove metal just polishes or burnishes. If we needed stronger polishing, we used an ink eraser charged with graphite (more abrasive). It created a nice polishing lap, then put the pieces back together, and no more squeak. Does anybody think this procedure would work in this application or not? Thanks for listening Leo csan't speil too good eever Edited June 9, 2006 by Leo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpmccabe Posted June 9, 2006 Author Share Posted June 9, 2006 May I suggest just a touch of Pledge Polish. It has a silicon base and will dry so as not to attract dust. But because Pledge Polish is a fairly thick liquid it might not penetrate the joint effectivly. I've had good results using a tiny quantity of WD40 sprayed into a container and then applied with an artists fine paintbrush. Take great care not to let it run down the post and soak into the wood. The solvent carrier evaporates after a day or two and leaves a thin film of non-sticky lubricant. This technique solved the problem for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 Leo, Yes powdered graphite is great stuff, but on its own may not be able to penetrate the interior of a concertina pivot. Graphite based lock lube would be ideal if it did not include oil. Powdered graphite is easy to obtain, so I may well try making up my own "penetrating graphite" by suspending graphite in a solvent. Anyone tried this already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 Leo, Yes powdered graphite is great stuff, but on its own may not be able to penetrate the interior of a concertina pivot. Graphite based lock lube would be ideal if it did not include oil. Powdered graphite is easy to obtain, so I may well try making up my own "penetrating graphite" by suspending graphite in a solvent. Anyone tried this already? Thank you for noticing. Didn't think solvent would be good for the action, however you reminded me of making a solution. Isopropl alchohol (the rubbing kind) would suspend the graphite and would allow it to travel and evaporate with no residue. The mix: a drop of alchohol on a q tip swab and squirt on dry graphite works. Thanks again and hope it opens up other ideas that might work better Leo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 Thank you for noticing. Didn't think solvent would be good for the action, however you reminded me of making a solution. Isopropl alchohol (the rubbing kind) would suspend the graphite and would allow it to travel and evaporate with no residue. The mix: a drop of alchohol on a q tip swab and squirt on dry graphite works. Perhaps instead of "solvent" I should have said "volatile liquid". Applying the liquid and graphite separately is a great idea. Thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 Thank you for noticing. Didn't think solvent would be good for the action, however you reminded me of making a solution. Isopropl alchohol (the rubbing kind) would suspend the graphite and would allow it to travel and evaporate with no residue. The mix: a drop of alchohol on a q tip swab and squirt on dry graphite works. Perhaps instead of "solvent" I should have said "volatile liquid". Applying the liquid and graphite separately is a great idea. Thanks for sharing. Forgot: Graphite is free. Sandpaper or file off the end of a pencil, mix with caution. Don't want to blow out a tube in those pre transistor antique concertinas Leo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Morse Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 A pencil is also pure graphite.Not true. Pencil lead is a combination of graphite, clay and carbon black (lamp soot). I wonder if you use a pencil lead that's high in clay or carbon black content that you might eventually have binding issues under high humidity? At any rate, if you go for pencil lead, keep in mind the grade of pencil. The European grades are designated with H (for Hard, which is made that way by adding clay and firing it stiff), B (for Black, which is the added carbon), and F (for Fine, meaning that it can be sharpened well, probably a combination having a high clay and carbon content but less graphite). The higher the numbers the more the additive (an HHHHH or 5H lead has a *lot* of clay). Americans use numbers to designate grades with 1 being very black (high carbon) to #5 being moderately hard (high clay). The grade with the highest graphite content is probably a single B lead. If you want serious graphite in a lead try finding a "Dur-O-Lite" pencil with "mark sense" or "electrographic" leads - very high graphite content to record data on punchcards (graphite is an electrical condutor). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leo Posted June 9, 2006 Share Posted June 9, 2006 A pencil is also pure graphite.Not true. Pencil lead is a combination of graphite, clay and carbon black (lamp soot). I wonder if you use a pencil lead that's high in clay or carbon black content that you might eventually have binding issues under high humidity? At any rate, if you go for pencil lead, keep in mind the grade of pencil. The European grades are designated with H (for Hard, which is made that way by adding clay and firing it stiff), B (for Black, which is the added carbon), and F (for Fine, meaning that it can be sharpened well, probably a combination having a high clay and carbon content but less graphite). The higher the numbers the more the additive (an HHHHH or 5H lead has a *lot* of clay). Americans use numbers to designate grades with 1 being very black (high carbon) to #5 being moderately hard (high clay). The grade with the highest graphite content is probably a single B lead. If you want serious graphite in a lead try finding a "Dur-O-Lite" pencil with "mark sense" or "electrographic" leads - very high graphite content to record data on punchcards (graphite is an electrical condutor). Didn't know that! Thanks for the more in depth explaination. Wouldn't want to bind up my nice Morse English Concertina. Now if only I can only make the keys stay put and stop them from wandering from under my fingers.... Leo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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