Sudden flat note on a Wren Anglo

[ThatFrenchSeaman]

Hello there good folks,

 

After some weeks without playing, I picked up my Wren Anglo concertina to practice and noticed that one note (the G on the push stroke if that matters) has gotten quite flat, and is very much annoying to the ear when playing chords.

I disassembled everything, clean the particles and debris inside and scrapped between the reel and the support with paper as well as thin feeler gauges (perks of being a mechanic enthusiast). I also lifted the reed with a screwdriver so that the gape between the tongue and the hole was wider. This seemed to improve things for approximately one minute of playing, after which the note went flat again. Or maybe it wasn't really better, not sure.

 

Anyway, I know that removing material from the reed flattens the note, but how to sharpen it, if it's even possible. The reed is well fixed by its rivet.

I know that it's a delicate procedure but since it's a cheap Wren, I'm willing to go experimental on it, if it can play in tune at the end of the road.

 

I can had pictures if needed.

Thanks in advance and have a jolly day.

Edited March 7 by ThatFrenchSeaman

[Tiposx]

“Sounds” like the reed tongue is cracked and needs replacing. If it keeps on getting flatter then that is definitive.

[Cathasach]

To sharpen you can remove material from the tip instead of the middle as you would to flatten. Here's a tutorial for an accordion: 

https://accordionknowhow.wordpress.com/filing-reeds/

[Don Taylor]

1 hour ago, Cathasach said:

Here's a tutorial for an accordion: 

https://accordionknowhow.wordpress.com/filing-reeds/

Written by Edward Jay, is this the same Edward Jay who makes concertinas?

 

Thanks for the link.  I think that anyone owning an accordion reeded concertina might find the complete list of pages at Edward's site worth saving:

https://accordionknowhow.wordpress.com/?pages-list

 

[David Barnert]

9 hours ago, ThatFrenchSeaman said:

After some weeks without playing, I picked up my Wren Anglo concertina to practice and noticed that one note ... has gotten quite flat

 

8 hours ago, Tiposx said:

“Sounds” like the reed tongue is cracked and needs replacing. If it keeps on getting flatter then that is definitive.

 

I agree. The first thing I thought of when I read the opening post was a reed fracture, and if that’s what it is, trying to retune it won’t get you anywhere. Look closely at the reed, perhaps with a magnifying glass, and you’ll likely discover a hairline from one long edge of the reed to the other, perhaps at a diagonal. The only thing to do is replace it. There’s really no other likely explanation for why a reed would suddenly go out of tune like that.

[fiddler2007]

Quote

suddenly go out of tune

 

If its a warping type out of tune check if the reed plate sits flat and fitted air-tight to the chamber.

Edited March 7 by fiddler2007

[ThatFrenchSeaman]

Thank you all for your quick and informative answers, it's quite fun learning about concertina troubleshooting !

 

Since I don't have a magnifying glass at the moment, I only looked at the reed bare-eyed, but didn't see any cracks (it's the lowest reed on the first pic below). 

 

 

I tried to sharpen the note by following the tutorial and it seems to do the trick for now, wait and see if it flattens again in the future.

As for the advice of Mr Fiddler2007, I think everything is flat and quite air-tight due to the design of this concertina the reed pan cannot move a lot.

 

Again thank you for your help, the documentation for Edward Jay was exactly what I was unable to find during my research.

Have a good day !

[Tiposx]

I am not sure if you mean the lowest placed in the first photo, or the lowest tone.

The longest reed in the first photo (top of the photo. lowest pitch) does look diagonally cracked to me. But I may well be wrong. I hope it stays at the current pitch!

[Matthew Heumann]

I have found that my most common cause of a note going flat is not the reed, but the valve not functioning properly, in which case I replace them and Bob's Your Uncle.

[d.elliott]

Most of my experience is on 'proper' concertina reeds, but if you are looking for a crack then flex the reed tongue gently and study the reflection of light on its underside (smooth side) and look for a discontinuity of the reflection.

[ThatFrenchSeaman]

Update, after some days without problem, the note got flat again. Tried to retune it but no luck this time.

So the cracked hypothesis seems correct, i'm in for a replacement.

 

Quote

 flex the reed tongue gently and study the reflection of light on its underside (smooth side) and look for a discontinuity of the reflection.

The underside of the reed is strangely dark so I didn't manage to see anything, but i'll keep looking next time I disassemble it.

Again thanks all for your help !

[David Lay]

If he needs to buy one reed shoe, where is the best place to get it, assuming McNeela does not stock them? 

Perhaps an accordion shop would be a possibility.  These are diatonic:

https://www.libertybellows.com/shop/c/p/34-or-31-Button-Diatonic-Accordion-Treble-Reed---Fits-Hohner-Corona-Anacleto-x43045638.htm

(There are several accordion tunings revealed when you tap the icons, so some searching may yield the right one.)

Edited March 13 by David Lay

[Tiposx]

A melodeon repairer. Or someone who works on modern hybrid concertinas should be able to help.

A piano accordion reed can be modified as a last resort.