New Morse Ceili vs circa 1924 Lachnal

[Laurence Furr]

Hello. I am new to this forum. I play Celtic harp but new to concertina. As the title implies, I am trying to decide between a new Morse Ceili (yes, I found one) vs. a Lachenal which was restored by Greg J eight years ago and owned by a woman near me. I know the differences in reeds and vintage vs new, etc. I know it’s subjective - but what would YOU do/recommend in this case. Again, I am a professional musician (pipe organ and Celtic harp) but complete novice with concertina. (The Morse is 1K more than the Lachenal.) 

PS - both 30 button Anglo.

Edited June 10, 2024 by Laurence Furr
Added a line of info.

[Tiposx]

This could become controversial!

I haven't played a Ceili, but have owned a Morse Geordie and a Morse Albion. I have owned and played many Lachenals, both ec and anglo from tutor through to Edeophone.

I would recommend a Morse, but personally I would prefer a really good Lachenal.

That should set the ball rolling...

 

[Leah Velleman]

Honestly, this depends on what factors are most important to you personally.

I had a chance to try a Ceili recently and the thing that jumped out at me was that it is astonishingly light. I play standing up for morris, so that would be a big deal for me. Less of a factor for you, I imagine.

[Laurence Furr]

Yes. It is very subjective. I’m sort of taking a poll. Just interested in what different people on this forum would choose and for what reason. Thanks!

[Leah Velleman]

Got it.

 

I'd probably go with a Lachenal, lightness of the Ceili notwithstanding. The Ceili has a very harmonica-like sound, which makes sense given its reeds, and some people do like that, but it's not what I prefer. I'd be more undecided if they were the same price, but a sound I like better at $1,000 cheaper feels like the obvious winner to me. 

[Ken_Coles]

I own both. The Lachenal sounds nice, but does need constant attention and fussing (well, OK, now and then, but often without warning). My Ceili I have been playing for 23 years and it is still in great shape. I really don't find the difference in tone to be all that significant, but others do. I find I tend to favor modern instruments for regular use due to reliability and access to the original maker for repairs. Others here are the opposite and would prefer an antique instrument every time. You just have to find out which sort of player you are. Good luck, either will serve you well.

 

Ken

[Peter Laban]

It, ofcourse,  also depends on what model of Lachenal : rosewood ended, metal ended etc etc. Not all concertina were made equal, different ranges of quality, specifications   prices etc. So 'Lachenal' in itself is not enough to give e advice on.

 

The only thing for it is to sit down with both concertinas and see which you like best.

 

 

Edited June 10, 2024 by Peter Laban

[Tiposx]

I should have given a reason for my choices of course. If I was playing itm in a fast session the Morse would be ideal - very fast, loud and light. The tone isn’t really an issue in that setting, as nobody is really listening! Most listeners, even concertina types, can’t identify what type of concertina is being played

If I was playing alone, or with a friend, and breakneck speed wasn’t quite as important, I would prefer the tone of a good Lachenal or similar.

I have both sorts of instruments, both have their strengths. It is such a personal choice.

[AndyNT]

6 hours ago, Ken_Coles said:

I favour modern instruments for regular use due to reliability and access to the original maker for repairs.

Same with me. My band and morris instruments (concertina & melodeon) are all modern for this reason. 

So if you are intending to play the concertina in a 'professional' setting then I'd lean towards the Morse. If it is more for personal use and learning, then the lower price Lachenal is probably more attractive.

 

I'd try to listen to both of them, before making any decision.

 

[Wolf Molkentin]

7 hours ago, Peter Laban said:

It, ofcourse,  also depends on what model of Lachenal : rosewood ended, metal ended etc etc. Not all concertina were made equal, different ranges of quality, specifications   prices etc. So 'Lachenal' in itself is not enough to give e advice on.

 

The only thing for it is to sit down with both concertinas and see which you like best.

agreed 

 

but only to add: should the Lachenal not appear the clear winner soundwise, look for a better one of those

[Jim Besser]

I play both, and my answer is that it depends on what you are looking for.

 

In terms of sound, I hugely prefer the higher end Lachenal, although the ceili sounds more concertina-like than the other hybrids I've played.  But this is true only for the CG; the GD is very accordion or harmonica like.  This is all subjective; I've played with some people who prefer the sound of my ceilis.

 

Reliability: it's a draw.  The old Lachenal can be finicky, but the Ceili has waxed in accordion reeds, which can be a problem when they get brittle, or when the instrument gets bumped hard. I've never had a mechanical  problem with my ceilis, but I have had popped out reeds.  Pick your poison.

 

Playability - the ceili probably has an edge over a standard Lachenal.. The ceili's riveted action is very efficient and fast (but my Lachenal was retrofitted with Dipper mechanism, and is truly outstanding in this regard.)

 

Other factors:  the Ceili is very loud and very light, which is why it's my primary Morris dance instrument.

 

Overall, I prefer playing the Lachenal, but the ceili gets a lot of use in my Morris playing, and is an excellent backup instrument.

 

If the ceili is $1000 more, if it was me I'd probably go for the Lachenal, especially because it passed through Greg's hands; he's a wizard at restoring/maintaining these.

[Laurence Furr]

UPDATE: Thank you, everyone, for your thoughts and time. After a lot of reading, talking with people, and reading your responses, I have chosen to buy the new Morse Ceili. It has a five year warranty which makes me relax a bit. Also, I live in north Texas and there are no known repair shops of concertina reeds in this area. Can’t wait to get it in my hands and start learning. I’ll take a few online lessons and then take the fundamentals class at O’Flaherty’s in October. Sláinte!

[Capt Thighbiter]

I too just got a new Morse Celi, assembled from Morse parts by Bob Snope.  Delivered literally last night.  I spent about an hour with it after dinner.  I am coming off 12 years or so playing on a 20 button D/G Stagi, so the difference is quite striking.  The Celi's action is so much quicker and sure feeling,  much less air needed to note - not surprising, the Celi is a single reed, the Stagi is a double reed  The Celi seems a tad heavier, have to get the kitchen scale out and weigh the 2 of them.  It will take some time for me to get used to the overall feel of the Celi, button spacing is tighter, buttons are a bit smaller and take less pressure to open a valve then the Stagi, and the 'throw' is also much shorter, so I am using way too much pressure on the buttons. The air button placement is different.  All of these will just take getting used to the Celi.  Fit and finish on the Celi is worlds higher, the bellows in particular are so much better made (at this point the Stagi's bellows are pretty much duct tape more then anything).  Lawrence, I hope you like your Celi as much as I do.