Harmonium reeds vs concertina reeds for a bass concertina and for Basse aux peids.

[Bassconcertina.net]

Hello, I'm building a bass concertina and a basse aux peids. Im going to order reeds from harmonicaz.cz, and I need to know which type of reeds is going to be better for each of them, concertina reeds or harmonium reeds.  

 

           Thanks!

[Łukasz Martynowicz]

I would go with normal reeds for concertina and harmonium reeds for foot bass, if only because you cannot really fit harmonium reeds into concertina and I prefer having variety of timbres available. 

[Bassconcertina.net]

8 hours ago, Łukasz Martynowicz said:

I would go with normal reeds for concertina and harmonium reeds for foot bass, if only because you cannot really fit harmonium reeds into concertina and I prefer having variety of timbres available. 

Ok, but just to be sure you noticed that this is BASS concertina I’m talking about too. And harmonium reeds are commonly used in them but I’m interested to see what a really low pitch concertina reed would sound like so we’ll go with what you said. Thanks!

[Steve Schulteis]

For their original concertina reeds, size 4 reeds start getting tips weighted at A#2. When I was communicating with them, they had one size bigger.

[Łukasz Martynowicz]

10 hours ago, Bassconcertina.net said:

Ok, but just to be sure you noticed that this is BASS concertina I’m talking about too. And harmonium reeds are commonly used in them but I’m interested to see what a really low pitch concertina reed would sound like so we’ll go with what you said. Thanks!

 

9 hours ago, Steve Schulteis said:

For their original concertina reeds, size 4 reeds start getting tips weighted at A#2. When I was communicating with them, they had one size bigger.

Yes, I have noticed. But I’m not shure if you are aware - harmonikas.cz „concertina original” reeds are not proper concertina reeds, they only have dovetailed shoe and screws instead of rivets, but they have trapezoid tongues and DIX shaped parallel walls slots. They do not have tapered slots and while they sound more concertina like thanks to the brass shoe, they do not sound exactly like concertina reeds. 
 

And ignore my first post, I was thinking about helicon bass reeds instead of harmonium reeds. You most certainly can fit harmonium reeds in concertina and it will even be easier to do. 

[Steve Schulteis]

1 minute ago, Łukasz Martynowicz said:

Yes, I have noticed. But I’m not shure if you are aware - harmonikas.cz „concertina original” reeds are not proper concertina reeds, they only have dovetailed shoe and screws instead of rivets, but they have trapezoid tongues and DIX shaped parallel walls slots. They do not have tapered slots and while they sound more concertina like thanks to the brass shoe, they do not sound exactly like concertina reeds. 

 

Yup, this is accurate. I think there's a case to be made that, for most people, the "concertina original" reeds don't really have an advantage over their riveted "concertina" reeds. Even the DIX accordion reeds aren't supposed to differ in tongue/slot geometry from the concertina reeds, so the main reasons you might prefer the concertina reeds are the method of installation and the brass shoes.

 

Dana Johnson has instructions for tapering the reed slots that he'll share if you ask him. I haven't tried it myself yet, so I can't comment on the effect.

[Łukasz Martynowicz]

29 minutes ago, Steve Schulteis said:

 

Yup, this is accurate. I think there's a case to be made that, for most people, the "concertina original" reeds don't really have an advantage over their riveted "concertina" reeds. Even the DIX accordion reeds aren't supposed to differ in tongue/slot geometry from the concertina reeds, so the main reasons you might prefer the concertina reeds are the method of installation and the brass shoes.

 

Dana Johnson has instructions for tapering the reed slots that he'll share if you ask him. I haven't tried it myself yet, so I can't comment on the effect.

 

That is something I wondered myself - all brass DIX reeds are identical in tongue/slot geometry and materials. My brass DIX accordion are cheapest of the bunch, sound great and are relatively easy to design the reedpan for. "DIX concertina" require traditional reedpan, but I imagine, that they sound quite similar to accordion variant but I can see the advantage of smaller box possible with them, or that can be used to refurbish an antique box. But "DIX concertina original" are a curious beast, because the only real difference to "DIX concertina" is increased price... Unless their dimensions and angles differ, I haven't made a thorough comparison of those.

[Steve Schulteis]

42 minutes ago, Łukasz Martynowicz said:

But "DIX concertina original" are a curious beast, because the only real difference to "DIX concertina" is increased price... Unless their dimensions and angles differ, I haven't made a thorough comparison of those.

 

I haven't personally compared them, but my understanding is that there's no difference aside from how the tongues are secured. I think the "original" shoes/frames would be attractive if you were planning to make your own tongues, since it would be easier to install them (and to taper the slot with no tongue installed).

[Łukasz Martynowicz]

4 minutes ago, Steve Schulteis said:

 

I haven't personally compared them, but my understanding is that there's no difference aside from how the tongues are secured. I think the "original" shoes/frames would be attractive if you were planning to make your own tongues, since it would be easier to install them (and to taper the slot with no tongue installed).

 

It is rather hard to make trapezoid tongues by hand... All concertina reeds have tongues simply cut from a longer strip of spring steel. But you're right about removing the tongue for tapering, I haven't thought of that. I wonder however if tapering trapezoid slot doesn't worsen the response and sound, since tapering performs the same duty as trapezoid shape.

[Bassconcertina.net]

The main reason that I want concertina or harmonium reeds is because there single action.