Sussex Cotillion

[Jim Besser]

Just hacking around on a dreary winters day.  This: the Sussex Cotillion.   A great tune for playing around with different left hand stuff. Played on a Jeffries 30 button GD Anglo

 

 

[Robin Harrison]

Always nice to hear you play Jim...........it's a cracker of a tune.

              Here is the complete tune with the 3rd and 4th parts for anyone interested ..... (I think you probably know this though and I know you have the  attached .pdf !)

            Robin

      

Chain Cotillion.pdf

[Roger Hare]

1 hour ago, Robin Harrison said:

...Here is the complete tune with the 3rd and 4th parts for anyone interested...

Thank you. Do you have an ABC copy of the PDF you posted? I have several copies of this

tune, all with only the A and B music.

 

Ta.

[John Wild]

Does this help?

I have just typed up the last 2 parts. Possibly some proof reading might be sensible.

 

X:194
T:Chain Cotillion
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:G
P:A
"G" G4 "D" d4|"G" B2AB G2AB|"C" c2B2 "D" A2G2|"D" F2 EF D3D|"Em" E4 "D" F4|"C" GFGA "G" G2d2|"G" B2AG "D" A2GF|"G" G6z2:||
P:B
|:"G" dedc B2d2|"G" dedc B2d2|"C" e2d2 e2f2|"G" g4 "D" d2ef|"Em" g2fe "D" d2cB|"C" e2dc "G" B2AB|
"C" c2B2 "D" A2G2|"D" F2EF D2D2|"Em" E4 "D" F4|"C" GFGA "G" G2d2|"G" B2AG "D" A2GF|"G" G6z2:|
P:C
|:"G" gfga g2 d2|"G" g6 d2|"G" Bc d2 Bc d2|"G" BcBA G2 d2|
"G" gfga g2 d2|"G" g6 d2|"G" Bc d2 Bc d2|1"D" d6 d2:|2"G" B6z2|
P:D
|:"G" B2 A2 "D" A2 Bc|"D" d6 g2|"G" d2d2 d2 cB|"D" AGAB A2 GA|
"G" BcBA GABc|"D" dcde d2 g2|"G" B2 g2 GABA|1"G" G6 B2|2"G" G6z2:|
N:Typed into ABC from notation by Robin Harrison
N:mrrr@ympatico.ca

[Roger Hare]

28 minutes ago, John Wild said:

Does this help?

I have just typed up the last 2 parts. Possibly some proof reading might be sensible...

That's very kind of you. Saves me doing it myself (which is what would

have happened). Thank you very much!

 

R

 

 

[Jim Besser]

10 hours ago, Robin Harrison said:

Always nice to hear you play Jim...........it's a cracker of a tune.

              Here is the complete tune with the 3rd and 4th parts for anyone interested ..... (I think you probably know this though and I know you have the  attached .pdf !)

            Robin

      

 

Hi Robin - no, I never saw this - is it in the Toronto book? Mostly, I don't look at notation, and had no idea there were 2 more parts.  I've heard the tune on and off for years, and think I played it at a London session or two, but only decided to play it this week after hearing the high energy version by melodeon player Will Allen.

 

So is it english or french canadian?  One Web source says it "first appears in manuscripts on both sides of the Atlantic in the mid-18th century." It doesn't sound quebecois to me.

 

I love stories like this.

Edited February 18, 2021 by Jim Besser

[Robin Harrison]

Haha Jim.........yes , it's #1 in my Toronto trad. English Session book which I know you have !

     I heard it first 20 or so years ago here in Paris, Ontario played by an anglo player who lived in Sussex and was visiting............ and he played the 2 part version.

   During the course of some online research for my session book I discovered the 4-part version on a page of French Cotillions.

             I was most surprised........and the pleasure comes from the nature of the second two parts. To my ear they give it a Baroque feel to the tune. 

             I was never able to find the page again but the title they gave the tune was "Chain Cotillion"

     Cheers.......Robin

         

[Jim Besser]

3 hours ago, Robin Harrison said:

 

             I was never able to find the page again but the title they gave the tune was "Chain Cotillion"

     Cheers.......Robin

         

 

The last two parts are cool; I'll give them a try.

 

Turns out it's also a favorite tune for pipe bands, as in this: 

 

 

[Robin Harrison]

This a recording I just did with my melodeon...............it was always our opening, finger - loosening tune in Toronto.

        There is a majesty to this tune...we played it at a fairly measured tempo.

       I think it's a glorious session tune !

Robin 

Chain Cotillion

[Jim Besser]

4 minutes ago, Robin Harrison said:

This a recording I just did with my melodeon...............it was always our opening, finger - loosening tune in Toronto.

        There is a majesty to this tune...we played it at a fairly measured tempo.

       I think it's a glorious session tune !

Robin 

Chain Cotillion

 

Splendid! Thanks.  I can't tell you how much I miss playing tunes with you.

 

[Roger Hare]

1 hour ago, Jim Besser said:

Turns out it's also a favorite tune for pipe bands...

Yes, one of the ABC versions I have is an arrangement for two flutes (I think) from a batch of tunes

for (I guess) a military re-enactment outfit. Even played through a crummy MIDI player, it sounds rather

nice...

 

The whole file of 100+ tunes, including the Cotillion is here.

[Little John]

On 2/17/2021 at 6:14 PM, Jim Besser said:

This: the Sussex Cotillion.   A great tune for playing around with different left hand stuff.

 

First Jim, thanks for introducing me to this tune. Nice to hear the Bm in the B music. That chord, and Am, are too often neglected. (Mainly, I think, because the standard D/G melodeon doesn't have them!)

 

Anyway, inspired by this and having printed Robin Harrison's music I then had a bit of a hunt about and discovered something curious. Firstly, although all the sheet music I found (apart from on Google images) used the name "Chain Cotillion" on YouTube the name "Sussex Cotillion" was much more common. (Incidentally Paul Hardy's Session Tunebook is the only other one I found with four parts.)

 

Now with so many versions to both read and listen to there are naturally some differences. With one exception they could all be described as variations and would be perfectly interchangeable. The one exception was the last note in bar 6 of the A music (and the equivalent place in the B music). As written down every "Sussex" version has C and every "Chain" version has D (except the one on The Session). These are not really interchangeable as the harmonies you would choose are different.

 

To add a bit of confusion, Robin's written music has D but in his recording he plays C. And I'm going to call it the "Sussex Cotillion" (nicer name) but play the D (which I think is more interesting).

 

LJ

[Jim Besser]

1 hour ago, Little John said:

 

First Jim, thanks for introducing me to this tune. Nice to hear the Bm in the B music. That chord, and Am, are too often neglected. (Mainly, I think, because the standard D/G melodeon doesn't have them!)

 

Anyway, inspired by this and having printed Robin Harrison's music I then had a bit of a hunt about and discovered something curious. Firstly, although all the sheet music I found (apart from on Google images) used the name "Chain Cotillion" on YouTube the name "Sussex Cotillion" was much more common. (

 

Interesting research, for sure!  Fascinating how tunes migrate and change until the origins become murky.

 

And yes, I have a strong penchant for adding Bm chords with reckless abandon.

[David Barnert]

3 hours ago, Little John said:

To add a bit of confusion, Robin's written music has D but in his recording he plays C.

Indeed.

 

Robin! Sadly, I’ve never been to one of your Toronto sessions (I have the book), but I’ve heard for decades that you were a stickler for playing tunes as they appear in print. Have I heard wrong? 

[David Barnert]

4 hours ago, Little John said:

These are not really interchangeable as the harmonies you would choose are different.

You could reasonably put a D or D7 under either of them.

[Little John]

25 minutes ago, David Barnert said:

You could reasonably put a D or D7 under either of them.

 

Yes, but either way you get a D7. I have something of an aversion to using sevenths by default. I will use them only occasionally to add deliberate tension - usually in a slow air.

 

To clarify, using D or D7 under the last note of the bar (C) would result in a D7. However I would be looking for a chord to harmonise both the third and fourth notes in the bar. So G and D ("Sussex") suggests a G chord whilst G and C ("Chain") suggests a C chord. The G on the third beat precludes a D chord other than in exceptional circumstances.

Edited February 22, 2021 by Little John
Poor answer - clarified (I hope!)

[RAc]

Here's some more on the history of the tune (and the Cotillon in general):

 

http://cotillion.yolasite.com/tunes.php

 

I was first introduced to it in around 2016 by Jochen Riemer. The photocopies he gave us were attributed to the Hardcore English collection (although I can't find it anywhere in the TOCs available on the 'net, so I'm afraid I can't pinpoint an exact source. I still have a scan of the original page though). The explanatory notes to the tune in that copy are very similar to the ones in the link posted above. I copy them here, watch out for the spellings:

 

-------------------------------------------------
Chain Cotillion (Cotillon)

In Aird 3 and Anon7408 MS as La Nouvelle Hollendoise, as La Louise in S. Dawes (1818, BL), and as The Louisa in Johnson's 200 Favourite Country Dances 5, (1750). Features in early US manuscripts such as J. Greenwood and J. Turner, 1785. In Lewes Favourites as The Cotillion, from the MSS of the Bosham Band, Sussex, mid-nineteenth century.
--------------------------------------------------

 

It's interesting, Jim, (though not surprising! ;-)) that you should give the tune a definite Morris touch. In our session tribe, we tend to play it slower, with an almost sacral flavor such as here . In fact, I introduced the Cotillon to the bal folk group I play in around three years ago, and we played it an a christmas environment.

[Jim Besser]

1 hour ago, RAc said:

 

 

It's interesting, Jim, (though not surprising! ;-)) that you should give the tune a definite Morris touch. In our session tribe, we tend to play it slower, with an almost sacral flavor such as here . In fact, I introduced the Cotillon to the bal folk group I play in around three years ago, and we played it an a christmas environment.

 

Fascinating information.  It's very cool how these tunes migrate and change.

 

Yes, a Morris / English ceilidh touch; it clings to me like dog hair.  I do hear the tune as inherently chunky, and I admit to being influenced by the amazing melodeon playing of Will Allen, whose recent recording reminded me of this great tune: