Jump to content
Isel

Allowing handrail to slightly rotate in Hayden?

Recommended Posts

Yes, my crude contraption defies human comprehension!  Yours is much better.  If you swivel one end toward the buttons you will swivel the other end away.  Would this compromise playing at all?  What about moving the swivel point further toward either end? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes Erik, I guess making any swivel in an exagerated way would compromise playing, probably.

But that is not what I have in mind. 😇

Neither exagerated swivel nor ultra- complex fingering.

  I just look for some "minor" adaptations to take certain advantage in comfort and playability, if possible,  as finally a compromise has to be accepted when you choose a particular type slant (or not), pr some specifications of the hand bar, or some spacement of keys, etc.

 

I took the second picture quickly this morning, after that I realized some uneven things, sorry: the keyboard is so much slided to the left (it should be centered), and   the anchor point of the strap in the thumb end should be a litle more to the left, in a place that results in a more natural fitting to the hand (that would coincide more or less with the end bolt location). 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just for fun :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ops!...problems when uploading files: the upload box shows "Queued"...but nothing happens after that...

I will try to use url-links to Drive:

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1We9FyCd-OwfyvfAhmcudnSLM1TVPvXEX

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1dA_gGWwXwjV5yUosksxS2tw7ORmE2aDt

https://drive.google.com/open?id=18pvrFnpoRQYuN0l7ORPV_qg2K3TV7YN-

Edited by Isel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/1/2019 at 11:49 AM, wunks said:

Little John, I think, has made the observation that the contact and thus the leverage through the hand rest is mostly if not all at the base of the pinky.  This may vary with your style of play but is true for me.  Having moved my hand strap behind the base of my thumb ( left hand only for now) I find the enhanced and desirable (for me) freedom of movement stifled by the hand rest.  I propose replacing it with a sort of bollard/saddle at the leverage point.  Bring on the wild horses!

 

It's true that is where the main point of contact is with the hand rest, but probably the strongest point of contact with the concertina is with the thumb end of the strap (not hand rest). The key, in my view, is to have the straps reasonably loose so that you can slide your hand in a bit if needed to reach particular buttons.

 

In my (limited) observation of Hayden players it seems they don't use the little finger much if they can avoid it; but when they do they slide their hand through as described above. Take a look at the videos of Beaumont players on the Button Box website, and look closely at about 30 seconds in on the first video - you'll see what I mean.

 

LJ

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very good example John!. And, indeed, Aaron Marcus slides his hand and also rotate it a litle bit to play two octave buttons simoultaneously (the index finger pressing the lower button). Apart from reaching outer buttons, my initial question was focused to allow the hand to swivell in both directions at some degree.

At least for me, it is more challenging to try two octave buttons at time whith the index finger pressing the higher button... With the standard hand strap design, when I  try this fingering, my thumb finger does find an obstacle against the point where the strap clamps to the handrail, so I can not rotate my hand in enough degree to reach the desired finger positioning. The "integrated" hand-thumb strap proposal that I am experimenting with allows for this fingering and, due to my hand width,  my feeling is as I had my hand "in a glove".

Recently @Łukasz Martynowicz showed me a video from  @tona , and he seems to have (at least in the right side) both hand and  thumb straps in his duet (the hand strap being clamped to the sides of the concertina, instead to the ends of the hand rail).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Little John said:

 

It's true that is where the main point of contact is with the hand rest, but probably the strongest point of contact with the concertina is with the thumb end of the strap (not hand rest). The key, in my view, is to have the straps reasonably loose so that you can slide your hand in a bit if needed to reach particular buttons.

 

In my (limited) observation of Hayden players it seems they don't use the little finger much if they can avoid it; but when they do they slide their hand through as described above. Take a look at the videos of Beaumont players on the Button Box website, and look closely at about 30 seconds in on the first video - you'll see what I mean.

 

LJ

I do use my pinkies quite often - for low bass in four finger chord accompaniments on the left side and for sharps in chromatic melodies and as an intermediary finger in some downward chord progressions. This is why I use thumbstraps, my handstraps are so loose, that I don’t have any point of contact with hand rail - if I have to make a silent squeeze I rest one of my fingers on the board. Switching hand position in handstrap is IMHO key ability on Hayden.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I still can maintain control with the strap across the base of the thumb and I do play with a loose strap ( on that hand, for now).  The added incentive for me is to bring the thumb into play for the lowest notes.  I don't know about other duets but for the Jeffries, the lowest notes are bottom row far right with an additional mid range F# thumb key ( on one of mine but not the other) which means dropping the index finger down for harmony.  Because I'm playing a two finger melody line when ever possible and using the overlap region as a pair of mini EC's, I really want that thumb for the low notes.  Thus the need for a modification of the hand rest.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, wunks said:

I do play with a loose strap

In my prototype the hand strap also would remain loose enough to move the hand either up/down or swivelling. But in this context I have found a soft thumb loop would greatly improve the bellows control with scarce affection on hand freedom. Incidentally, I have discovered this system allows to loose the hand strap to the extend you want (well, within a secure margin, of course) because you can easily use the thumb to adjust the entire tension of the system, by spreading laterally the thumb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:rolleyes:Of course Erik!. I am very grateful to everyone that have participated

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...