Ec Thumb Problems

[Geoff Wooff]

Whilst I am used to reaching down to buttons that are under my palms on the English, ( and yes almost playing them with the nail side of a finger... though certainly at a very acute angle), the use of extra height on the duet hand rails was something I tried to good effect.

 

Yes I am more interested in playing comfortably within a reasonable range than trying to hit both ends of the keyboard at once. All the recordings for 'tune of the month' were of newly learned tunes quickly arranged and recorded on a sunday afternoon and only rely on past experiences rather than long perfected arrangements of the pieces.

Edited September 13, 2016 by Geoff Wooff

[Kelteglow]

Just one thought about a gangleon.Dont self treat buy show it to your doctor .Mine has turned out to be a growth of bone very painfull as the nerve of the hand runs over the top giving me like little electric shocks when I move my hand . I have arthritus and also wear hand support which could only have been made for a concertina player,see below .No fun getting older .Bob

[Steve Griffiths]

Thanks for the advice and general thoughts on this topic.

I have gone over to a Maccann duet now, which seems more comfortable. It is going to take a while to get fluent but, hey, I took up the concertina as a challenge and a project anyway.

[StephenTx]

On 8/27/2016 at 1:51 AM, Geoff Wooff said:

Yes, wrist straps can take the load off your thumbs. I use them all the time with my larger instrument and sometimes on the normal treble 48, if I have to stand and play.

 

For normal 'sit down' playing of a Treble EC , and using the 'thumbs pushed all the way into the straps' position I can play for hours on end with little discomfort without the need for wrist straps, but like a sporting activity , I suspect playing the EC is easier when the musclular strength and flexibility has beeen built up in one's youth.

 

[Pianist]

Interesting problem. One answer is - don't use your thumbs!

 

Have a look at this by Michael Jary from Swaledale 2013

 

 

I saw hime at Swaledale in 2018 and his handling of the box is ... odd!

 

He's a York bloke and has done workshops at the Yorkshire concertina club - https://yorkshireconcertinaclub.weebly.com/news/michael-jary-workshop

 

Hope you find some solutions.

[StephenTx]

On 8/27/2016 at 1:51 AM, Geoff Wooff said:

Yes, wrist straps can take the load off your thumbs. I use them all the time with my larger instrument and sometimes on the normal treble 48, if I have to stand and play.

 

For normal 'sit down' playing of a Treble EC , and using the 'thumbs pushed all the way into the straps' position I can play for hours on end with little discomfort without the need for wrist straps, but like a sporting activity , I suspect playing the EC is easier when the musclular strength and flexibility has beeen built up in one's youth.

Hi Geoff,  because of my thumb issues which I’ve had surgery I am wanting to get a hand or is it a wrist strap for my EC Baritone And I ran across this discussion from 2016 where you stated that you use them. I’m going to have Greg J.  Put them on. Would you like chats be so kind as to send me a picture or two of what the straps look like. Do they go across the hand or do they go across the wrist.  I know they must be helping on the pull.  Thank you so much. Here is a picture of my baritone serial number 5180 all that I got from David Robertson back in 2012.   What are your thoughts with regards to the fact that they have the colored Buttons with the note designation I’ve seen some discussion on here claiming that they are tutors and if they do. David I don’t think agrees with that particularly would be interested in your thoughts. Once again I truly appreciate your time and expertise. Stephentx 

[Geoff Wooff]

Stephen,

for  photos  you could  hardly  do  better  than look  at  the  very  recent    topic  in the  general  discussions  forum called  "  Unrestored  1942  Treble  Aeola,  worth  There  the  photos  of the  wrist  straps  are  very clear.

I  have  a  picture of  how  my own , hand  made  straps  fit  closely  across my  wrists... I'll try to  up load it  later. 

 

 

Edited September 20, 2020 by Geoff Wooff

[StephenTx]

On 8/27/2016 at 1:51 AM, Geoff Wooff said:

Yes, wrist straps can take the load off your thumbs. I use them all the time with my larger instrument and sometimes on the normal treble 48, if I have to stand and play.

 

For normal 'sit down' playing of a Treble EC , and using the 'thumbs pushed all the way into the straps' position I can play for hours on end with little discomfort without the need for wrist straps, but like a sporting activity , I suspect playing the EC is easier when the musclular strength and flexibility has beeen built up in one's youth.

Geoff,  As always thank you for your reply to my question. So the straps look like they really go around the rest area. Are they typically made in a fashion that are adjustable?

Stephentx

[Geoff Wooff]

This  photo    demonstrates  the  wrist  strap  position on  my  Baritone Treble  Aeola,  using  the  original  anchor points.  My  homemade  straps  are  not  as  wide,  or  as  stiff,  as  Wheatstone  originals  but  strong enough    allow  the  'pull '  effort  to  be transferred   from  the  thumbs  to  the arms.

 

Incidentally ,  the picture was taken to  demonstrate  the pressing of  buttons  four octave appart   using  adjacent  fingers, not that it  shows  how  far  my  ring finger  is  tucked  under my palm.

[Syncopepper]

After many years of playing an EC extended treble New Model I have recently developed arthritis in the second joint of my left thumb in addition to previous tendonitis on the other side of that hand that has curtailed playing stringed instruments.  I'm not sure what factors contribute most to the thumb problem (other than age) but suspect it's partially the strain of playing mostly in the bottom of EC's range. This has also caused my right thumb strap to wear out and I am considering having wrist straps installed when I get the thumb straps replaced.

 

The three options I have been considering are: wrist straps; neck strap or wrist splints like those David Coffin wears when playing.  I would appreciate any advice as to these possible options.  I switched from Anglo to EC a long time ago and would think that the constant bellows reversals on the Anglo would not be an advantage for thumbs over the EC.

 

 

[Geoff Wooff]

9 hours ago, Syncopepper said:

After many years of playing an EC extended treble New Model I have recently developed arthritis in the second joint of my left thumb in addition to previous tendonitis on the other side of that hand that has curtailed playing stringed instruments.  I'm not sure what factors contribute most to the thumb problem (other than age) but suspect it's partially the strain of playing mostly in the bottom of EC's range. This has also caused my right thumb strap to wear out and I am considering having wrist straps installed when I get the thumb straps replaced.

 

The three options I have been considering are: wrist straps; neck strap or wrist splints like those David Coffin wears when playing.  I would appreciate any advice as to these possible options.  I switched from Anglo to EC a long time ago and would think that the constant bellows reversals on the Anglo would not be an advantage for thumbs over the EC.

 

 

If  you play  whilst  standing then I  would  definitely  recommend  wrist straps,  even on a small  Treble  EC, they will take  a lot of  the strain   off  thumbs and  little fingers.  Even  when  playing seated  the  wrist straps  will  help.

Regarding  a neck  strap ;    this  suggests  supporting the  weight  of  the instrument    whilst  standing,. Have  you  tried  Randy  Stein's  suggestion  to  play  with the  keyboard  perpendicular   to  the  ground  ?

[StephenTx]

Geoff Hi,  My Baritone arrives at Button Box to get fitted for wrist straps And I am really hoping that it helps. I have had joint thumb surgery on my right thumb where they actually go in and put a cushion between the bone by transferring one of your tendons and rolling it up and sticking it in the joint.  https://eorthopod.com/resection-excision-arthroplasty-of-the-thumb/ 
It has helped tremendously prior to the surgery I wasn’t even open able to open the lid on a bottle of water. My only problem now is that a plane they concertina for a while it becomes very sore. I also use a neck strap (A student of PaulinedeSono).

[Geoff Wooff]

Hi Stephen,

that  surgery  sounds  drastic  .  What  did  you do  to  cause  so  much  damage?    

 

Something  else  that  I  have  found  helpful  is  the  really well padded  thumbstraps  that  a prevous owner  had  fitted to my  current  48 Treble.  I  think these  thicker/softer  straps  were made  by  Wim  Wakker.  I  wore them  out in  8  years  of  playing  but  took them to pieces and copied  them... the feel is  luxurious.

 

Take it easy  on that  thumb !!

[StephenTx]

On 10/1/2020 at 2:58 PM, Syncopepper said:

After many years of playing an EC extended treble New Model I have recently developed arthritis in the second joint of my left thumb in addition to previous tendonitis on the other side of that hand that has curtailed playing stringed instruments.  I'm not sure what factors contribute most to the thumb problem (other than age) but suspect it's partially the strain of playing mostly in the bottom of EC's range. This has also caused my right thumb strap to wear out and I am considering having wrist straps installed when I get the thumb straps replaced.

 

The three options I have been considering are: wrist straps; neck strap or wrist splints like those David Coffin wears when playing.  I would appreciate any advice as to these possible options.  I switched from Anglo to EC a long time ago and would think that the constant bellows reversals on the Anglo would not be an advantage for thumbs over the EC.

 

 

Hi I noted your mention of “wrist splints’ me toning Dave C.   Interesting do you know washer I might see these.   Does anyone else use wrist splints would be interested in any comments thank you Stephentx I 

[wunks]

Hi.  I don't play EC but I have one for repair practice.  It seems to me that the thumb/support problem is more easily solved from below with a "stiffy" of some sort running from the wrist beneath the pinky,  approximating a knee rest position.

[StephenTx]

13 minutes ago, wunks said:

Hi.  I don't play EC but I have one for repair practice.  It seems to me that the thumb/support problem is more easily solved from below with a "stiffy" of some sort running from the wrist beneath the pinky,  approximating a knee rest position.

A “stiffy” of some sort? Got to say that brought a smile to my face 🙂 . 
I’m not inquiring about thumb support but Found it interesting that individuals were individuals mentioning the use of a wrist splint.  Perhaps across the ocean there one in the same thing with a stiffy—But me a wrist support is totally different.

[wunks]

If it made you smile,  we're smiling together.  I'm a working man and those kinds of metaphors come naturally.  Sorry, I can't repeat what a gandydancer would call a concertina......😏

 

[StephenTx]

On 10/2/2020 at 12:26 PM, Geoff Wooff said:

Hi Stephen,

that  surgery  sounds  drastic  .  What  did  you do  to  cause  so  much  damage?    

 

Something  else  that  I  have  found  helpful  is  the  really well padded  thumbstraps  that  a prevous owner  had  fitted to my  current  48 Treble.  I  think these  thicker/softer  straps  were made  by  Wim  Wakker.  I  wore them  out in  8  years  of  playing  but  took them to pieces and copied  them... the feel is  luxurious.

 

Take it easy  on that  thumb !!

Geoff I noticed on some of the instruments that they have thicker thumb straps. I happen to run across this post I’m wondering if anyone knows where are you can get those I wonder if the button box or Greg J does it