44+ Button Jeffries Anglo Layout

[StuartEstell]

Hello all

 

I am currently considering the purchase of a rather lovely 44-button Jeffries anglo which I tried out over the Christmas period. At the moment its layout is, shall we say, rather individual.

 

In order to work out what is both feasible and sensible from a playing perspective, I have noted its full layout, and have the layout of one other 44-key, which I'm finding of some use in shunting notes around on an Excel spreadsheet.

 

My request: given how variable they are, would any other owners of big Jeffries anglos be willing to share their instruments' layouts? It would be of great assistance as I try to work out how best this box might be reconfigured for my purposes without making any irreversible changes to it. Although the instrument I'm considering is a Bb/F, it doesn't matter whether your box is C/G, Bb/F, G/D or anything more exotic -- I'm happy to do the transposition myself!

 

Many thanks in advance

Stuart

[Alex West]

Stuart

 

If you send me a PM with your e-mail address, I can send you the note layouts for three 45/46 keys and a 50 key Jeffries Anglo. The format I have them in is too big to post here. The Button Box also has 2 big anglos for sale together with their layouts.

 

Alex West

[vision2020]

Stuart

 

I Have 2 46 button Jeffries Layouts as below . I also have a Wheatstone 46 tuned to G/D/A. row nearest the hand straps in A. Hope this helps

 

Earliest model

LHS IN/OUT RHS OUT/IN

 

F/F# A/Bb C#/Eb B/G# G#/Bb C#/Eb G#/D A/D B/D G#/Bb

C/G G/B C/D E/F G/A Bb/B Eb/F# B/C D/E F/G A/C B/E E/F

Bb/A D/F# G/A B/C D/E F#/G# C/D F#/G A/B C/D E/G G#/Bb

A/G B/D E/F Squeak/sq C#/Eb Eb/F F/F# F#/G A/Bb

 

F/C AIR

 

 

 

Later model

 

LHS IN/OUT RHS OUT/IN

 

E/F A/Bb C#/Eb A/G G#/Bb C#/Eb Eb/C# G/C# Bb/C# D/A

C/G G/B C/D E/F G/A Bb/C# Eb/F# B/C D/E F/G A/C B/E E/F

B/A D/F# G/A B/C D/E F#/G# C/D F#/G A/B C/D E/G G#/Bb

F#/G# G#/Sq Eb/E Sq/Sq C#/Eb Eb/F F/F# F#/G# A/G#

 

F/C AIR

Edited January 8, 2016 by kevin-c

[StuartEstell]

Tremendous, thank you for your help. both.

[inventor]

See my suggestion for a 40 button Anglo type instrument on the "General discussion" section under the "Brian Hayden" section.

 

For a 44 button instrument you might add a (c#/Bb) ( ) ( ) button to the bottom LHS row;

and (c#'/bb) ( ) ( ) (c'/d') (e"'/d#"') buttons to the bottom row on the RHS.

 

This gives a comprehensive C/G/D/A instrument. Set a tone lower you get a Bb/F/C/G instrument. two Anglos for the price of one.

 

Inventor.

[RP3]

Stuart,

 

Before you proceed too far, you need to be aware of a very important issue. Different notes do not necessarily have the same size reed shoe. So while it might be easy to swap two reeds that have same size reed shoes (I've been able to do it with C# and D#), moving other notes that are further apart on the scale may mean different size shoes that can't easily be swapped. Retuning offending reeds is not advisable in most cases since the acoustics can be upset or there may not be enough metal left for the reed to work properly if it's pitch is moved too far. A professional concertina repairman would be needed to do a proper job of resizing the different double dovetailed slots or retuning reeds, but even then the swaps you might be considering could be too extreme in terms of the sizes of the reed shoes involved and the different sized chambers -- which themselves can change the acoustics and most definitely will upset the reed tuning.

 

In short, please consult a Highly Skilled concertina repair person before you try to make any serious changes to your new Jeffries or you could have a real mess on your hands.

 

Best of luck,

 

Ross Schlabach

Edited January 8, 2016 by RP3

[StuartEstell]

Hello Ross

 

Many thanks for your input -- yes, I'm aware of these issues and will be working with a very "highly skilled concertina repair person" on this.

 

My wish is not to make any changes to the instrument that are not reversible, and where possible not to retune any reeds any more than getting them from old pitch into concert pitch.

[StuartEstell]

See my suggestion for a 40 button Anglo type instrument on the "General discussion" section under the "Brian Hayden" section.

 

For a 44 button instrument you might add a (c#/Bb) ( ) ( ) button to the bottom LHS row;

and (c#'/bb) ( ) ( ) (c'/d') (e"'/d#"') buttons to the bottom row on the RHS.

 

This gives a comprehensive C/G/D/A instrument. Set a tone lower you get a Bb/F/C/G instrument. two Anglos for the price of one.

 

Inventor.

 

Brian -- a 4-row diatonic wouldn't work with the way I play anglo, but thank you for the thought.

[Paul Groff]

Hi Stuart,

 

A point to consider. Many of the Jeffries and Crabb anglos being played today have been re-worked into equal temperament. Where the original instruments may have had duplicate enharmonics (for example, separate reeds for D# and Eb in a C/G system instrument), these duplicate reeds are sometimes retuned to other notes.

 

Specifically, the "typical modern" location for a low Bb (on a C/G instrument) was often originally the home of a reed to sound D# on the early Jeffries and Crabb anglos. Since Eb is right next door, also on the draw, if such an instrument is re-tuned to equal temperament that D# note is often retuned to a low C# draw or replaced with a low Bb. On the early Jeffries and Crabb anglos in original condition, that low Bb would typically only be found on anglos with more than 30 keys, and located on the draw on the index-finger C row extra button (paired with Bb press an octave higher).

 

PG

[inventor]

Regards "not reversible changes" - it's highly likely that a 44 button Jeffries instrument started life as a Jeffries Duet anyway, and if you are working with a "highly skilled repair man"; go for an instrument that will exactly suit your playing style. Think of all the Stradivari violins that have been converted for modern players; the very few of these that haven't are sitting in an unplayable condition in Museum cases.

 

Inventor.

[gcoover]

Stuart,

Here's the layout for a 45 button Jeffries Anglo in G/D that I used to own, now residing somewhere in southern Japan.

 

Colin Dipper did some amazing work on this instrument, and mentioned at the time that some of the buttons were non-standard, but I don't remember which ones he was talking about!

 

Gary

Edited January 9, 2016 by gcoover

[Alex West]

Brian - I hesitate to try and correct someone so experienced, but based on the limited sample of "big" Jeffries and Crabb anglos I have and have seen, it's by no means certain that they are "highly likely" to be converted Jeffries duets. On the two instruments I have most familiarity of, a 45 key G/D and a 50 key Ab/Eb, the reeds are all uniquely marked and in the locations you'd expect for a regular anglo, rather than with a number of reeds tuned differently from their stampings as you might expect for a duet conversion. The Ab/Eb in particular is in high pitch (and possibly also un-equal temperament) and came from the US in pretty bad shape where it had been used as a donor instrument for levers (not fortunately reeds!) so was most unlikely to have been retuned as one could expect for a UK sourced, modern pitch, equal tempered instrument.

 

I wonder if the popular wisdom of "all big Jeffries anglos are retuned duets" - which I've heard a lot of times - is a piece of folk wisdom which is not actually correct?

 

Alex West

[d.elliott]

Alex, I suspect you are correct, I have seen both duets and 'natural' big anglos that were Jeffries. I wonder if Geof Crabb could cast light on the issue?

 

Dave

[inventor]

Alex thank-you for your correction. I should have said "possible" rather than "highly likely".

I have seen inside one 45 button Jeffries which looked as if it had been converted from a duet, It had actions for the thumb button and the last of the buttons of the bottom row opening onto the same reed, which only makes sense on a duet. It also had obvious changes to the reed-pan as well.

I also know someone who fairly recently converted a 50 button Jeffries duet into a G/D/A anglo-type, but I am quite happy to accept that "large Jeffries anglos are duet conversions", is merely an "Urban Myth".

 

Inventor,