How To Play "chips" And "cuts"

[beryl]

Teaching myself how to play a 30 key anglo and only play irish music. Could a more experienced member describe the differences in playing a "chip" versus a "cut". Thanks!

[Peter Laban]

Hmm, maybe you should explain what you think a 'chip' is. While the nomenclature of Irish music isn't very standardised 'chip' is not a term I have ever heard anyone use. Other than going for one after midnight once the music is finished anyway.

Edited August 12, 2014 by Peter Laban

[John Moran]

Hello

 

As Peter said the "chip" is not a description that I am familiar with. However a "cut" is.

 

To play a cut on the concertina you play the note above the note you want to cut. For example playing the E on the left hand side you play a G immediately before you play the E. Played slowly it sounds rubbish but played quickly it is vey effective.

 

Always play the cut using a note in the same direction as the note that you are cutting.

 

The best way to practice a cut is to cut the first note of a group of 3 notes in a jig. This gives emphasis to this note and can provide for a lift to the tune.

 

Cheers

 

John

[Azalin]

I play chips all the time when I go to the casino, but I usually don't bring the concertina ;-)

[JimLucas]

I play chips all the time when I go to the casino, but I usually don't bring the concertina ;-)

 

Chips? My parents taught me not to play with my food.

 

--------------------------

 

But here's a serious response to the original poster:

Where did you encounter the term "chip" being used to describe an ornament?

If from a person you know, could they provide a description or sound file to show us what is meant? If from another source, could you point us to it? Then we might be able to compare it to the "cut" (as we know it) and help you with both.

 

But a second question: If this is a term you heard, rather than one you read, is it possible that it was actually "chiff"? That seems to be a term for a characteristic sound on the flute. I haven't yet found a clear definition of what it means, but we have some flute players here, so maybe they could enlighten us?

[Wolf Molkentin]

"Chiff" is a hard word to define. It's a quality, present in varying amounts, in whistles. I'm told by smart people that it is a term that comes from pipe organ builders. In fact, often keyboard synthesizers will have a preset sound called "Chiff' or "Chiff Organ" or something. I asked Michael Copeland to define chiff for me when I spoke to him on September 2, 1998. He said that it refers to nonmusical aspects of the sound of a whistle. It has to do with the attack of the sound; the amount of "edge" in the sound. Something like that".

That's how a knowledgeable person defines or describes it, or at least is trying to....

Edited August 13, 2014 by blue eyed sailor

[chas]

As a flute player, I play cuts (as already described by John) and tips (or taps). I'm guessing "tip" could sound like "chip", especially in some accents.

 

A cut decorates with a note above and a tap with a note below. On the flute, at least, a tip means just tapping the hole below the lowest one being covered, as a way of articulating the note. So a G would be tipped by just briefly tapping the F#. On concertina, you would do what John describes but using a lower note to decorate rather than a higher one. But concertina players may well not use this term. Was it maybe a fluter or fiddler you heard the term from, Beryl? Not only terminology but actual decorations vary from instrument to instrument.

 

Incidentally, a cut followed by a tip gives you a roll.

[beryl]

Heard this term "chipping" from a friend who took a class with Dympna O'Sullivan. It seems like she plays the B and D on the draw (left side) simultaneously but holding the true note of the tune (the longer. Other examples were playing an A on the left and "Chipping" with the B on the right (on the draw) orChipping the G' on the right with a B' on the ridht during a press. I

 

Is this making any sense?!

[Rod]

Sounds a bit like the trick of playing a two or three note chord but choosing to release one or two of the component notes prematurely allowing the surviving note to remain dominant. Difficult to explain but very effective in practice. Certainly not exclusive to Irish Traditional Music.

[JimLucas]

Heard this term "chipping" from a friend who took a class with Dympna O'Sullivan. It seems like she plays the B and D on the draw (left side) simultaneously but holding the true note of the tune (the longer. Other examples were playing an A on the left and "Chipping" with the B on the right (on the draw) orChipping the G' on the right with a B' on the ridht during a press. I

 

Is this making any sense?!

 

Well, it seems to describe something, though it's the first I've heard of anyone making a practice of it. Sounds to me as if "chipping" in this sense is like "cutting", but where the main note starts simultaneously with the brief "grace" note, rather just after.

 

Interesting. I've just tried both, and they do sound subtly different, though this is the first I've heard of anyone deliberately using this "chipping". Maybe it'll catch on as yet another ornament in the concertina repertoire? (It's not something that can be done on flute or whistle.)

[chas]

Interesting. I've just tried both, and they do sound subtly different, though this is the first I've heard of anyone deliberately using this "chipping". Maybe it'll catch on as yet another ornament in the concertina repertoire? (It's not something that can be done on flute or whistle.)

 

 

Musically it's not possibly on a flute/whistle but in terms of fingering it's exactly like cutting the beginning of a note on a flute: put down some fingers then quickly lift one. I still have a sneaking suspicion that this might be a mishearing of "tip", which is a well established term, even maybe in concertina circles. I quote from http://concertutor.wordpress.com/rolls-the-7-types/

 

<<The rolling note + cut + the rolling note + tip + rolling note

So that’s a 5-note sequence, and you can do this 2 different ways:

- You can release the first rolling note before you play the cut, and again before the tip, so that all 5 notes are distinct.

Or, you can hold the first rolling note through the cut and tip, release it and hit it again for the 5^th note.>>

 

There's also a discussion at http://thesession.org/discussions/25676 which refers to taps rather than tips, but I think it's the same thing.

 

One of these links may well answer the original question if it doesn't drive you mad first.

 

I'm off to play some shlides, or maybe some Shligo shtyle.

 

[ceemonster]

god, i forgot about this. i learned about it from dympna also, during several days of class at a clare festival. my impression was that it is like cuts that you do while holding the melody note you are playing, rather than doing cuts in a space between melody notes. btw....dympna is one lovely, tasteful, understatedly marvellous exponent of the clare style...

[beryl]

see next post

Edited August 17, 2014 by beryl

[beryl]

I think ceemonster has it right from what I've heard. Thanks everyone for all your suggestions!

[Steve Mansfield]

Or, you can hold the first rolling note through the cut and tip, release it and hit it again for the 5^th note.>>

 

Ooh I like that - works really nicely on EC too. I love learning new ornaments - I then wildly overuse them for a few months until they bed into the general repertoire, so I suspect all my rolls will be played like that for a while, and rolls will also probably be appearing in places that have never been rolled before just so I can use it