The Dilemma.

[Dirge]

So I bought this 'special' aeola back in April as reported here at the time; a 55 key Aeola duet with a few top notes left out and a couple of novelties fitted instead. It came up just before the annual visit to England so I agreed to buy it unseen 'if it was as described'. It was, so I did.

 

Mike Acott brought it back to life; up to concert pitch and new consumeables. Some rather brutal and indeed worrying swinging on the over-enthusiastically rebound bellows has got them to behave fairly well and I am left with a potentially really good instrument. It will play very quietly or loud enough to make you uncomfortable(!), and I even like the novelties, even if I have never used them in anger. I play it a lot; it's a delight.

 

The problem is that, as made, it had the keyboard 'regularised'. The standard 'Maccan' RH layout switches the higher C notes across to the other side of the keyboard. This one has all its Cs and all the G's except the very top note in one column. Probably not important if it is your only instrument. A blasted nuisance when you want to skip from one instrument to another and have to remember different fingerings.

 

So, after a lot of thought I have decided that keeping it like this is simply out. (bad for my playing generally even)

 

I could get the notes switched to std. That's moving 7 notes about involving opening up 3 pairs of reed slots; it looks practical. I am scared this will affect what is a battered but, at bottom, really good instrument. I don't think so, none of the reeds or chambers are much different in size but...also I fundamentally don't like butchering old rarities without good reason.

 

However I really like this instrument and would be pleased to keep it.

 

The alternative is I could sell it and buy another. Tricky in NZ, whereas I'm thnking the genial local luthier might be persuaded to shave out the reed slots while I stand over him; an almost instant fix. Instant fixes are good because I play it with a band monthly and need practice time beforehand. (But I can use one of the others for a bit)

 

Mind you I might get a few more notes (which I'm not sure I need)

 

Actually I think I've almost answered my own question. It really has to be the reed swap, doesn't it?

[Dirge]

Here's a picture of the reedpan. The letters in the chambers are as existing; the letters outside are what should be there.

 

And it occurs to me now to wish I'd had the wit to talk to Mike about this when he was doing the overhaul. You clot, Dirge.

 

And it is the Bb into C# that needs most removed.

Edited September 15, 2013 by Dirge

[Jody Kruskal]

I think that these machines are tools that should be used to play actual music. Unless this is destined for the museum, I suggest that you set it up to be usable, right away.

[Geoff Wooff]

It does not look too hard to do... I would go for it if, as you say, you really like the instrument.

 

Fix them- play them- break them-wear them out- repair them- play again... they are for making music after all.

Edited September 15, 2013 by Geoff Wooff

[Theo]

Rather than shave out the reed slots, which is difficult to do and maintain a good finish and the correct undercut angle, and especially a clean internal angle to the undercut, I would consider filing some metal off the edge of the reed frame.

[samper]

Two fixes, wood or metal. Theo has a good point, the undercut is tricky to maintain. The reed frame however is straightforward proposition. It's just filing off the required amount of relatively soft metal.

[Geoffrey Crabb]

David, following the general philosophy of reversabilty, personally I would leave the reeds alone and deal with the grooves especially if the services of a competent luthier are available. From the pictures, I do not think there will be a problem.

Have you tried swapping the reeds over (preferably one at a time. You may find that only some grooves need adjustment i.e widening and lengthening or reducing. If increasing the length, the wind slot may also need adjusting.

 

Geoffrey

[Dirge]

I admit I have been a bit muddled over this. I agree wholeheartedly with the comments that it must make music or it's pointless. However I can play it now; I've used it for a couple of Cnet recordings recently, and people looking to 'Chidleyise' duets turn up here fairly regularly and it was made like that. On the other hand if I make it std it's much better for me and it's unlikely that anyone will even consider taking it back the other way. I'm absolutely sure I wouldn't, of course, there's no trial element involved.

 

I had thought of filing the frames but it seemed a bit drastic, so I'm interested to see some of you suggest it. I HADN'T until now thought of grinding a file to make a tool to open out the sides of the grooves nicely, another option. Extending the nose of the grooves struck me as the most difficult part. At the moment trimming the reed frames seems very alluring.

 

I had it apart yesterday and trial fitted the reeds in their alternative slots. I didn't actually measure the wind slots but I did look and my impression is that slots holes and pads are all pretty close and probably the same. Most of the undersize reeds will need nothing more than paper shims; one needs a little more. The oversize ones, again are all very close except one.

 

Important question: on filing frames; we're not worried about the effect on the tone of the thing if the weight of the reed assembly goes down are we?

 

I don't think I'm worried about the conservation aspect of filing the frames; if anyone wanted to reverse it, well they still end up packing a groove, just a different one.

 

Thanks for the encouragement, everyone; I'm a bit scared of it, as you can probably tell. 'Stop being so precious and get on with it' seems to be the way forward.

[Chris Ghent]

I'm sure Geoff could adjust the wood successfully but I couldn't so I'd file the frame. Cock that up and there are many solutions. Cock up adjusting the wood and it is much more sticky. You might be surprised how little has to come off. You won't alter the tone taking a little off the side.

 

Before filing hold a straightedge to the side of the frame, hold it up with light behind, and check whether there is a belly in the shape of the side, if so reproduce this.

[Paul Groff]

Hi Dirge and all,

 

A third way forward would be the most conservative of all. First try to swap as many of the existing reeds into their new locations as will transfer without any filing to the reeds or alterations to the slots. You might find that some of the swaps are easy. Then for the remainder needed, get some spare reeds and fit those into the new slots. Retain any of the original reeds that are left over, and keep them (along with detailed notes) with the concertina. That way your conversion is 100% reversible, with no material removed from the reedpans or from any of the original reeds. Looks like the most you would need would be 14 reeds in frames, and maybe fewer. That's what I would recommend for extremely valuable and original instruments. It does involve the expense of acquiring the spare reeds, but those might be found from a repairman who has crashed, unrepairable concertinas.

 

PG

Edited September 15, 2013 by Paul Groff

[Dirge]

Thanks Chris; that all sounds sensible.

 

Paul , I've already tried switching them; 3 need shimming, one will need packing, 2 will need a whisker off the frames; all this I'm happy with and it would be easily reversed. Only fitting the Bb into the C# slot worries me but using substitute reeds seems a bit contrary when the reeds are the reason for wanting to sort it. AND I'd lose them after a year or two if they were loose, I promise. Thanks for the thought though.

 

Right I shall do this next friday ASAP after band practice thursday night; that will give me a week to re-convert the fast stuff we've been working on back to 'normal Wheatstone duet'. I might as well get on with it, I don't think there will be a good time to do it; otherwise it's the sooner the better and why didn't I face up to this months ago?

[Geoffrey Crabb]

Of course David you must do whatever you feel is most comfortable for you.

As these pages are widely read by many with various degrees of skill, I do tend to shy away from advising about altering reed frames.

If you do choose this route, work slowly and methodically on one reed at a time, taking equal amounts of both edges of the frame and trying it regularly until it fits snugly and that reed tongue remains free to vibrate.

Curved 'Lino Cut Tools' (available from good craft shops or on line) are useful for extending the rounded ends of reed grooves.

 

Geoffrey.

[Geoff Wooff]

Getting a good fit so that the reed frame is held firmly to the Pan, especially the base of the frame making a good seal against the wood of the base of the dove tail slot... and all round contact at the tip makes for better tone production.

[Frank Edgley]

It's been a few years since I have done a complete repitch from, for exemple C/G to D/A. This person is a brilliant player who learned to play concertina in Ireland, but played everything in F or C on a regular C/G instrument. She wanted me to convert it to a D/A so that she could continue playing as she always had, but it would now come out in the usual keys (G and D). Anyway, I digress. The way I repitched was not to sharpen each reed.....that would have butchered the reeds. I moved them around from one position to another. Yes, I know, there would be some reeds of certain piches not available from the C/G instrument. That's another story.

The point is that when switching the reeds around I found inconsistency with the reed frame sizes. Some could be moved with no problem (you would expect that); some needed a shim (you would expect that also); but some would not fit all the way into the reed slot. You wouldn't expect that. You would think that a higher-pitched reed, if anything, would have a smaller reed frame. With some reeds this was not the case. Only a small amount of material was needed to make them fit, though. I remember that it looked like a Jeffries, but the dealer told me that it might be a Shakespeare.

[felix castro]

 

The problem is that, as made, it had the keyboard 'regularised'. The standard 'Maccan' RH layout switches the higher C notes across to the other side of the keyboard. This one has all its Cs and all the G's except the very top note in one column. Probably not important if it is your only instrument. A blasted nuisance when you want to skip from one instrument to another and have to remember different fingerings.

 

 

Hello Dirge, about another different question. Do you mean with regularised keyboard that it is similar to the Chidley layout? As you tell, it seems that it is the original place of the reeds. Is your concertina produced before than the Chidley invention? I say that remembering my Lachenal 55 duet that came with "chidley" layout produced before than the Chidley invention (and it is still waiting for a overhauling and for a wise person that tells if its layout is original or not).

[Dirge]

So I took a deep breath, waded in, and after a bit began to believe this would be OK. Tested it and found I'd still got the notes in the wrong places and making less sense than before. Impressive eh? Now I have it OK apart from the last two notes that are awaiting attention tomorrow.

 

Felix; it's 1918 and yes, as far as i remember is very Chidley. Maybe Chidley was working at Wheatstones and had already worked out his 'improved' layout and persuaded some buyers to take it, and only when he was promoted was he able to enforce it as the norm? How a Lach' fits in with this theory I don't know.

[felix castro]

My concertina is circa 1915-1917, as an estimation by Mr. Dowright. I put here the link of my topic for remembering it.

http://www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13643&hl=%2Bchidley+%2Bfelix+%2Bcastro

[Dirge]

Right, successfully done. Phew.

 

In the end I went everywhere and anywhere to find the extra length to get the biggest 2 pairs of reeds into the smaller slots; I took a bit off the nose of the frame, filed the back parallel with the reedpan edge AND took a bit out of the nose of the slots. Having taken the nose off I then had to run the air slot further to give the tongue clearance. I had a square section Swiss file that was just the right width so that was OK.

 

Filing the frame sides was no problem. Meanwhile the ICA newsletter cover made good thicker shims for packing smaller reeds into bigger slots, which seemed right and proper.

 

The only trouble I had was getting the big pairs to speak properly; I'd taken a lot off the sides and it turned out that the sides were bowing in and strangling the reeds when they were fitted. I took my end bolt screwdriver and burnished the middle of the faces of the dovetails and that compressed the wood enough to sort it; there was also a little extra tidying work with reeds picking up the sides of air slots.

 

All this took a fair amount of fiddling to work out and was quite nerve wracking; 'Have I overdone it? Will I be able to get it right?' but suddenly there it was.

 

So a good result; thanks for everyone's help.