To Kruskalize A Tune, The Kruskalization Of A Tune

[Jody Kruskal]

 

 

As long as I'm at it, I've added another crucial criterium: ...

 

Did you intend to write "a kruskal criterium" here instead? ;-)

 

Ha!

[Jody Kruskal]

That means I have to find a way to work in an F natural on the left side. It's only available on the pull, and that complicates playing the melody on the right side.

And it's just this sort of thing that makes the Anglo such a fascinating instrument, for me at least.

 

Yes, you are right there Doug. The delights of the Anglo are this balancing act between conflicting needs. The right hand, the left hand, the harmony, the rhythm, the melody, the bellows direction... etc. All of these elements can conflict with each other when you play, and satisfying each of these musical needs pulls upon limited resources. There are only so many fingers available and only one bellows direction at a time. Beware, if it's too complicated then it will never happen in performance, so simple is always better. How you negotiate between these conflicting musical needs and still play actual music makes you the player that you are. The Anglo is a delightful puzzle in a temporal environment where timing is everything and everyone has their own distinctive puzzle solution and so, their own sound. How fun!

 

That said, I like the Jefferies 38 button system and use all those 8 extra buttons (16 pitches) to my advantage... but...

 

a 30 button system works fine too in most cases, though compromise between the ideal and the real might be required. Finesse can overcome great obstacles and still fine music can be made.

Edited August 9, 2013 by Jody Kruskal

[wayman]

The delights of the Anglo are this balancing act between conflicting needs. The right hand, the left hand, the harmony, the rhythm, the melody, the bellows direction... etc. All of these elements can conflict with each other when you play, and satisfying each of these musical needs pulls upon limited resources. There are only so many fingers available and only one bellows direction at a time. Beware, if it's too complicated then it will never happen in performance, so simple is always better. How you negotiate between these conflicting musical needs and still play actual music makes you the player that you are. The Anglo is a delightful puzzle in a temporal environment where timing is everything and everyone has their own distinctive puzzle solution and so, their own sound. How fun!

 

 

Well put. I have a piano accordionist houseguest at the moment, and I was trying to explain to her why I was not immediately playing back (on my anglo) the phrase of a tune she was teaching me -- that I had to do a bit more and different thinking with an anglo than she does with a piano accordion (especially for a tune in A on a C/G). I tried explaining it, but the concept that I had to think about bellows direction and buttons and fingers was not getting through. Then I thought of a new way to explain it: "Imagine you have a computer keyboard which needs bellows to work, ok? And when you squeeze the bellows, the keyboard has a QWERTY layout ... but when you open the bellows, the keyboard immediately switches to a DVORAK layout." And I saw the lightbulb go on over her head, followed by a look of sheer horror. I just grinned.

Edited August 9, 2013 by wayman

[Dirge]

 

The delights of the Anglo are this balancing act between conflicting needs. The right hand, the left hand, the harmony, the rhythm, the melody, the bellows direction... etc. All of these elements can conflict with each other when you play, and satisfying each of these musical needs pulls upon limited resources. There are only so many fingers available and only one bellows direction at a time. Beware, if it's too complicated then it will never happen in performance, so simple is always better. How you negotiate between these conflicting musical needs and still play actual music makes you the player that you are. The Anglo is a delightful puzzle in a temporal environment where timing is everything and everyone has their own distinctive puzzle solution and so, their own sound. How fun!

Well put. I have a piano accordionist houseguest at the moment, and I was trying to explain to her why I was not immediately playing back (on my anglo) the phrase of a tune she was teaching me -- that I had to do a bit more and different thinking with an anglo than she does with a piano accordion (especially for a tune in A on a C/G). I tried explaining it, but the concept that I had to think about bellows direction and buttons and fingers was not getting through. Then I thought of a new way to explain it: "Imagine you have a computer keyboard which needs bellows to work, ok? And when you squeeze the bellows, the keyboard has a QWERTY layout ... but when you open the bellows, the keyboard immediately switches to a DVORAK layout." And I saw the lightbulb go on over her head, followed by a look of sheer horror. I just grinned.

 

You do KNOW you are all mad, don't you?

[Pete Dunk]

Post removed.

 

Edited August 10, 2013 by tallship

[Geoff Wooff]

 

 

The delights of the Anglo are this balancing act between conflicting needs. The right hand, the left hand, the harmony, the rhythm, the melody, the bellows direction... etc. All of these elements can conflict with each other when you play, and satisfying each of these musical needs pulls upon limited resources. There are only so many fingers available and only one bellows direction at a time. Beware, if it's too complicated then it will never happen in performance, so simple is always better. How you negotiate between these conflicting musical needs and still play actual music makes you the player that you are. The Anglo is a delightful puzzle in a temporal environment where timing is everything and everyone has their own distinctive puzzle solution and so, their own sound. How fun!

Well put. I have a piano accordionist houseguest at the moment, and I was trying to explain to her why I was not immediately playing back (on my anglo) the phrase of a tune she was teaching me -- that I had to do a bit more and different thinking with an anglo than she does with a piano accordion (especially for a tune in A on a C/G). I tried explaining it, but the concept that I had to think about bellows direction and buttons and fingers was not getting through. Then I thought of a new way to explain it: "Imagine you have a computer keyboard which needs bellows to work, ok? And when you squeeze the bellows, the keyboard has a QWERTY layout ... but when you open the bellows, the keyboard immediately switches to a DVORAK layout." And I saw the lightbulb go on over her head, followed by a look of sheer horror. I just grinned.

 

You do KNOW you are all mad, don't you?

 

Quite true Dirge.

 

Imagine a typical conversation: Jo Public says " oh; that is a handy little instrument you have there!" "Yes" says the concertina player... " very portable.. plenty of volume, stays in tune, is chromatic. lovely."

"So , that is a usefull, take it almost anywhere instrument. You could join in and play with anybody you meet on your travels." "Well, No, not really." says the concertinist.. " why ever not " say Jo P. " It would depend on what key the people you might meet are playing in." "Oh, why is that ?" " Well, you see although my Concertina is chromatic there are only very few keys that are simple to play in."

 

" So, when you need to play in one of your difficult keys.. what do you do then?" ... "Oh, then I get out one of my other Concertinas which is tuned differently." "I see", says Jo P, " so if you had enough concertinas, bit like a Blues Harp player really, then you could play in any key, easily." "Yes , that is about it".

"Hmm, not so portable after all, then!" " Do these Concertinas cost much more than a Blues Harp ?".........

 

We could start a new topic on this subject. And perhaps this is why most of the current Concertina makers produce Anglos almost exclusively !! There is more money to be made selling your Customer a second or third instrument.

Edited August 10, 2013 by Geoff Wooff

[Guest mglamb]

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Edited August 10, 2013 by mglamb

[Pete Dunk]

Amazing how typical C.net thread drift has turned Jody's thread into anglo-bashing by a few EC elitists. What value does this bring to the discussion?

 

I have removed my light hearted tongue-in-cheek post. Dirge plays MacCann duet. I am not an elitist of any kind and you need to develop a sense of humour!

[Guest mglamb]

.

Edited August 10, 2013 by mglamb

[Geoff Wooff]

Amazing how typical C.net thread drift has turned Jody's thread into anglo-bashing by a few EC elitists. What value does this bring to the discussion?

I don't see it as Bashing the Anglo. Just airing my small grievance that one can hardly find a maker of other types of concertina.

 

But I take your point. All concertinas have some difficult Keys... especially if( and when) playing by ear.

Edited August 10, 2013 by Geoff Wooff

[Pete Dunk]

.

 

I should think so too, for shame! Troll!

[Pete Dunk]

Well that says it all!

[Jody Kruskal]

My my! Such thin skins we all have... or at least some of us. As for me, bash away, bash away, bash away trolls!

 

Really, nothing that has been said here offends me... or really sounds overly trollish. Everyone has their own point of view, thank goodness! Otherwise, there would be nothing to talk about. A bit of drift is a good thing, IMO. It's a conversation after all.

 

Dirge, you are right. I am quite mad, in fact, I'm a total mad man, though not an angry one.

 

Now back to Geoff's point, and one well taken.

 

I carry two concertinas to a session and rarely have I encountered a tune I could not participate in. The main box is G/D Anglo and the rarely played secondary one is a C/G. If the session were to start playing in Bb or F I would just listen, but that almost never happens in my circles. The few times it has, it's just been an isolated tune. On the other hand, if I have a gig to play for an English Playford type dance, I might bring a max of four to cover all the bases. Even so, rarely, I am asked to play tunes that just don't suit me on the Anglo. Thank goodness I love to dance.

Edited August 11, 2013 by Jody Kruskal

[Daniel Hersh]

Really, nothing that has been said here offends me... or really sounds overly trollish. Everyone has their own point of view, thank goodness! Otherwise, there would be nothing to talk about. A bit of drift is a good thing, IMO. It's a conversation after all.

Jody--

 

You may not have seen the deleted posts.

[Geoff Wooff]

 

Really, nothing that has been said here offends me... or really sounds overly trollish. Everyone has their own point of view, thank goodness! Otherwise, there would be nothing to talk about. A bit of drift is a good thing, IMO. It's a conversation after all.

Jody--

 

You may not have seen the deleted posts.

 

I did not see them either... but it looks as if someone got really upset! So, again appologies if anybody got hot under the collar on my part .

 

My own view is that it really would be nice to have a" concertina for all sessions".

 

I was out last night, at our local Bar, having dinner with my wife and friends and there was a band playing. The landlord is a Fiddler/Guitarist/Singer (Old Time music), but I thought he had booked a Rock/Blues Duo. Well, the duo turned out to be a Guitar singer and a Fiddler... and very good they were on any form of music from 1930's American songs, through Cajun,Quebecoise,Irish,Hot Club Jazz,Segas from Reunion etc etc.... proffesional musicians and no respecter of " what you cannot play in Bb on that thing?"

So, really one aught to have an instrument in the car... for that rare chance encounter of a late night session with some fine new friends... of course we had not brought the instruments .

[maki]

Jody, I love the music that you and your brother make.

Moreover this thread has been very educational for me, a music n00b and anglo ignoramous.

[Jim Besser]

. Then I thought of a new way to explain it: "Imagine you have a computer keyboard which needs bellows to work, ok? And when you squeeze the bellows, the keyboard has a QWERTY layout ... but when you open the bellows, the keyboard immediately switches to a DVORAK layout." And I saw the lightbulb go on over her head, followed by a look of sheer horror. I just grinned.

 

I gotta remember that the next time the piano accordion wizard in my band asks why I'm groaning about the incredibly notey tune in a bad key he wants us to play!

[Gary Chapin]

Even so, rarely, I am asked to play tunes that just don't suit me on the Anglo. Thank goodness I love to dance.

 

Back twenty years ago when I played keyless wooden flute, I'd welcome the occasional tune that went beyond my instrument. A chance to hit the head, or get another pint!