ID this ebay auction?

[fearfeasog]

First off, this is not my auction. I'm in Massachusetts, this seller is in England.

 

Fine Old Anglo Concertina Circa 1880

 

The seller doesn't say what this is. (They have great feedback, btw) Any ideas?

 

ff

[Mark Davies]

Jones

[fearfeasog]

Jones

 

Oh, ok. Thanks.

[fearfeasog]

so given the info the seller gives, what would the likely repairs be? and would it need to be tuned, do you suppose? Sorry for the obviously newbie questions.

[david robertson]

Jones

I see some similarities to Jones fretwork, but have you got any firmer evidence that might lend weight to your conviction?

I have only seen this pattern of bellows decoration once before, and that was on an amboyna-ended English labelled John Alvey Turner. If these are similar, they are not paper, but leather. Obviously, Jones might have bought them in from the same source.

[Myrtle's cook]

In terms of parentage, Jones was my inital thought - possible that the bellow have come from another concertina in the days it was cheaper to break for spares than buy new parts.

 

In terms of costs of repairs - unless you have the opportunity to expertly appraise the concertina it is perhaps a question of your appetite for risk. At best this could be an instrument that has been previously restored fairly recently (folk revival period) - so may just need new pads, valves, slight retune and a few tweaks, in which case c.£300 might be a budget. At worst it has been lurking in an attic and will require the preceding work plus a full retune; it may have cracked or warped read pans, have problems with the frames etc the reeds could be badly rusted and the bellows need considerable work - by this stage £600+(potentially big '+') for the work would be looking like a bargain.

 

Quite likely it is somewhere in between these two states. The other consideration would be that any repairer is likely to have a waiting list - so any musical gratifaction from the purchase will be delayed!

 

I guess a way of approaching this is to consider how much dealers e.g. Theo (The Box PLace) and Chris Algar (Barleycorn concertinas) - would sell such an instrument in a ready to play state, deduct the worst case repairs + your maximum bid and see if the resultant figure is is really an ebay bargain.

 

I have had mixed experiences at auction - buying a great Wheatstone EC that was practically ready to play and buying another concertina on Ebay which might fairly be described as a bit of a 'car crash' that once restored proably only saved me 10-15% on buying a ready to play example from a dealer. That said, I do feel a sense of smug satisfaction at having brought a fine instrument back to life.

 

Good luck if you decide to bid - its Christmas so fellow concertina purchasers may be under pressure to spend their money elsewhere!

[Greg Jowaisas]

 

 

Look familiar? 34b Jones C/G trap door air valve; broad steel reeds; Drones (LH thumb): C both ways, D both ways; mahogany button pan; rivet action.

 

This one is repaired (button pan crack repair, fret work piece replacement) in tune and for sale.

 

Greg

 

(I've often wondered concerning the exclusivity of the end run gold stamping applied by the old makers. I've seen what I identify as "The Jeffries Stamp" (probably better identified as a "Jeffries/Crabb" stamp) on early Wheatstones and of course Crabb used that stamping design and variations as well. My instrument bears the stamping I most asscoiate with Jones, but I believe I have seen it on other makes of concertinas. The ebay instrument being discussed has, what I think of, as a Lachenal stamp, but it was also used frequently on early Wheatstones too. Chidley had a distictive asymetrric stamp but used a Jeffries/Crabb stamp design on occasion.

 

The book binders where I have the gold tooling on my bellows stamped has a whole "library" of stamps and type that they use. I wonder how much gold stamping was done in house by the old makers and how much was jobbed out?)

Edited December 6, 2012 by Greg Jowaisas

[fearfeasog]

 

 

Look familiar? 34b Jones C/G trap door air valve; broad steel reeds; Drones (LH thumb): C both ways, D both ways; mahogany button pan; rivet action.

 

This one is repaired (button pan crack repair, fret work piece replacement) in tune and for sale.

 

Greg

 

Hmmm, it *does* look quite similar.

 

Greg, I'm going to assume that one's over my budget, or you would have told to me about it when we spoke. I still have the one you told me about in mind as i save up, though.

[fearfeasog]

In terms of parentage, Jones was my inital thought - possible that the bellow have come from another concertina in the days it was cheaper to break for spares than buy new parts.

 

In terms of costs of repairs - unless you have the opportunity to expertly appraise the concertina it is perhaps a question of your appetite for risk. At best this could be an instrument that has been previously restored fairly recently (folk revival period) - so may just need new pads, valves, slight retune and a few tweaks, in which case c.£300 might be a budget. At worst it has been lurking in an attic and will require the preceding work plus a full retune; it may have cracked or warped read pans, have problems with the frames etc the reeds could be badly rusted and the bellows need considerable work - by this stage £600+(potentially big '+') for the work would be looking like a bargain.

 

Quite likely it is somewhere in between these two states. The other consideration would be that any repairer is likely to have a waiting list - so any musical gratifaction from the purchase will be delayed!

 

I guess a way of approaching this is to consider how much dealers e.g. Theo (The Box PLace) and Chris Algar (Barleycorn concertinas) - would sell such an instrument in a ready to play state, deduct the worst case repairs + your maximum bid and see if the resultant figure is is really an ebay bargain.

 

I have had mixed experiences at auction - buying a great Wheatstone EC that was practically ready to play and buying another concertina on Ebay which might fairly be described as a bit of a 'car crash' that once restored proably only saved me 10-15% on buying a ready to play example from a dealer. That said, I do feel a sense of smug satisfaction at having brought a fine instrument back to life.

 

Good luck if you decide to bid - its Christmas so fellow concertina purchasers may be under pressure to spend their money elsewhere!

 

thanks for the perspective! seems so uncertain especially coming from so far away and with no returns allowed. It *would* be a real risk, and I'd be lucky indeed to get away with minimal repairs.

[David Levine]

Here's another one, also on Ebay. The similarity is striking, leaving no doubt....

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Concertina-Jones-34-button-c-g-/170952499844?pt=UK_MusicalInstr_Keyboard_RL&hash=item27cd902284

[fearfeasog]

Here's another one, also on Ebay. The similarity is striking, leaving no doubt....

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Concertina-Jones-34-button-c-g-/170952499844?pt=UK_MusicalInstr_Keyboard_RL&hash=item27cd902284

 

That looks like a nice one.