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Female duet duo players are happier, less confrontational


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Maybe this should be under teaching and learning....and I seem to remember a discussions on learning to play by dots and or ear.

Afraid the hard carriage returns cause wraparound probs.

 

These are from the latest Biological Proceedings of The Royal Society.

 

Female Happy wrens select songs to cooperate with their mates rather than confrontintruders

Some birds sing impressive vocal duets with their mates that are so well

timed it sounds like a single individual sings. Yet the function of these duets is

heavily debated. This study investigated how female Happy Wrens select which songs

to sing using experiments where their mate and an intruding female were simulated by

broadcasting songs through loudspeakers. From their repertoire of about 40

different songs, females consistently selected the one that fit with their mate’s

song, but used the timing of their singing to signal aggression to other females.

This study indicates that duetting functions to signal pair commitment. Contact: Mr

Christopher Templeton, University of St Andrews,

 

I am not sure if this see/ear research means dot readers have smaller brains than ear players or vice versa = discuss!

 

What you see is what you hear - if your visual brain is small. Audiovisual

illusions can make us see things we only ever hear. Researchers from UCL

now tested what makes people more or less prone to such 'seeing with their

ears'. They found the influence of sounds on seeing is related to brain

structure. The smaller a participants' visual cortex, the more likely they

were to experience such an illusion. This might point to a clever strategy

for perception used by the brain. Unreliable input from the eyes is

supported by information provided by the ears. Contact: Mr Benjamin de

Haas, University College London,

Edited by Kautilya
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Maybe this should be under teaching and learning....and I seem to remember a discussions on learning to play by dots and or ear.

Afraid the hard carriage returns cause wraparound probs.

 

These are from the latest Biological Proceedings of The Royal Society.

 

Female Happy wrens select songs to cooperate with their mates rather than confrontintruders

Some birds sing impressive vocal duets with their mates that are so well

timed it sounds like a single individual sings. Yet the function of these duets is

heavily debated. This study investigated how female Happy Wrens select which songs

to sing using experiments where their mate and an intruding female were simulated by

broadcasting songs through loudspeakers. From their repertoire of about 40

different songs, females consistently selected the one that fit with their mate’s

song, but used the timing of their singing to signal aggression to other females.

This study indicates that duetting functions to signal pair commitment. Contact: Mr

Christopher Templeton, University of St Andrews,

 

I am not sure if this see/ear research means dot readers have smaller brains than ear players or vice versa = discuss!

 

What you see is what you hear - if your visual brain is small. Audiovisual

illusions can make us see things we only ever hear. Researchers from UCL

now tested what makes people more or less prone to such 'seeing with their

ears'. They found the influence of sounds on seeing is related to brain

structure. The smaller a participants' visual cortex, the more likely they

were to experience such an illusion. This might point to a clever strategy

for perception used by the brain. Unreliable input from the eyes is

supported by information provided by the ears. Contact: Mr Benjamin de

Haas, University College London,

 

???? :huh:

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I have absolutely no idea how you made that cognitive leap.

Unless you missed out the bit where another group of wrens selected their songs from a book ( the Penguin Book of Wren Songs perhaps) and were comparatively less successful in finding mates ...

Someone I was playing music with last night developed a blister on their left thumb from their octave key. That doesn't actually prove that Boehm flute players have smaller brains than concertina players.

Edited by Steve Mansfield
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Someone I was playing music with last night developed a blister on their left thumb from their octave key. That doesn't actually prove that Boehm flute players have smaller brains than concertina players.

Probably just more active thumbs, though maybe not more active than anglo players' thumbs.

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I am not sure if this see/ear research means dot readers have smaller brains than ear players or vice versa = discuss!

 

The smaller a participants' visual cortex, the more likely they were to experience such an illusion.

'Tain't about smaller brains, per se, just a particular part -- the visual cortex -- being smaller. Considering the way the brain develops, that would normally mean that some other part -- the auditory cortex, perhaps? -- is larger. (That's the part that has to do with listening, not a preference for Tories driving Audis.)

 

Has anyone investigated whether a smaller visual cortex is associated with "beady" eyes, or a larger auditory cortex with "elephant" ears? :unsure:

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I have absolutely no idea how you made that cognitive leap.

Unless you missed out the bit where another group of wrens selected their songs from a book ( the Penguin Book of Wren Songs perhaps) and were comparatively less successful in finding mates ...

Someone I was playing music with last night developed a blister on their left thumb from their octave key. That doesn't actually prove that Boehm flute players have smaller brains than concertina players.

V good!! :D

 

My cortex was speed reading ahead actually and thought it was going to say developed a blister..... on their bum........ :rolleyes:

 

Irene - would you like the two, full research papers? (I suppose after Wrens someone will be researching Random House singing amongst Penguins) B)

Edited by Kautilya
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That first study suggests that female birds ARE confrontational to other females, but indirectly. They use duets to signal a pair bond. Not necessarily happy, just putting on a DISPLAY of happiness to make the intruder feel unwelcome.

 

The second study doesn't say that "dots" players have smaller brains at all. It does explain why it is so hard for some of us to sight read a new version of a familiar song, if the arrangement doesn't match the one we are used to hearing!

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Irene - would you like the two, full research papers? (I suppose after Wrens someone will be researching Random House singing amongst Penguins) B)

 

No ta... I am mystified as to what you're going on about, but I don't think I'm going to struggle further .Sorry !! :blink:

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Oh! It's all about birds!

 

At first I thought we were into sea shanties and forebitters sung by female Naval ratings (WRNS, colloquially known as "Wrens") and Merchant Navy officers, i.e. 1st, 2nd and 3rd Mates, and accompanied on Crane or Maccann duets.

 

On the other hand, a female of the species putting on a show of harmony with a male of the species to deter another female of the species is not confined to (ornithological) wrens, is it?

:P

 

Cheers,

John

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Irene - would you like the two, full research papers? (I suppose after Wrens someone will be researching Random House singing amongst Penguins) B)

 

No ta... I am mystified as to what you're going on about, but I don't think I'm going to struggle further .Sorry !! :blink:

Not going on about anything Irene so no offence!

Blame the researchers and The Royal Society's biological proceedings for some interesting stuff from 'Nature' and a little lateral thinking in the world of music --

 

Jim's comment on the visual cortex is in fact rather intriguing with regard to teaching beginners by score or ear.

 

At Whitby folk week there was a system being promoted which pulled in more than a 100 (paying people a day to learn choral singing through the 'shape' of the notes.

I only popped in for half an hour at the end of the week and it was intriguing though not too sure what the ultimate aim was in terms of the religious material used. Can't remember what it is called but they have branches all across the UK, promoted by Americans in some cases.It originates from the US Bible movement it would seem and uses biblical texts for singing.

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At Whitby folk week there was a system being promoted which pulled in more than a 100 (paying people a day to learn choral singing through the 'shape' of the notes.

...

Can't remember what it is called...

It's called "shape note" singing. :)

 

It originates from the US Bible movement it would seem and uses biblical texts for singing.

It's simply a way of notating music that was used by certain popular hymn books (starting in the 19th century, or maybe even earlier?). Texts are hardly restricted to Bible texts.

 

The idea is that, while standard notation is used, the different degrees of the diatonic scale are also characterized by different geometric shapes of the notes (instead of always circles), so that those who don't understand staff notation can still read the do-re-mi's from the shapes. In "sol fa" notation, the scale goes do-re-mi-fa-sol-la-ti-do, regardless of the key. In the 4-shape notation (the most used, I believe), the shapes of the notes go circle-square-diamond-triangle-circle-square-triangle-circle. (Any deeper discussion, including the philosophy behind using only four shapes, should probably get a thread of it's own.)

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At Whitby folk week there was a system being promoted which pulled in more than a 100 (paying people a day to learn choral singing through the 'shape' of the notes.

I only popped in for half an hour at the end of the week and it was intriguing though not too sure what the ultimate aim was in terms of the religious material used. Can't remember what it is called but they have branches all across the UK, promoted by Americans in some cases.It originates from the US Bible movement it would seem and uses biblical texts for singing.

 

I wasn't there but strongly suspect that was 'Shape Note ' singing, a popular American method of passing on hymns without teaching standard Western notation. I'm as grumpy old atheist as the next grumpy old atheist, but I don't think there's anything sinister or proselytising to be read into the use of religious material, that's just the technique's home material. I'm sure a quick Google for 'shape note singing' would tell you more than you want to know, unless you think sight-readers should be restricted to only using Altavista of course ...

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At Whitby folk week there was a system being promoted which pulled in more than a 100 (paying people a day to learn choral singing through the 'shape' of the notes.

I only popped in for half an hour at the end of the week and it was intriguing though not too sure what the ultimate aim was in terms of the religious material used. Can't remember what it is called but they have branches all across the UK, promoted by Americans in some cases.It originates from the US Bible movement it would seem and uses biblical texts for singing.

 

I wasn't there but strongly suspect that was 'Shape Note ' singing, a popular American method of passing on hymns without teaching standard Western notation. I'm as grumpy old atheist as the next grumpy old atheist, but I don't think there's anything sinister or proselytising to be read into the use of religious material, that's just the technique's home material. I'm sure a quick Google for 'shape note singing' would tell you more than you want to know, unless you think sight-readers should be restricted to only using Altavista of course ...

 

Absolutely correct Steve - it was Sacred Harp (alternatively known as shape note) singing. A sight reading system which uses sol-fa and the shape of notes to enable those who can't read music in the more conventional sense. And nothing to be read into the use of the religious material ... some do, some do not subscribe to the religious beliefs in the songs (much as with the various Requiems that choral societies perform). The joy of singing is all that some are searching for . Sacred Harp singing is far more gutsy, open throated and robust than normal church music and quite often uses somewhat unconventional harmonies and dischords. In the last twenty years or so its popularity has increased in the Uk and has also spread over to the European continent as well (they had their first Sacred Harp Convention in Poland I believe).

 

Here's a video of the Polish contingent leading a hymn at the UK Sacred Harp Convention in Stannington in 2011

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...Sacred Harp (alternatively known as shape note) singing.

These days the names tend to be interchangeable, but Sacred Harp is the name of a particular hymnal that uses shape note notation. I think that these days Sacred Harp is the best known of those hymnals (with Southern Harmony coming second), hence the adoption of the name for the style of singing.

 

Also, the "sacred harp" is a term for the human voice, because in some religious traditions it's the only "musical instrument" which is not considered to be an invention of the Devil. So any and all a capella singing could be considered "sacred harp" (but usually isn't).

 

...some do, some do not subscribe to the religious beliefs in the songs...

I've long maintained that there are two types of songs that are very popular even with people who don't believe in their content -- religious songs and drinking songs, -- and that there are even those who consider the latter to be a form of the former. B)

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