dshep Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Here is the link to the ebay listing. http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120825368372#ht_500wt_1001 This belonged to my mother. I'm afraid I don't know where she got it but she's had it as long as I can remember. I'm not a musician and know very little about it unfortunately. I will do my best to answer any of your questions, I can take a video to let you hear it, and so on. Any reasonable request. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Wooff Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) Looks like you want too much money for this. Made after the take over by Boosey and Hawkes and during a period of extreem austerity in England. This, unfortunately, is not real Wheatstone quality... Sorry I don't want to appear to be rude about you instrument but I would suggest a figure closer to $500 than your buy it now price of $4000 ! Edited December 8, 2011 by Geoff Wooff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Hersh Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Looks like you want too much money for this. Made after the take over by Boosey and Hawkes and during a period of extreem austerity in England. This, unfortunately, is not real Wheatstone quality... Sorry I don't want to appear to be rude about you instrument but I would suggest a figure closer to $500 than your buy it now price of $4000 ! Geoff-- What is this based on? I haven't seen many postwar Wheatstone English concertinas on the market, but a Wheatstone Anglo from the 1950s would probably sell for at least $2000 or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Wooff Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) Well, from a look at the pictures I would think this is probably of the "Mayfair" quality. Most likely to have accordion reeds as do many of the post war Anglos that I have seen. Combine this with Plywood interiors , plastic keys and hook action and one has an instrument that sounds and plays much like the cheap starter models on offer new today from $300. I'm only trying to say that the owner is going to be disapointed if they think they will achieve such high bids. The Austerity situation in post war Britain was such that all manufacturers were encouraged by the government to export almost all of their production. This was aided by the high rates of Purchase Tax which effectively meant it was very difficult for anyone in the UK at that time to buy anything. I lived through that period and vividly recall how little we all had. In fact it was not untill the begining of the 1970's that things started to improve. So, this type of Wheatstone is probably quite rare in England but when I lived in Ireland I saw ,and was asked to repair, many Anglos that had been brought back from South Africa by someone with contacts there.These anglos were mostly from the 1950's Wheatstone production. Most of them were not any better than Mahogany ended lachenal's.Most of them had accordion type reeds, screwed to plywood reedpans. With almost all competition gone from their market, and a few aged original Wheatstone workers still employed, Boosey and Hawkes tried to cut as many corners as possible in an attempt to make a profit. Those in the know went to Harry Crabb instead. Edited December 8, 2011 by Geoff Wooff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Jowaisas Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I'll agree with Geoff that in some cases the materials and construction methods Wheatstone used after WWII were not up to previous standards. If you expected the quality associated with Wheatstone before 1940 you might be in for disappointment. However many instruments from this period were decent servicable players and some had good to exceptional reeds albeit more and more often in aluminum shoes than brass. I've owned several instruments from this period that played well and had good sound and I've worked on a few Aeolas from this same period that were solid quality instruments. My first anglo was a 1950s Wheatstone with screwed down shoes and reed tongues fastened by crimping rather than clamped. Geoff, I don't believe the reeds were of an accordion profile. If anything they had too much strident "cut" for my taste. This concertina gave me no problems in the two years that I owned it. To be fair I've also worked on a couple of 1950s anglos that had done the South African circuit that resisted my best efforts to markedly improve their performance. A bit difficult to say whether their limitations started at the factory or were visited upon them at a later date. I have never owned or worked on a Mayfair Wheatstone. My understanding is that by then Wheatstone was using accordion type reeds. In my opinion the ebay concertina in question needs to be judged on its own merits. It should have traditional concertina reeds dovetailed into a radiaql reed pan. The reed shoes might even be brass if the seller's estimate is correct that the instrument was made in 1951. Wheatstone reeds in aluminum frames can be very good as well (as are the aluminum shoed Crabbs from this period) It would be illuminating to see pictures of the reed pan and internals. I agree that the prices presently attached to this instrument might be unrealistic. The market will decide. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindizzy Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Here is the link to the ebay listing. http://www.ebay.com/...2#ht_500wt_1001 This belonged to my mother. I'm afraid I don't know where she got it but she's had it as long as I can remember. I'm not a musician and know very little about it unfortunately. I will do my best to answer any of your questions, I can take a video to let you hear it, and so on. Any reasonable request. Thank you This is a Wheatstone Mayfair (English style not Anglo). They can compare well with things like the cheaper modern hybrids, eg Jackie or the Stagi and Hohner. In good working order, this would be OK as a beginners instrument. (I've played a few Mayfairs and they can be quite nice, though the buttons get a bit rattly) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Franch Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 The Button Box has a May Fair for which they are asking $1,150. I think they've had this one or a similar one for quite a while. http://www.buttonbox.com/instruments-in-stock.html#english Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Molkentin Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 The Button Box has a May Fair for which they are asking $1,150. I think they've had this one or a similar one for quite a while. http://www.buttonbox.com/instruments-in-stock.html#english O.K., that's the common and cheap 35k model with even less fretwork - one of those has been sold for much less on eBay this year. The here mentioned 48k EC may meet better standards, as already stated by Greg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjmiller Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 There's a comparable Wheatstone here: http://www.vintage-instruments.com/navigate/catidx6.htm They're a respected dealer of vintage instruments here in The States. The bad news is that it's been for sale for a long, long, time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 This is a Wheatstone Mayfair (English style not Anglo). I agree it has some similarities to a Mayfair, but I don't think it is for three reasons: 1 Mayfair models have the name Mayfair pressed into the metal ends 2 Mayfair English concertinas never have as many as 48 buttons because the accordion reeds they use take up too much space for 48 keys in a standard size body. 3 Mayfairs that I have seen don't have serial numbers on the end plates, this one does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spindizzy Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) On reflection, I'd go with Theo's answer. Sorry if I misled you. Presumably it's a late model standard wheatstone. Would it have concertina reeds then? I was probably misled by trying a similar one to this (ie a 48 button - with tinny metal ends, that I was told was a Mayfair) Chris ps I still wouldn't pay £2000 for it - maybe £500 max? (My opinion only) Edited December 8, 2011 by spindizzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimLucas Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 On reflection, I'd go with Theo's answer. Sorry if I misled you.Presumably it's a late model standard wheatstone. Would it have concertina reeds then? Yes. My first concertina was much like this one, which this ledger page says is a model 1E (the 1950's basic English model), except that mine had wooden ends. Definitely concertina reeds (mine had aluminum reed shoes). I also briefly had another wooden-ended one. (Same bellows papers on all three, FWIW.) Both those I had were in excellent condition and definitely nice players, albeit not as fine as the Aeolas I've had since. Miles above the Mayfairs and better than many a restored older low-end Wheatstone or Lachenal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshep Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) Thanks for all the feedback, everyone. Is there anything I can do to describe it more accurately? I've noticed a number of questions coming up but what specifically can I answer (or what photos can I provide, etc)? shep, the seller Edited December 8, 2011 by dshep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshep Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) There's a comparable Wheatstone here: http://www.vintage-instruments.com/navigate/catidx6.htm They're a respected dealer of vintage instruments here in The States. The bad news is that it's been for sale for a long, long, time. yes that is comparable, and a little nicer. thank you for finding that. shep Edited December 8, 2011 by dshep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirge Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Thanks for all the feedback, everyone. Is there anything I can do to describe it more accurately? I've noticed a number of questions coming up but what specifically can I answer (or what photos can I provide, etc)? shep, the seller If you undid one end and photographed the reeds people would then be sure if it had concertina reeds. From what someone said earlier this seems likely because it has more buttons than would be physically possible with accordion reeds (if I understood the comment right) and it certainly would make it more valuable to remove the doubt. You could start with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshep Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 Thanks for all the feedback, everyone. Is there anything I can do to describe it more accurately? I've noticed a number of questions coming up but what specifically can I answer (or what photos can I provide, etc)? shep, the seller If you undid one end and photographed the reeds people would then be sure if it had concertina reeds. From what someone said earlier this seems likely because it has more buttons than would be physically possible with accordion reeds (if I understood the comment right) and it certainly would make it more valuable to remove the doubt. You could start with that. ok. Before I do that, is there any chance I can damage it? I'm not very good with my hands, frankly. Happy to do it if it's safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theo Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Just undo the six screws round the edge and the end will lift off. Don't touch the smaller screws inside the thumbstrap and on the finger rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Husmann Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Hello folks, a couple of days ago I placed a bid on a Wheatstone concertina and won the auction (not very high, actually). Looks a bit different than the metal ended examples here but has a serial number in the 36xxx range. It´s supposed to arrive in a few days and if there is interest I might tell a bit about that instrument as well. Christian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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