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Developing A Mentorship for Young Men & Women


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Making concertina's Available to Younger People

I recently joined the ICA and I found Pauline de Snoo's introduction to several of the ICA magazines to be very informative and eye opening, in particular her objective to get more young folks involved with the Concertina. I personally delayed entry largely due to the cost and not realizing that there is such a tremendous support group of you folks out there. I made the leap and I love it. Pardon the digression. I however, am not what one would consider a "young person" (young in heart perhaps)and I have noticed that most of us are like a good wine.... Needless-to say Pauline's objective (and I am sure many of yours) of getting young people involved is appears to me to be a very important activity. I would be willing to get involved.

I don't have the answers but just brainstorming would there be a way to somehow develop a program (perhaps through ICA) that would make it reasonable and affordable and enjoyable to get young men and women involved. I am sure this group would be full of ideas and thought it would make for an excellent discussion. Finally, I also want to credit a post Kautiyla's made in the "buy and sell Forum" that in addition to Pauline got me thinking what a great idea.

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To state the obvious Stephen, this type of thing has already happened to good effect in the Irish traditional Music world. Many young people have been encouraged to learn the usual instruments of that genre and to sing and dance in traditional styles.

The strength behind this successfull revival was, and is, the parents of these youngsters. I am lucky to have been involved as a maker and repairer of instruments. Many times a parent would arrive at my house with a 6,7 or 8 year old child and the concertina that had a fault. It was always so nice to be able to help by fixing the problem after which I invariably asked the young person to play a tune for me. Many of these junior musicians have grown into great players.

 

It is my observation from these experiences that without the commitment and financial support of the parents many of these little success stories would not have happened.There is, of course, an element of 'national cultural identity' involved with this ITM revival but it has brought that culture back from the brink of extinction.

 

Just how this could be done in other musical genres and especially in regard to the 'Concertina' I really do not know. I suggest that there would need to be something more behind your 'mentorship' idea than just 'here is a handy instrument that lots of people should play if only they had the chance'.

 

Being put off from starting to play the Concertina due to the cost; well as musical instruments go the Concertina is not an expensive one. Ok,fine yes one could buy very cheaply some other forms of instruments but there are also very reasonably priced starter concertinas on the market.

 

Most children's mother's would be more likely to purchase an electronic Organ keyboard for their offspring than a WHAT?

 

Here in France there is musical education available to all, locally. Many children are learning some form of Accordion from an early age and one can even hire an instrument from the music schools. I could sign up at the local Conservatoire for lessons on just about every possible musical instrument.

 

So, what I am trying to say is there needs to be a good reason for anyone to take up a new instrument. Usually this is a facination brought about by hearing someone play it well and with an absorbed passion... making it look like a fun thing to do. A commitment might follow this initial exposure and those most tenacious will find a way to proceed.

Edited by Geoff Wooff
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i have read somewhere or other that the world's biggest accordion market is china and its children, which is i'm sure not unrelated to something else i read somewhere about some kind of an effort to get inexpensive chinese-made starter concertinas out to the kids there. down the line, there is a thornier hurdle with the steep prices for highly playable quality instruments, but seems to me this could be a golden age for disseminating through the increasingly playable starter concertinas. i'm biased, but i'd say the issue is only for children to see and hear them more---concertinas are something that many children would just have to see to want to get their hands on, no? though i play and love anglo, i must say that most particularly that low-priced, playable unisonorics seem to me to have the potential for global hegemony....

Edited by ceemonster
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Making concertina's Available to Younger People

I recently joined the ICA and I found Pauline de Snoo's introduction to several of the ICA magazines to be very informative and eye opening, in particular her objective to get more young folks involved with the Concertina. I personally delayed entry largely due to the cost and not realizing that there is such a tremendous support group of you folks out there. I made the leap and I love it. Pardon the digression. I however, am not what one would consider a "young person" (young in heart perhaps)and I have noticed that most of us are like a good wine.... Needless-to say Pauline's objective (and I am sure many of yours) of getting young people involved is appears to me to be a very important activity. I would be willing to get involved.

I don't have the answers but just brainstorming would there be a way to somehow develop a program (perhaps through ICA) that would make it reasonable and affordable and enjoyable to get young men and women involved. I am sure this group would be full of ideas and thought it would make for an excellent discussion. Finally, I also want to credit a post Kautiyla's made in the "buy and sell Forum" that in addition to Pauline got me thinking what a great idea.

Tku Stephen

post no 8 (I think. Two pages away and my senile brain has forgotten already.... :blink:

http://www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=13464&st=0&gopid=130045entry130045

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Here in France there is musical education available to all, locally. Many children are learning some form of Accordion from an early age and one can even hire an instrument from the music schools. I could sign up at the local Conservatoire for lessons on just about every possible musical instrument.

 

Geoff here is one good example of what you mean.

 

I seem to remember out of a population of 13,000 there are more than 500 players of different instruments at Gravelines. One reason was/is the revenue from the massive nuclear power installation/stations there under the taxe professionelle EDF (Elec. de France) has to pay a big whack despite recent changes) to the local council - very high per head compared with most municipalites in France if not the highest.

 

This has meant quite a lot of dosh has been spent for sports and music centres and the purchase of instruments to borrow for free and lessons and a whole series of townspeople performances.

 

Just like in the UK ho ho. Think how much money the UK govt could save if all our young people were now able to play on the streets and feed and clothe themselves from pennies in hats instead of getting a non-existent job - but I digress to music at St Paul's

 

The smart young mayor (mind u he is at least 15 years older since I first met him) Bertrand Ringot is a committed and clever operator with a national reputation for getting things happening. He is also de la gauche - a socialist.**

 

Though here is how a UK shoestring can stretch a mile with the right Bells (Alan and Christine) on your toes: see && at end of URLS

 

 

 

http://www.ville-gravelines.fr/

and the school of music dance and visual arts-And they start with kids from 4/5 years old.

http://www.ville-gravelines.fr/Ville-Gravelines-2003%20Dossier/Ville-Gravelines-2003/index.html

 

http://www.ville-gravelines.fr/acamusique/hbm/lesmusiciens/index.html

 

**

http://www.bing.com/search?q=bertrand+ringot+president+de&go=&qs=n&sk=&form=QBLH&filt=all

 

http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/working-in-france/starting-a-business/other-business-taxes/

 

&& and look at the for young persons page too

http://www.folkus.co.uk/home.htm

Edited by Kautilya
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So to continue my thoughts from yesterday I would like to stress that there first needs to be some sort of Role Model to inspire the young (and not so young) to commence learning of any instrument. The Guitar, for instance, is possibly the most popular instrument today due to its use in the majority of popluar musical genres by very famous high profile people. Lots of 'would be' guitarists wanting to play like Jimmy Hendrix, Dgango Reinhart or John Williams.

 

Is there anyone playing the Concertina who has such a high profile ? Perhaps the most well know player, alive today, of the Anglo would be Noel Hill, of the English... Alistair Anderson, of the Duet...Mike Hibbert....????

 

When a need/want has been created then the markets will respond to fill any gaps. Example; there has been a demand for the Anglo Concertina created by the use of that instrument in Irish music... therefore there are now a good few makers of that instrument around the world. Try counting the number of makers of the English or the Duets... very few.

 

I have been researching the Wheatstone Ledgers recently to see just how popular the Duets were during their heyday. I found a definate peak in production of these during the early 1920's. Why could that have been ? I suggest it was due to the relatively high profile of one or two proffesional players (Prince, Honri) and the availability of the Gramaphone records.

 

To conclude; It would be wonderfull if there were some young talented people taking up the English and the Duet systems and some sort of sponsorship scheme for these individuals is a great idea but ,firstly those yougsters have to be inspired to want to start. So, firstly find your needy beginners then look at how to help them.

 

Nice idea though Stephen. best regards, Geoff.

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So to continue my thoughts from yesterday I would like to stress that there first needs to be some sort of Role Model to inspire the young (and not so young) to commence learning of any instrument. The Guitar, for instance, is possibly the most popular instrument today due to its use in the majority of popluar musical genres by very famous high profile people. Lots of 'would be' guitarists wanting to play like Jimmy Hendrix, Dgango Reinhart or John Williams.

 

Is there anyone playing the Concertina who has such a high profile ? Perhaps the most well know player, alive today, of the Anglo would be Noel Hill, of the English... Alistair Anderson, of the Duet...Mike Hibbert....????

 

When a need/want has been created then the markets will respond to fill any gaps. Example; there has been a demand for the Anglo Concertina created by the use of that instrument in Irish music... therefore there are now a good few makers of that instrument around the world. Try counting the number of makers of the English or the Duets... very few.

 

I have been researching the Wheatstone Ledgers recently to see just how popular the Duets were during their heyday. I found a definate peak in production of these during the early 1920's. Why could that have been ? I suggest it was due to the relatively high profile of one or two proffesional players (Prince, Honri) and the availability of the Gramaphone records.

 

To conclude; It would be wonderfull if there were some young talented people taking up the English and the Duet systems and some sort of sponsorship scheme for these individuals is a great idea but ,firstly those yougsters have to be inspired to want to start. So, firstly find your needy beginners then look at how to help them.

 

Nice idea though Stephen. best regards, Geoff.

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Geoff, Kautilya, Ceemmonster, Geoff I read somewhere that your family has been with Concertinas for three generations. Wow! I didn't expect this to be a "new" idea but I thought the discussion would be interesting and informative (and it certainly has been). I guess all starts with us as individuals too in terms of what we might have to offer. I found the government funding of music education in France to be quite interesting. Being a newbie myself...I guess I will keep an eye out for a newer newbie and see how I personally might be able to help. You all (this site) willingness to share knowledge has been a mind blowing experience. The only downside is that it takes away time I should be practicing. ;) Stephen in Texas

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Geoff, Kautilya, Ceemmonster, Geoff I read somewhere that your family has been with Concertinas for three generations. Wow! I didn't expect this to be a "new" idea but I thought the discussion would be interesting and informative (and it certainly has been). I guess all starts with us as individuals too in terms of what we might have to offer. I found the government funding of music education in France to be quite interesting. Being a newbie myself...I guess I will keep an eye out for a newer newbie and see how I personally might be able to help. You all (this site) willingness to share knowledge has been a mind blowing experience. The only downside is that it takes away time I should be practicing. ;) Stephen in Texas

 

 

Stephen,

the 'Geoff' on this site who has a three (or more) generation involvement with Concertina making and repairing would be Geoff Crabb , not me.It was from Geoff Crabb's father that I bought my first good concertina. But I have been playing (and fixing concertinas) for nearly forty years. The instruments that I make are the Uilleann Pipes (the Irish pipes) which I have been lucky to be able to help some young people obtain at the right age to really learn the thing properly.

 

Regarding the government support in France for music studies (and I suppose other subjects too); the courses are not free, at least in our area, but are at a cost that anyone should be able to afford. My wife has been studying the Cornemuse (one of the French Bagpipes) at the local music school for the last three years at a cost of about 170 Euros ($200) per year. There she has access to the very best of teachers.

 

I realise that finding a Concertina ,or a teather for it, is not something available on any street corner but the situation has greatly improved over the time I have been involved. Certainly a website like this one is a great help to us all.

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Regarding the government support in France for music studies (and I suppose other subjects too); the courses are not free, at least in our area,.

Yes, Geoff is right depends on the area. Grand-Fort Philippe across the Chenal (canal) from Gravelines does not have the same revenues from the power station! Twas built by the Spanish in the 18th C when they controlled the area and also cod Fishing in the North Sea and Arctic.

 

But for Gravelines I failed to give the deeper URL about the Municipal Music School which says it is open to children from the age of 5 and the aim is to introduce the greatest number to the rudiments of music and musical instruments in an atmosphere of fun.

 

L'inscription à l'École Municipale de Musique et le prêt des instruments sont GRATUITS.

"There is no charge to join the school or borrow instruments."

 

I notice ( as usual the French love being complicated!)that for some other musical courses available under the town hall and the Mitterand Centre the annual subscription seems to be around euro50 for adults. Almost every kind of instrument except concertina (bandoneón ) tho accordion is in the list!

 

You get to move up (children and adults) from basic music classes after an exam to options such as the orchestral class and then after six years of exams (or at the discretion of the teacher!) entry into the Harmonie Municipale de Gravelines which has been around for 60 years and lots of French towns have such a 'town' band.

 

It would be interesting to make a mass concertina/free-reed outing from the UK to Gravelines - only just up the road from Calais ferries and the Chunnel, and I am sure they would go for a couple of concerts and sessions (drinking and eating as well as playing) with other varied local instruments.

 

But then we don't seem to travel very well, finding the "Continent cut off by fog" too often! Sometimes Sea France can be tempted to do a special deal for a group of travelling musicians who in return perform during the crossings as a promotional effort.

 

There is special accomodation for visitors at the Gravelines Sports Centre but it may just be for the young and fit! Next to it is the Polder tourism lodge with half to full board ranging from E25 full board to E52, two bedded rooms.

http://www.sportica.fr/modulosite2/fiche.php?id_bouton=7&id=407&fr=1

 

There are a number of low-cost hotels within 25kms such as F1, Campanile, Premiere for between 30 and 50 euros per room per night plus breakfast if required around five euros.

 

And some shared hostel type accommodation

http://www.tourisme-gravelines.fr/fr/tourisme/preparez-votre-sejour/hebergements/hebergements-collectifs

 

plus hotels up to e80 and more for those who want to splash out.......

 

And some pretty good eateries on the coast and down the valleys of the river Aa with reasonable prix fixe menus from say e25 to e60 for a real blowout.

 

http://www.tourisme-gravelines.fr/fr/tourisme/preparez-votre-sejour/restauration/restaurants

 

Or you can take a Thermos, make your own sandwiches and go bird-watching at Oye Plage reserve. :P

Edited by Kautilya
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One of the aims of the International Concertina Association is to encourage the playing of the concertina. This includes young people and we are particularly keen to encourage them. It is not completely clear what is the best way.

 

One thing we do is to award a bursary in support of a player at the Folkworks Youth Summer School. Nobody asked for one this year but last year we awarded two. One of the recipients is now doing the folk degree course at Newcastle University. The other, ten years old at the time, is still playing with the North East Concertina Players.

 

I am not convinced that cost is such a big barrier. As has been pointed out, economical concertinas are in the same range as many other instruments. Visibility may be more of an issue.

 

Any suggestions on ways to make concertinas more visible and to encourage young players would be very welcome.

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Geoff, Kautilya, Ceemmonster, Geoff I read somewhere that your family has been with Concertinas for three generations. Wow! I didn't expect this to be a "new" idea but I thought the discussion would be interesting and informative (and it certainly has been). I guess all starts with us as individuals too in terms of what we might have to offer. I found the government funding of music education in France to be quite interesting. Being a newbie myself...I guess I will keep an eye out for a newer newbie and see how I personally might be able to help. You all (this site) willingness to share knowledge has been a mind blowing experience. The only downside is that it takes away time I should be practicing. ;) Stephen in Texas

 

 

Stephen,

the 'Geoff' on this site who has a three (or more) generation involvement with Concertina making and repairing would be Geoff Crabb , not me.It was from Geoff Crabb's father that I bought my first good concertina. But I have been playing (and fixing concertinas) for nearly forty years. The instruments that I make are the Uilleann Pipes (the Irish pipes) which I have been lucky to be able to help some young people obtain at the right age to really learn the thing properly.

 

Regarding the government support in France for music studies (and I suppose other subjects too); the courses are not free, at least in our area, but are at a cost that anyone should be able to afford. My wife has been studying the Cornemuse (one of the French Bagpipes) at the local music school for the last three years at a cost of about 170 Euros ($200) per year. There she has access to the very best of teachers.

 

I realise that finding a Concertina ,or a teather for it, is not something available on any street corner but the situation has greatly improved over the time I have been involved. Certainly a website like this one is a great help to us all.

Geoff, Forty years wow...Thanks for the clarification. Stephen

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Geoff, Forty years is quite an accomplishment. I think the role model is a fantastic idea. I wonder if we might get Justin Bieber interested. :P I know from my discussion with Pauline de Snoo she is engaging younger people too. It must boil down to being a home based effort.

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One of the aims of the International Concertina Association is to encourage the playing of the concertina. This includes young people and we are particularly keen to encourage them. It is not completely clear what is the best way.

 

One thing we do is to award a bursary in support of a player at the Folkworks Youth Summer School. Nobody asked for one this year but last year we awarded two. One of the recipients is now doing the folk degree course at Newcastle University. The other, ten years old at the time, is still playing with the North East Concertina Players.

 

I am not convinced that cost is such a big barrier. As has been pointed out, economical concertinas are in the same range as many other instruments. Visibility may be more of an issue.

 

Any suggestions on ways to make concertinas more visible and to encourage young players would be very welcome.

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Not sure if I count as young...but I'm under 30 and play the anglo. Although its an instrument I tend to play solo at home. As I find it hard to hear myself enough to play in a group. Plus I have a tendency to choose different tunes and keys to everyone else.

I think I've been suitably encouraged by those I meet at workshops, festivals sessions etc.

I'm not a member of the ICA as its not really appealed to me before.

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