Valve problem?

[richard]

Hello

 

I think I have a valve problem.

 

On the same button on the left side (lower pitch notes) when I alternate bellows direction there is an echo-like, fluttery sound as it alternated between the two notes. I have always assumed it is a valve problem. Do you agree?

 

Does any body have suggestions for how to fix it? It has been through the hands of few repair folks. The valve itself I assume is not old or poor quality. ????

 

Thanks for any suggestions.

 

Richard

Edited May 31, 2011 by richard

[Greg Jowaisas]

Hi Richard,

I may have been one of the repair people (?)

 

Valves, like wizards, can be subtle and quick to anger.

 

I use hair sheep leather.

 

In valving I usually start with the lightest valves that i think will do the job. Invariably there will be a few noisy ones. I check placement to make sure they are centered and in the case of chambers, not rubbing against the wall. If I'm still having problems I'll try a different but similar valve. If problems persist I'll go to a slightly heavier valve.

 

Heavier valves can effect tone and volume (less bright; quieter) Valve changes can effect tuning by several cents.

 

Greg

[Dirge]

One suggestion is the standard one round here; buy Dave Elliot's invaluable concertina repair manual which will help you have a look for yourself. Then you can cope with basic stuff before you go to the experts, which means you are your own first aid.

 

This is the sort of thing that you can have a look and a think about before you let yourself in for all the grief involved in getting it to an expert and doing without it while they do their work.

 

Changing valves, for instance, is an easy job. I keep a little stock of them given me by my preferred restorer, and after some reticence am now quite happy to swap them over; I've learnt that this is worth doing when you're scratching your head a bit even if there's no actual reason for so doing. 'If in doubt suspect the valve' seems to work.

 

Greg's suggestion that it might be catching on the side of the chamber sounds a good one to look at; if that's it you just carefully detach it and realign it, for instance.

[richard]

Hello

 

Thank you gents so far for your suggestions.

 

Do the vague symptoms which I described inarticulately sound like the valve is getting "snagged" on something and being prevented from opening and shutting quickly?

 

Richard

[Greg Jowaisas]

Hello

 

Thank you gents so far for your suggestions.

 

Do the vague symptoms which I described inarticulately sound like the valve is getting "snagged" on something and being prevented from opening and shutting quickly?

 

Richard

 

Valves that are stiff or don't lay flat usually "pop". A valve that gets hung up on a chamber wall will express itself as a note that might be breathy and then "charge ahead", sometimes with a pop, to sudden full volume and often a cent or two rise in pitch. Off center valves can cause a note to be slow or weaker than expected.

 

"Fluttering" or "gargling" valves are still a mystery to me. Generally I treat them by replacement to a different or slightly heavier valve. I still haven't figured out exactly why they flutter or gargle.

 

Greg

[d.elliott]

Hello

 

Thank you gents so far for your suggestions.

 

Do the vague symptoms which I described inarticulately sound like the valve is getting "snagged" on something and being prevented from opening and shutting quickly?

 

Richard

 

Valves that are stiff or don't lay flat usually "pop". A valve that gets hung up on a chamber wall will express itself as a note that might be breathy and then "charge ahead", sometimes with a pop, to sudden full volume and often a cent or two rise in pitch. Off center valves can cause a note to be slow or weaker than expected.

 

"Fluttering" or "gargling" valves are still a mystery to me. Generally I treat them by replacement to a different or slightly heavier valve. I still haven't figured out exactly why they flutter or gargle.

 

Greg

 

 

 

I have known this sort of valve sound following a re-valve exercise where I had inadvertently left a wisp of wood raised by my 'cleaning' of the old glue from the vent area. the valve was not quite laying flat and at low pressure play is was, I suppose, 'bouncing'

 

Two other suggestions to eliminate are:

 

is the valve fully closing off the vent, are you actually hearing beating with the mating reed?

 

are you fully sure that the reed itself is not a little loose in its dovetailed housing slot?

 

Dave