Do anybody know the key of this Paddy Fahey's?

[fernando]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tXcRYA1M08

 

I would like to know the key of this tune, if anybody can tell me that would be great.

 

If anyone is interested in knowing about the composer, Wikipedia will explain it much better than me:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paddy_Fahey

Edited November 30, 2010 by fernando

[Chris Drinkwater]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tXcRYA1M08

 

I would like to know the key of this tune, if anybody can tell me that would be great.

 

If anyone is interested in knowing about the composer, Wikipedia will explain it much better than me:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paddy_Fahey

 

 

Hello Fernando - the key you seem to play it in is the key of G, but I stand to be corrected. Certainly, your finish note is a G, and that normally indicates the key the tune is being played in. Do you know which number Paddy Fahey's it is?

 

Chris

[Michael Reid]

I would say that it switches between G mixolydian and G major. The prominent F naturals in opening phrase indicate the mixolydian mode. But both the A and B parts end in G major.

 

Ambiguous keys occur in several Paddy Fahy tunes. If you need a single key designation, I would go with G mix because that's how the tune begins, and it's the starting key that is the more useful piece of information for accompanists, in my opinion. For example: if I were leading a set in a session and decided to make this the next tune, the folks who play accompaniment (guitar, bouzouki) would be better served if I called out "G mix" instead of "G". That would clue them in that an F major chord would be appropriate at the end of those phrases with the F naturals.

 

I found this tune on thesession.org, where it is notated as D mix; that's clearly wrong. A couple of versions given in the comments have it as G major.

[fernando]

I don't know the number of this tune Chris, sorry, I recorded in a session in Galway city time ago.

 

I have the feeling that you must be right Michael, I don't think this is in G major. I can tell it just because of the fingering.

 

I love this tune, and I'm getting a bit excited about it. Because I can see that it is in a key I don't usually play, I love that! the fingering is new, this is a new pattern for me. I need to know the key because I'm transposing it to other keys. What I usually do is to find out about the key of the original, and then I know the key of them all, I just have to look for the note that gives the name to the key.

 

But I couldn't find this tune in internet! because Paddy Fahey's puts allways the same name to all his tunes, I cannot make a proper search.

 

Do you know where I can find a recording of that tune that is in thesession.org Michael? it's in Dmix! I would like to try to play that! I can change the key of the one I know to Dmix and see if the fingering is similar

[Michael Reid]

Fernando,

 

The link I provided in my previous post is to the page on thesession.org where you can find the sheet music and ABC notation for this tune. If you click on the Comments tab, you will see some links to recordings, but they are all dead links. Unfortunately, I don't know of another recorded source.

 

To clarify my comment about D mix: When the tune was submitted to concertina.net in ABC format, it was labeled D mix. But if you look at the sheet music, it's clear that it's not D anything. The person who submitted the tune apparently wanted a key signature of one sharp (F sharp), and D mix provides that, but you could get the same result by specifying the key of G (major). Please regard the D mix label as an error.

 

If I were notating this tune, I would label it G mix, which yields no sharps or flats. Then the F's would be played natural, excerpt in cases where they are marked within a measure to be sharped.

[JimLucas]

If I were notating this tune, I would label it G mix, which yields no sharps or flats. Then the F's would be played natural, excerpt in cases where they are marked within a measure to be sharped.

G mix sounds right to me. But not G mixolydian. Rather G mixed.

[fernando]

If I were notating this tune, I would label it G mix, which yields no sharps or flats. Then the F's would be played natural, excerpt in cases where they are marked within a measure to be sharped.

G mix sounds right to me. But not G mixolydian. Rather G mixed.

 

Hi Jim!

 

What do you mean by Gmixed?

 

It sounds like a joke to me, but I'm not sure, because you are an Ineluctable Opinionmaker

Edited December 1, 2010 by fernando

[JimLucas]

If I were notating this tune, I would label it G mix, which yields no sharps or flats. Then the F's would be played natural, excerpt in cases where they are marked within a measure to be sharped.

G mix sounds right to me. But not G mixolydian. Rather G mixed.

What do you mean by Gmixed?

 

It sounds like a joke to me, but I'm not sure, because you are an Ineluctable Opinionmaker

The label Ineluctable Opinionmaker was, I believe, chosen by Ken Coles, not by me. And all it really means is that I've posted an unreasonable number of posts.

 

As for "G mixed", it is a joke, but a serious joke. There are tunes in many folk traditions for which the classical music notion of key provides neither an accurate description nor an adequate guide to harmonizing. I believe this is one of them.

 

With only F# in the tune, one would ordinarily say it was in the key of G. With only F-naturals, many would class it as G-mixolydian. But both F# and F-natural are integral parts of this Paddy Fahey reel, so it would seem to be more of a mixture of more than one kind of G scale. In particular, the B part of this tune seems to want (in different places) chords of both F-major -- which doesn't fit with G major -- and D major (or D7) -- which doesn't fit with G mixolydian.

[fernando]

If I were notating this tune, I would label it G mix, which yields no sharps or flats. Then the F's would be played natural, excerpt in cases where they are marked within a measure to be sharped.

G mix sounds right to me. But not G mixolydian. Rather G mixed.

What do you mean by Gmixed?

 

It sounds like a joke to me, but I'm not sure, because you are an Ineluctable Opinionmaker

The label Ineluctable Opinionmaker was, I believe, chosen by Ken Coles, not by me. And all it really means is that I've posted an unreasonable number of posts.

 

As for "G mixed", it is a joke, but a serious joke. There are tunes in many folk traditions for which the classical music notion of key provides neither an accurate description nor an adequate guide to harmonizing. I believe this is one of them.

 

With only F# in the tune, one would ordinarily say it was in the key of G. With only F-naturals, many would class it as G-mixolydian. But both F# and F-natural are integral parts of this Paddy Fahey reel, so it would seem to be more of a mixture of more than one kind of G scale. In particular, the B part of this tune seems to want (in different places) chords of both F-major -- which doesn't fit with G major -- and D major (or D7) -- which doesn't fit with G mixolydian.

 

Great Jim! very good! wonderful! I'm learning so much in this forum! It's the first time I hear something like this. But it makes sense to me, I knew something very strange happens with this tune, and I wanted to know what it was. Thanks a lot!

[MichaelF]

I would say that it switches between G mixolydian and G major. The prominent F naturals in opening phrase indicate the mixolydian mode. But both the A and B parts end in G major.

 

Ambiguous keys occur in several Paddy Fahy tunes. If you need a single key designation, I would go with G mix because that's how the tune begins, and it's the starting key that is the more useful piece of information for accompanists, in my opinion. For example: if I were leading a set in a session and decided to make this the next tune, the folks who play accompaniment (guitar, bouzouki) would be better served if I called out "G mix" instead of "G". That would clue them in that an F major chord would be appropriate at the end of those phrases with the F naturals.

 

I found this tune on thesession.org, where it is notated as D mix; that's clearly wrong. A couple of versions given in the comments have it as G major.

 

 

For what it's worth - the excellent Mac program, Barfly, analyses this tune, which seems to be close to that which Fernando is playing, as G mixolydian with a very high level of confidence and no other alternative keys. It also analyses all the 5 variations of the the tune in the comments section as G mixolydian without an alternative key, in spite of the key for each being written as G major.

 

To my ear I would say it stays in the same key throughout and it's not a major key.

[Chris Drinkwater]

This topic brings to mind some tunes that I know, that are nominally in the key of G major but also have a C# in them, as well as the C natural. Examples are the jig, Tars of the Victory, The Trade Wind Hornpipe and the Swedish walking tune Gånglåt från Äppelbo .

 

Chris