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Which Concertina for French mazurkas


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Right on the spot, Alan! That's how a real traditional French mazurka sounds. I'll see if I can squeeze one out of my EC myself this weekend.

 

With all due respect, how is it possible that a "real traditional French mazurka" sounds real traditional french on english made 30 button Concertina? It may sound good, convincing, interesting, inspiring but been "real", "traditional", "French" is a bit too much.

 

Of course its not possible, an Italian accordion is requred. :ph34r:

Edited by Theo
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The Hurdy Gurdy provides much of the percussion for these old French tunes. The percussion comes from the vibrating bridge (Trompette)that buzzes by jerking the wrist whilst turning the handle of the wheel which plays the strings. The handle can be jerked on one , a half or a quarter revolution. So a maximum of for buzzes per revolution. This is where the jerky and not smooth traditional sound comes from on Mazurkas and Bourree's.

The hop steps of a French Mazurka comes on the A part of the tune and the second part B is waltz only.

A much faster speed than the English Waltz

Al

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Right on the spot, Alan! That's how a real traditional French mazurka sounds. I'll see if I can squeeze one out of my EC myself this weekend.

 

With all due respect, how is it possible that a "real traditional French mazurka" sounds real traditional french on english made 30 button Concertina? It may sound good, convincing, interesting, inspiring but been "real", "traditional", "French" is a bit too much.

 

Of course its not possible, an Italian accordion is requred. :ph34r:

 

 

You wouldn't call, say, Antonelli reeds in hybrid concertina "traditional", would you?

People who pick up concertina should know that Concertina is rare instrument. Aside from Irish Folk Music and SA it is not associated with any tradition, will not sound authentic, will always be a novelty. Playing French Mazurka on Anglo Concertina will cause you to be looked at, often critically, by those you want to play with. Isn't it common on this site to step on loud wet tuned Piano Accordions?

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Right on the spot, Alan! That's how a real traditional French mazurka sounds. I'll see if I can squeeze one out of my EC myself this weekend.

 

With all due respect, how is it possible that a "real traditional French mazurka" sounds real traditional french on english made 30 button Concertina? It may sound good, convincing, interesting, inspiring but been "real", "traditional", "French" is a bit too much.

 

Of course its not possible, an Italian accordion is requred. :ph34r:

 

 

You wouldn't call, say, Antonelli reeds in hybrid concertina "traditional", would you?

People who pick up concertina should know that Concertina is rare instrument. Aside from Irish Folk Music and SA it is not associated with any tradition, will not sound authentic, will always be a novelty. Playing French Mazurka on Anglo Concertina will cause you to be looked at, often critically, by those you want to play with. Isn't it common on this site to step on loud wet tuned Piano Accordions?

 

I have a French friend who plays trad French dance music on an English concertina. The music is good to dance to, shall I tell her to stop? I don't think so. Traditions have to absorb and incororate new ideas as time goes on, if they don't they become fossilised.

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Right on the spot, Alan! That's how a real traditional French mazurka sounds. I'll see if I can squeeze one out of my EC myself this weekend.

 

With all due respect, how is it possible that a "real traditional French mazurka" sounds real traditional french on english made 30 button Concertina? It may sound good, convincing, interesting, inspiring but been "real", "traditional", "French" is a bit too much.

 

Of course its not possible, an Italian accordion is requred. :ph34r:

 

You wouldn't call, say, Antonelli reeds in hybrid concertina "traditional", would you?

People who pick up concertina should know that Concertina is rare instrument. Aside from Irish Folk Music and SA it is not associated with any tradition, will not sound authentic, will always be a novelty. Playing French Mazurka on Anglo Concertina will cause you to be looked at, often critically, by those you want to play with. Isn't it common on this site to step on loud wet tuned Piano Accordions?

 

And the psychoacoustic model that forms the basis of the lossy compression for your digitally recorded music is such an anachronism! You can never hope to reproduce the grand traditional sound of a real live traditional French mazurka with your silly mp3 files.

 

Some criteria are more important than others. Anyone who wants to know what aspects of the sound are quintessential to the "real traditional French mazurka" is advised to seek out a real traditional Frenchman.

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I used to play double bass, mainly Flemish and French traditional dance music. In all the history there was never one single double bass in sight. Yet people loved to dance on the music we played. My band had a French bagpipe, a hurdy-gurdy AND a piano accordeon. And now I play French mazurkas on my English concertina, disregarding what people might say :-) It's not what you play, but how you play it. And knowing the traditional way of playing this music because I played it myself for years on end, I feel that Alan does a fantastic job and it sounds exactly as it should on his Anglo.

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Dear all, I am lusted (does this term exists in English?)by all your response.meanwhile I have been luck enough to get in contact with a French musician. he plays French mazurkas on a Duet Maccann with success. I do intend to learn concertina because we have tons of accordion player here, and many of them are outstanding. in the case I can learn decently my concertina I will have a chance to play with them like all the hunky donk players have being rare. I have difficulties in getting one in the price target that makes minimizing the risk of the purchase in case i cabt dig my hole with it. I know will make your skin trembling but I am more and more oriente to get a Elise duet to take the plunge. This is low risk investment for my wallet now. Please hear this link and tellme when it seems a strange sound for mazurka.I dont think.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC120A9Gayo

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I have a French friend who plays trad French dance music on an English concertina. The music is good to dance to, shall I tell her to stop? I don't think so. Traditions have to absorb and incororate new ideas as time goes on, if they don't they become fossilised.

 

All valid points, but off the topic.

I play Russian folk music on English Concertina. Shall I tell myself to stop? Will I claim it's traditional sound? No matter how I absorb and incorporate new ideas it will not change living tradition in my lifetime. But I can play against it and be talked about. Cheap trick, I like it. The trick nonetheless.

 

 

As for the Youtube clip:

The guy is playing Jackie, English system, Melody only. CD is on, with dry tuned accordion on it. The sound is complex and sophisticated and it's NOT the sound of neither Jackie, nor Elise.

It's the sound of Accordion with Jackie sitting on top of it.

I think Elise will be a good start. Why should our skin tremble?

Edited by m3838
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Thanks Michelv for your comments.

There are a number of Concertina players who submit MP3 recordings on this site and the vast majority of us appreciate their time, efforts and generosity for letting us hear their music. There are some constructive criticisms put forward to try and

assist the player ,but in general we enjoy the music and it is one of the reasons this site has been successful.There is no charge for the recordings ,they are free to down load and keep if they are enjoyed.They are certainly not silly MP3 submissions, but are sent in to enhance the discussion topic. The subject of playing music other than your own countries has been aired before and is once again a topic that can be discussed elsewhere. My view is that a musician who spends some considerable time studying a style of play and music can reproduce it as well as another, who just happens to speak the language.Classical music would be in a bit of a state if only players were accepted by the country of the composer.

I hope that we all continue to send in our silly MP3s because I have heard some wonderful recordings on this site.

Al

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No matter how I absorb and incorporate new ideas it will not change living tradition in my lifetime.

 

Um... I hate to break it to you, but you are living tradition in your lifetime.

 

I hope that we all continue to send in our silly MP3s because I have heard some wonderful recordings on this site.

 

Amen! I don't know what I'd do without the internet. Can't imagine how you old-timers managed back in the day.

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Hello, bonjour à tous,

 

sorry to interrupt the discussion...

 

my name is Thomas and I live in France near Lyon.

 

Forgive me for my poor english (I registered on concertina.net to...progress...^^)

 

I play diatonic and accordion and now I am fortunate to play Colin and Rosalie Dipper's concertina. They made for me two wonderful instruments (baryton and treble) adpated for accordion player. But it is not "franglo" system. It is a kind of customized duet. I will send photos later.

 

To be not off the topic, here is a small recording of a traditional mazurka from Auvergne. I don't remember the name.

 

About the discussion, we have same in France...It is difficult for me to argue but I will try!...

 

More later

 

Thomas

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Hello, bonjour à tous,

 

sorry to interrupt the discussion...

 

my name is Thomas and I live in France near Lyon.

 

Forgive me for my poor english (I registered on concertina.net to...progress...^^)

 

I play diatonic and accordion and now I am fortunate to play Colin and Rosalie Dipper's concertina. They made for me two wonderful instruments (baryton and treble) adpated for accordion player. But it is not "franglo" system. It is a kind of customized duet. I will send photos later.

 

To be not off the topic, here is a small recording of a traditional mazurka from Auvergne. I don't remember the name.

 

About the discussion, we have same in France...It is difficult for me to argue but I will try!...

 

More later

 

Thomas

Very nice playing Thomas

Al :)

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Hello, bonjour à tous,

 

sorry to interrupt the discussion...

 

my name is Thomas and I live in France near Lyon.

 

Forgive me for my poor english (I registered on concertina.net to...progress...^^)

 

I play diatonic and accordion and now I am fortunate to play Colin and Rosalie Dipper's concertina. They made for me two wonderful instruments (baryton and treble) adpated for accordion player. But it is not "franglo" system. It is a kind of customized duet. I will send photos later.

 

To be not off the topic, here is a small recording of a traditional mazurka from Auvergne. I don't remember the name.

 

About the discussion, we have same in France...It is difficult for me to argue but I will try!...

 

Tona! What a Pleasure to listen at your file! Its exactly the music we dance here in our mazurkas klandestina set ups.....you can understand my passion then. I started learning dancing and we normally combine French mazurkas and waltzers and chappelloises,circassian circles etc. I then heard Eric Theze and said myself I should try to play something myself. Still I havent an instrument in my hands so not sure how much is difficult. soon will see. A duet concertina seems still to me the best option to avoid the bisonoric increased difficulty of push and pull. cheers

More later

 

Thomas

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Hello, bonjour à tous,

 

sorry to interrupt the discussion...

 

my name is Thomas and I live in France near Lyon.

 

Forgive me for my poor english (I registered on concertina.net to...progress...^^)

 

I play diatonic and accordion and now I am fortunate to play Colin and Rosalie Dipper's concertina. They made for me two wonderful instruments (baryton and treble) adpated for accordion player. But it is not "franglo" system. It is a kind of customized duet. I will send photos later.

 

To be not off the topic, here is a small recording of a traditional mazurka from Auvergne. I don't remember the name.

 

About the discussion, we have same in France...It is difficult for me to argue but I will try!...

 

More later

 

Thomas

Tona! What a Pleasure to listen at your file! Its exactly the music we dance here in our mazurkas klandestina set ups.....you can understand my passion then. I started learning dancing and we normally combine French mazurkas and waltzers and chappelloises,circassian circles etc. I then heard Eric Theze and said myself I should try to play something myself. Still I havent an instrument in my hands so not sure how much is difficult. soon will see. A duet concertina seems still to me the best option to avoid the bisonoric increased difficulty of push and pull. cheers

 

 

PS I apologize for having mixed up two messages in one. see above post. I tried to cancel my mistake it but could not succeed

Edited by Ubik
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I have just been talking to Colin Dipper about the Duet that Thomas is playing. It is a specially made instrument on a fingering system requested by Thomas. As it is definitely a Duet I have requested some more recordings for the Duet project.

Al

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To be not off the topic, here is a small recording of a traditional mazurka from Auvergne. I don't remember the name.

 

I have to say - your playing is exceptionally good, and a real pleasure to listen to.

 

Better than words in this discussion too!

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But it is not "franglo" system. It is a kind of customized duet. I will send photos later.

 

Thomas,

 

Fantastic playing!

 

BTW, I am really curious about the layout of your concertinas.

 

Thanks,

ocd

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