Staffordshire Hornpipe

[michael sam wild]

At our Red Deer session yesterday Steve-freereeder (conc netter) played this nice Hornpipe in D.

 

I went looking for it and it's on this YouTube clip along with King of the Fairies in Emin.

 

 

( I wish I had the capability to do what Jody Kruskal does when he puts up a tune, source etc all in one place on Tune of the Month)

 

We thought it came from a John Kirkpatrick record , possibly derived from John Locke a gypsy fiddler from Leominster, Herefordshire recorded in 1909 on wax cylinder by Cecil Sharpe.

 

 

 

The trusty Fiddler's Companion by Andrew Kuntz has the ABc and the following info.

 

STAFFORDSHIRE HORNPIPE, THE. English, Sword Dance Tune (2/2 time). D Major. Standard tuning. AB. Second figure of the sword dance from the Flamborough, England, area. One of the earliest recordings of the tune was in 1909 when Cecil Sharp waxed it on a cylinder from the playing of John Locke, described as a “gipsy fiddler.” Callaghan (Hardcore English), 2007; pg. 24. Karpeles & Schofield (A Selection of 100 English Folk Dance Airs), 1951; pg. 30. Kirkpatrick & Harris (Opus Pocus), 1988. Raven (English Country Dance Tunes), 1984; pg. 77.

 

X:1

 

T:Staffordshire Hornpipe, The

 

M:2/2

 

L:1/8

 

S:Flamborough

 

K:D

 

(3ABc|d2b2g2ed|ce a2f2d2|d2b2g2 ed|ce a2 Acec|d2b2g2ed|ce a2f2d2|

 

gbag fdec|d2f2d4||f2e2d2c2|Bc (3dcB A2 Bc|dcde fefg|

 

a2g2e2a2|f2e2d2c2|Bc (3dcB A2a2|b2 ag fd ec|d2f2d2||

 

 

Other tunes on the cylinder are listed here and can be played on midi.

http://www.btinternet.com/~radical/thefolkmag/jlocke.htm

Edited January 25, 2010 by michael sam wild

[PeterT]

 

We thought it came from a John Kirkpatrick record .....

 

 

John certainly recorded it. Off-hand, can't think which album (but I can hear it now, with John on melodeon - maybe "Three in a row").

 

I remember this newly-learnt tune being in my head at the ICA festival of 1991, and deciding, whilst practising (downstairs) before the competition, to use it in a tune set in one of the classes where I was competing. So, my first performance of it was in the competition!

[Steve_freereeder]

It's a great tune! I learnt it from the playing of John Kirkpatrick on the recording 'Sheepskins' MWCD 4002, although on that recording he plays it in F major on his C/G anglo. I usually play it in C on a C/G anglo.

 

X:1

T:The Staffordshire Hornpipe

C: Traditional

N:Transcribed from the playing of John Kirkpatrick and transposed into C

M:2/2

L:1/8

S:Flamborough

K:C

(3GAB|:c2a2f2dc|Bdgf e2c2|c2a2f2 dc|Bd g2 GBdB|

c2a2f2dc|Bdgf e2c2|fagf ecdB|c2c2c4:|

|:e2d2c2B2|AB (3cBA G2 AB|cBcd edef|g2f2d2g2|

e2d2c2B2|AB (3cBA G2g2|a2 gf ec dB|c2c2c2:|

W:

W:English, Sword Dance Tune (2/2 time)

W:Second figure of the sword dance from the Flamborough, England, area.

W:One of the earliest recordings of the tune was in 1909 when Cecil Sharp

W:waxed it on a cylinder from the playing of John Locke, described

W:as a 'gipsy fiddler'.

W:

W:Karpeles & Schofield (A Selection of 100 English

W:Folk Dance Airs), 1951; pg. 30.

W:Raven (English Country Dance Tunes), 1984; pg.

Edited January 25, 2010 by Steve_freereeder

[michael sam wild]

We thought it came from a John Kirkpatrick record .....

 

 

John certainly recorded it. Off-hand, can't think which album (but I can hear it now, with John on melodeon - maybe "Three in a row").

 

I remember this newly-learnt tune being in my head at the ICA festival of 1991, and deciding, whilst practising (downstairs) before the competition, to use it in a tune set in one of the classes where I was competing. So, my first performance of it was in the competition!

 

 

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

Steve

That wax cylinder transcription is in D so I suppose you have all your chord availability in C on a C/G

on my G/D it sounds nice and bright in D , tune mainly on RHS and I have kept the chords quite sparse.

 

 

I have noticed that a lot of the 'great' hornpipes are commonly set in D and wonder if that is a fiddler or fluter thing?

[Steve Mansfield]

I have noticed that a lot of the 'great' hornpipes are commonly set in D and wonder if that is a fiddler or fluter thing?

 

Wow there's a thing. Can't help you there at all, but would love to know the answer! As a flutist, however, I'd suspect that if the fiddlers had had anything to do with it, all the tunes would be in A

[spindizzy]

I have noticed that a lot of the 'great' hornpipes are commonly set in D and wonder if that is a fiddler or fluter thing?

 

Fiddlers really go for A if allowed (sometimes the melodeon players start screaming).

One idea, I've noticed that hornpipes often cover a good range ie more than an octave (which is nice) - if they were played in G a lot of folk would be playing in the dusty bits.

[Steve_freereeder]

I have noticed that a lot of the 'great' hornpipes are commonly set in D and wonder if that is a fiddler or fluter thing?

 

Wow there's a thing. Can't help you there at all, but would love to know the answer! As a flutist, however, I'd suspect that if the fiddlers had had anything to do with it, all the tunes would be in A

I think there is a lot of truth in this. I suspect what it all boils down to is that in the past, musicians have tended to play tunes in whatever key is best suited to their instruments, particularly if playing solo for dancing. The 'great hornpipes' - and I'm thinking, say, of Harvest Home or Boys of Blue Hill for examples - have come down to us as fiddle tunes and so will tend to be in fiddle-friendly keys of D or A.

 

On the other hand, 18th and 19th century village bands would have included instruments such as cornets, clarinets, serpents, as well as fiddles and flutes, so perhaps a lot of the music became settled in keys of F, C and G. This is apparent from looking at old manuscript collections compiled by village musicians; the Joshua Gibbons collection (Lincolnshire) comes to mind as an example.

 

I was discussing this with Brian Peters very recently and he is definitely of the opinion that for concertina players, it is perfectly valid to play a tune in whatever key suits the instrument best, especially if you are a solo performer. As concertinas are still comparatively rare instruments, compared with fiddles, it is hardly surprising that the so-called 'proper' keys for tunes which we now are largely 'forced to accept' has been largely influenced by fiddles. Look at how the D/G melodeon did not exist until the 1950s and melodeon players started to want to play with fiddlers who didn't want to play in F or C or G.

 

Going back to Staffordshire Hornpipe, on a C/G anglo it is very comfortable to play in C. However, John K plays it in F, I suspect (i) because he can (especially on his 40-key Crabb), and (ii) it actually sounds really good in F - brighter than in C. Both keys offer a lot of options for chordal accompaniment on the LH, but when playing in F there is much more scope for keeping the melody on the RH.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Steve_freereeder

[michael sam wild]

I have noticed that a lot of the 'great' hornpipes are commonly set in D and wonder if that is a fiddler or fluter thing?

 

Fiddlers really go for A if allowed (sometimes the melodeon players start screaming).

One idea, I've noticed that hornpipes often cover a good range ie more than an octave (which is nice) - if they were played in G a lot of folk would be playing in the dusty bits.

 

 

Just tried a few and I agree!

[PeterT]

 

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

 

I've just checked the results! 1991 was the last competitive ICA Festival, as far as I am aware. Turned out to be quite a good one, for me.

 

I played Staffordshire Hornpipe in the "Playing by Ear" class, which I won.

In the "Advanced Anglo", I just edged out Harry Scurfield by one mark.

In the "Folk Dance Playing", I finished equal second (with Iris Bishop), one mark behind Harry Scurfield. Harry also picked up "Best Solo Performance" with this result.

[Chris Drinkwater]

 

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

 

I've just checked the results! 1991 was the last competitive ICA Festival, as far as I am aware. Turned out to be quite a good one, for me.

 

I played Staffordshire Hornpipe in the "Playing by Ear" class, which I won.

In the "Advanced Anglo", I just edged out Harry Scurfield by one mark.

In the "Folk Dance Playing", I finished equal second (with Iris Bishop), one mark behind Harry Scurfield. Harry also picked up "Best Solo Performance" with this result.

 

 

Well done, Peter. And what were your marks, if I might be so bold as to ask? Or are you too shy or embarassed to reveal them? I hope they were in the nineties.

 

Chris

[Jim Besser]

Going back to Staffordshire Hornpipe, on a C/G anglo it is very comfortable to play in C. However, John K plays it in F, I suspect (i) because he can (especially on his 40-key Crabb), and (ii) it actually sounds really good in F - brighter than in C. Both keys offer a lot of options for chordal accompaniment on the LH, but when playing in F there is much more scope for keeping the melody on the RH.

 

I just discovered by the John K version of this tune and was quickly taken by it. Always resistant to playing in F on my 30 button C/G, I transposed to G. But to my ear, it sounds far better in F, so I'm trying to deal with that quick F/D/Bf run of notes w/o John K's extra 10 buttons. A splendid tune

[michael sam wild]

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

 

I've just checked the results! 1991 was the last competitive ICA Festival, as far as I am aware. Turned out to be quite a good one, for me.

 

I played Staffordshire Hornpipe in the "Playing by Ear" class, which I won.

In the "Advanced Anglo", I just edged out Harry Scurfield by one mark.

In the "Folk Dance Playing", I finished equal second (with Iris Bishop), one mark behind Harry Scurfield. Harry also picked up "Best Solo Performance" with this result.

 

Thanks Peter and well done ( I hope you passed your Standard of Attainment Test (SAT), I have been thinking of opening a thread on competition and standards in General Discussion. This has prompted me to do so.

 

 

Steve, I have had the use of a few Anglos in different keys recently and it is very interesting to see how various tunes come out. I tried some out with a piper/maker friend Brian Howard, with a flat set for example. A bit like Peter Laban did with Kitty Hayes ( where is Peter at the moment?) I enjoyed it.

Edited January 27, 2010 by michael sam wild

[PeterT]

 

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

 

I've just checked the results! 1991 was the last competitive ICA Festival, as far as I am aware. Turned out to be quite a good one, for me.

 

I played Staffordshire Hornpipe in the "Playing by Ear" class, which I won.

In the "Advanced Anglo", I just edged out Harry Scurfield by one mark.

In the "Folk Dance Playing", I finished equal second (with Iris Bishop), one mark behind Harry Scurfield. Harry also picked up "Best Solo Performance" with this result.

 

 

Well done, Peter. And what were your marks, if I might be so bold as to ask? Or are you too shy or embarassed to reveal them? I hope they were in the nineties.

 

Chris

 

 

Hi Chris,

 

87, 85, 88 respectively. So; not the heady heights of the 90's, on this occasion.

 

Regards,

Peter.

[PeterT]

I have had the use of a few Anglos in different keys recently and it is very interesting to see how various tunes come out. I tried some out with a piper/maker friend Brian Howard, with a flat set for example. A bit like Peter Laban did with Kitty Hayes ( where is Peter at the moment?) I enjoyed it.

 

Michael,

 

I guess that Peter is still around, just no longer a member on this forum.

 

Regards,

Peter.

[Chris Drinkwater]

 

Peter,how did you do in the competition?

 

 

I've just checked the results! 1991 was the last competitive ICA Festival, as far as I am aware. Turned out to be quite a good one, for me.

 

I played Staffordshire Hornpipe in the "Playing by Ear" class, which I won.

In the "Advanced Anglo", I just edged out Harry Scurfield by one mark.

In the "Folk Dance Playing", I finished equal second (with Iris Bishop), one mark behind Harry Scurfield. Harry also picked up "Best Solo Performance" with this result.

 

 

Well done, Peter. And what were your marks, if I might be so bold as to ask? Or are you too shy or embarassed to reveal them? I hope they were in the nineties.

 

Chris

 

 

Hi Chris,

 

87, 85, 88 respectively. So; not the heady heights of the 90's, on this occasion.

 

Regards,

Peter.

 

 

 

Blimey, Peter, those marks are still extremely good. Belated congratulations. In that case, why were't you a contender for inclusion on Anglo International? And don't tell me it's because you hadn't played for 10 years, were out of practice, and not up to the high standard required by Al and Graham? Especially as you beat Harry Scurfield by one mark and he is featured on AI.

 

Chris