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vos

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  1. Thanks for the input @Moll Peatly. I really only understand chant from a mostly intuitive level from having done much of it in practice and from doing a little formal study on it, starting from a standpoint of someone who knew nothing about music. It really was frustrating when I sought to learn how to chant people started using words (tone, pitch, key, register, octave, melody, harmony, C, etc) I had little real understanding of. People like teaching chant using standard musical terminology which I suppose makes sense on some level, on another level they might not realize they are talking to me like they think I played piano 😕 Really leaning toward the duet right now. Im thinking if this works out it will be my one instrumental focus for a very long time, perhaps my only one. Im not looking to get into all music, im looking to have a recreational instrument I can practice with daily which is mobile, unplugged, can accompany singing, and can play the kinds of folk and chant I like. It seems like an ideal instrument besides being expensive and a bit hard to learn. But Ive got the time so it might be worth a shot.
  2. @seanc Thanks, I will probably be practicing by my home pc a good amount of the time that will come in handy, im sure there is some software crossover I can work. Worst case scenario ill borrow my friends iphone lol. Oh I bet I can run it in wine too. @wunks Thats neat, I spent some time discerning at some monasteries as well, I'm a latin catholic though our chant is a bit different but similar principle. I sure would love to come visit some time. I go on adventures on occasion and If I find myself out that way I will definitely reach out, if you or anyone reading this are by the cleveland area do send me a message if you are not a serial killer
  3. @seanc I really appreciate your insights and advice. In the case of Chant I would not want to make it sound more exciting, there are designated modes of parts of the office which relate to the meaning of the words. Meaning is transmitted through the way the music sounds, so the miserere mei deus (have mercy upon me o lord) is played in a different mode than the magnificat anima mea domino (my soul doth magnify(exult, praise) the lord), I would be staying within a tight boundary anyway in that regard. It sounds like I should start on a duet, Im getting that a lot from various places im poking around in. The versatility will be well worth it in this regard I believe. @alex_holden thanks for the input. Im looking around at some lachenal mcann duet 46 keys presently, which wont cover everything in the world but perhaps will cover much ground. I also hope it is something I can stick with for a while and just learn it without jumping around too much, sounds like it would be of decent quality from what I am reading. @Ken_Coles haha that is fantastic, I sent you a pm
  4. @seanc Yes everything you said about chant sounds exactly correct. Here is an example of organ accompaniment I am referring to (which you described well). In fact it may have been more helpful if I had just posted this in the first place. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yD4T-H6aoE In regards to vocal range, Indeed we can start 'wherever' basically. C can be where we want it to be. I was under the impression that if I am say a natural baritone or tenor I would be able to sing greater than one octave in range anyway. If that is the case would I not be able to sing in f#, or c# or B in any case? But this question is not essential, I could simply talk to the local schola master and find out what key I sing in as you said, im just trying to understand it. Do you mean the note I generally like to start on given my personal preferences? I will check out the elise duet, Ive seen it around but ill keep that on my list of serious consideration.
  5. wow, fantastic replies so far which are really getting my wheels spinning. Ive read them all a few times over. Im going to make some specific replies here, but firstly I wanted to make an overview of what I'm seeing. Between here and the facebook group where I posted my same original post (concertinas are cool, 3k members) the information here has been more technical and I really appreciate that. Im seeing that I might not have understood my questions as well as I thought I did. I was under the impression that because gregorian chant is for one voice only it was not chromatic but rather diatonic. Are you people talking about chromatic because I want versatility to play folk and chant ? for some context, this is the kind of chant I'm referring to not that I think people don't know what Im talking about but because I need to make sure im not confusing people with a bad explanation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTBNt1ortDA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilBEZNKjPtM and here is a copy of the flos carmeli for example in standard notation, which may explain the ranges im dealing with better than I can https://cdn.imslp.org/images/thumb/pdfs/dd/41cd9ede99387714a7bfda736916acb431bfba33.png @Bill N I think I understand what you are saying about using a variety of concertinas with similar fingering. I think it would be safe to say that extremely complicated setups would be out of my reach and make for a frustrating start. Your post and others are making me think that perhaps I should learn one style before learning the other, perhaps on different concertinas, rather than trying to have one which can do it all. Originally I was under the impression that chant would be so simple that anything could handle it. @Ken_Coles I live in Ohio Northern. Yes, my ability to read the neumes is even limited. They are helpful. I understand the accents, pauses, certain emphasis and flow from them. I can get a good idea of what the proper pitches are (especially if I stop, and follow do re mi fa etc to find the note I need), but Im not fluent enough to hear the music straight off the paper. I learned most of it through just singing along. Either way its very helpful to read while I sing and Im able sing well with talented cantors if they are leading strongly. I appreciate the advice to try something hands on. In my head anglo sounds more complicated, but I wouldnt be suprised if I liked it. hmm. Hopefully I can get moving before the 12 year mark. What was your first purchase? @Jim2010 haha nice. I do sing from the neumes, but I was considering playing it either by ear once I got comfortable enough, or transcribing to standard notation (a lot of them are already transcribed) and just learning it. eh. well see. @seanc Im ignorant in regards to accompanyment. Your post is making me think chords are best to accompany singing, right? I think that makes sense. Would I would be playing the melody or harmony more often with accompaniment? I think harmony right? Thats in regards to folk. If I understand in chant I would be playing and singing the melody since there is only one voice? after reading your post I had to google the difference between key and scale. A particular key is a standardized type of scale yes? The duet does sound attractive because of the versatility, Perhaps if I am going to be learning it all from the ground up (first instrument) I might as well start there? ------- Thus far my brainstorming is making me think that I should have 2 separate concertinas. One like a standard 30 button c/g, and another perhaps baritone in c/g (if I figured that right). As crazy as it sounds, I have the time and perhaps the patience, and I would probably be happy with moderate sound quality; perhaps I make a 30 button c/g in my shop in a standard fashion to get a handle on what I am doing, then make another concertina that is custom made with only the keys for gregorian chant on it, perhaps in baritone. That way I am working with something more standard to something less standard. Could be a fun and unique project. I know a lot of people who chant who would like to have a mini accompaniment organ with them. of course maybe my manufacturing skills would be trash and id end up with a piece of junk. Brass reeds sound like the way to go for going with vocals from what Im reading. Opinions and guidance much appreciated going forward
  6. Hello everyone I have never held or seen a concertina in person. I cannot read standard musical notation, I find it difficult to memorize to some extent, and I cannot really play any instruments. I have some experience singing and reading Gregorian chant notation. I listen to and sing a lot of folk music by my self or rarely with friends casually, especially Irish, some scottish, old timey, cowpoke style country/western. The Irish I gravitate towards is more of the slower paced narrative driven kinds, sea shanties, war songs, etc... The fast paced dancing jigs/reels are nice but I dont spend much time with them. My vocal range is probably in the baritone/tenor area, not especially talented in alto, and can sometimes hit bass notes decently. I think I am looking for a 30 button anglo in c/g, like the rochelle 2 like most beginners. But I am not sure. I would love something that I could accompany my singing with in both Gregorian chant and folk songs. If it could also have some versatility in accompanying other people if we sit down to play common things together. I probably will never try to play complicated classical music. I have some skill and experience in woodworking, sewing, leatherworking, general craft, though not expert. I have a large shop with space to work in and some basic tools (of which I can get more if need be) I am building up a career in woodworking and am looking into profitable niches. Presently im developing rustic christian devotional objects Some folk songs Im interested in Dubliners: will you come to the bower, patriot game, one morning in march, leaving of liverpool, greenland fisheries, fiddlers green, foggy dew Archie fisher/ fisher family: Jock stewart, western island, school days over, donal ogue, I am a freeborn man Marty Robbins (western): Strawberry Roan, Utah carol, they're hanging me tonight Gregorian chant: flos carmeli, adoro to devote, salve regina, ave maris stella, crux fidelis, dies irae, the modes of the divine office My state in life is low stress and I have time, willpower and if need be some decent funding. I could see spending up to $1000 if it is a safe investment, but I don't want to do that unnecessarily. I'm not a stickler for sound quality. I want a nice, memorable sound, but technical perfection is not my goal. I like listening to rough recordings of semi-skilled folk musicians. For me it is about a connection with the people and the history who lived the music more so than an attempt to be a virtuoso. For me, too polished a sound is not always a good thing in folk music. I think this instrument is for me because it can accompany and play the music I listen to the most, it is small and not dependent on electric (I will be traveling), I can sing while I play, it (I presume, correct me if I am wrong) can somewhat emulate simple organ music such as would accompany basic gregorian chant. If you did not know, typical church organ music is often far more complex than chant accompaniment which is not polyphonic. So what I am really wondering is 1. Is the 30 key anglo what I am looking for? 2. would something like a baritone concertina be better for accompanying singing and emulating organ music which accompanies chant? 3. would an english be superior to an anglo for the simplistic nature of chant? 4. Ive considered simply making a concertina myself using accordian reeds, I feel competent in the whole process though I would need assistance with the lever/reed/button layout positioning and perhaps some oversight to say "oh boy don't do that". If the insturment is decent and durable it would be worth it to me I think. Do you think an amateur could make something enjoyable to use? what quality level, price equivalent do you think it might be once complete? would it be a piece of junk with sentimental value or a real instrument? Perhaps if I take to the making process and it goes well I could make more for variety and even later for sale. My state in life is low income, low spending. I live for stability and time for prayer and an ordered life, I do not need to make lots of fast money. I appreciate you taking time to read this and look forward to any advice. I was planning to record some singing but none of my stuff wants to work right now so I may update that later in the thread. I attached the gregorian notation for something I might sing. Of course I would probably spend an equal or greater amount of time singing folk, but I figure yall are plenty familiar with that stuff already. Pax Christi!
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