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Concertinists – Next Generation.


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#19 Rod

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Posted 29 November 2008 - 02:10 PM

I trust that readers of this thread will not get the impression that those starting beyond the age of thirty have missed the bus. Perish the thought !

#20 Pete Dunk

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Posted 29 November 2008 - 02:49 PM

I reckon anyone starting a new instrument beyond the age of thirty will be hard pressed to become an exceptional player however well they may play something else. Doesn't mean that they won't be good enough to earn a living at it though. I think Peter started this thread out of interest about younger people who will inspire future generations to take up concertina and carry the flag. Excluding oldies like me (and him!) as players or professionals wasn't at all on the agenda as I see it.

#21 PeterT

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Posted 29 November 2008 - 02:59 PM

I think Peter started this thread out of interest about younger people who will inspire future generations to take up concertina and carry the flag. Excluding oldies like me (and him!) as players or professionals wasn't at all on the agenda as I see it.

Correct, Pete! I didn't start until the ripe old age of 26, and I don't think it has hindered me, unduly, but we are all different, and logic suggests that younger people would find it easier to learn an instrument to a "professional" standard. And I don't want to debate what standard this is versus other instruments or forms of music.

In this thread, I don't really want to go down the route of "cost and availablity of concertinas", which we've done to death in the past.

What had occurred to me is that most of the players already mentioned in this thread were working as either semi-pro or pro musicians by their early 20's. I don't see that happening now, apart from in Ireland, and I would expect to hear of several other players of ITM.

Peter.

#22 PeterT

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Posted 29 November 2008 - 03:08 PM

I'm learning a lot in this thread! I've re-visited a video of Spiers & Boden, and Jon plays a very nice four-row Jeffries Anglo in what I presume to be C/G. I was happily playing along to the tune, in C, and our fingers seemed to be following the same pattern on the left hand!

Thanks!
Peter.


Eeek! I'm sending you off in the wrong direction Peter! If you're watching a video with an anglo in it that will be John Spiers (Cheshire Waltz perhaps?) - I'd not even thought to mention him! He's another 'almost in the criteria' concertinist. Must do more joined up thinking! :rolleyes:

Pete. :D


OK; so maybe I haven't learned as much as I thought! :blink:

Now honestly; most duos have their surnames in alphabetical order, or "senior" and "junior" partner (maybe Boden & Spiers doesn't sound as good), and, when reversed, you'd think that the change is made to reflect surnames and position on stage, from the audience view. Or is it just me? :unsure:

#23 LDT

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 10:01 AM

otherwise there will be a lot of cheap instruments available in about in 25 years time!


*rubs hands together expectantly*
:P :lol:

#24 PeterT

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 10:17 AM

otherwise there will be a lot of cheap instruments available in about in 25 years time!


*rubs hands together expectantly*
:P :lol:

You naughty person! :rolleyes:

#25 Steve Mansfield

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 05:59 AM

I trust that readers of this thread will not get the impression that those starting beyond the age of thirty have missed the bus. Perish the thought !


I started EC aged 42, and am running behind the bus as fast as I can: some days the bus gets closer, and some days the bus gets further away, but at least it's still in sight ...

#26 DavidFR

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 09:26 AM

The recent threads by LDT and Ptarmigan set me thinking. The demographics of this forum are as I expected, with many players being 50 (ish). Where are the young players? Are they out performing, or simply not there?

So; in this thread, here is the information for which I am looking:

Professional players aged up to 30. They can be playing concerts, clubs, festivals, or teaching at residential events. Performing either solo, or in groups, using concertina. I’ll accept multi-instrumentalists, too. The key thing is that they are current performers, under the loosest terming of “professional”.

I believe that, as a community, C.net should be promoting our young professional players, as this generation will be in the forefront of continued success for the concertina

Peter,

I think you raise an interesting question about demographics. I do think you're putting too much emphasis on the idea of young "professional" players, however. I think continued success for the concertina is more contingent on casual and hobby players. The growth of concertina players as a whole will create more of an environment which can support the professional ambitions of those that have them.

I do think the lack of young players is sad, and something we should all be thinking about. It would be great to have more support for younger players from some source. When I went to the Northeast Concertina workshop a couple years ago, I was at 24 the youngest player by far (based on unscientific observation). I've been playing for about nine years now, and have met only a bare handful of other players in my age group.

#27 Mark Evans

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 11:37 AM

I do think the lack of young players is sad, and something we should all be thinking about.


Let's not. What are we to do with all this thinking? A certain number of folks will pick up the instrument and use it. Make a career of it? What kind of "career" would that be? It's a lovely instrument, but a bit off the beaten path, and let's face it, funky.

Seems to me there are a lot more box players than when I started playing in 1964 living in North Florida. When I took it seriously in 1976 there were damn few then. Maybe it's just C.Net gives the wingnuts and oddballs all over the globe a virtual place to hang out and that gives the false impression that the woods and hollers are a good bit fuller than they used to be.

There will always be young who cut against the grain, pick up a concertina and against better judgement spend the rest of their days on the planet delighting and pissin' off the unsuspecting.

Edited by Mark Evans, 01 December 2008 - 12:58 PM.


#28 LDT

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 11:40 AM

It's a lovely instrument, but a bit off the beaten path, and let's face it funky.


Now that should be on a T-shirt.

There will always be young who cut against the grain, pick up a concertina and against better judgement spend the rest of their days on the planet delighting and pissin' off the unsuspecting.

You made me spit out my drink when I read that. :lol:

#29 Rod

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 12:24 PM

It's a lovely instrument, but a bit off the beaten path, and let's face it funky.


Now that should be on a T-shirt.

There will always be young who cut against the grain, pick up a concertina and against better judgement spend the rest of their days on the planet delighting and pissin' off the unsuspecting.

You made me spit out my drink when I read that. :lol:


Fashions will forever fluctuate. The majority of today's youngsters are probably no more attracted to the Concertina than old fogeys like me are attracted to their wretched electric guitars. All that matters is that we are all having fun in our own chosen ways.

#30 Samantha

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 12:42 PM

I'd like to put in a plug for our very own Liam Robinson whose fab anglo playing can be found on youtube under the moniker Porkpiemariner.
Samantha

#31 PeterT

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 12:50 PM

I'd like to put in a plug for our very own Liam Robinson whose fab anglo playing can be found on youtube under the moniker Porkpiemariner.
Samantha

Yes; I did check him out, and he recently turned 32. I'll have to come up with an "almost young professional" category.

Thanks, Samantha.

Regards,
Peter.

#32 Michael Marino

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:32 PM

Will have to get a picture of my son (not yet five) playing the 20 button lachenal we own. I would love him to play professionally and consider the art of a musican a hard but rewarding one. As far as off the beaten track, well that is life really happens is swimming against the common sophism and finding what makes you tick and not what some idiot marketing fool wants you to think.

Michael

Going with the flow and just settling down are highly over rated.

#33 LangoLee

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:38 PM

Emily Portman - better known as a singer with The Devil's Interval and in duo with Lauren McCormick - plays the English concertina, and I would guess that she was under 30.

You've cited a few prodigy types who received attention in their teenage years in the late 80s/early 90s, but I think those are generally the exception. Many folk performers only emerge into public view in their early 30s or later. I'm sure there are plenty of unknown concertina players who will appear on the folk club circuit within the next couple of decades, maybe inspired by the popular boom of groups like Bellowhead (who occasionally give centre stage to John Spiers's anglo).

However, the likelihood of anyone playing a concertina professionally in a non-folk setting (e.g. some classical/New Music pioneer) is inevitably low, since it would be seen as an expensive curio with fewer technical capabilities than a piano accordion. Unfortunately this seems to be a historically irreversible judgement.

Edited by LangoLee, 01 December 2008 - 01:40 PM.


#34 PeterT

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 02:14 PM

Emily Portman - better known as a singer with The Devil's Interval and in duo with Lauren McCormick - plays the English concertina, and I would guess that she was under 30.

You've cited a few prodigy types who received attention in their teenage years in the late 80s/early 90s, but I think those are generally the exception. Many folk performers only emerge into public view in their early 30s or later. I'm sure there are plenty of unknown concertina players who will appear on the folk club circuit within the next couple of decades, maybe inspired by the popular boom of groups like Bellowhead (who occasionally give centre stage to John Spiers's anglo).

However, the likelihood of anyone playing a concertina professionally in a non-folk setting (e.g. some classical/New Music pioneer) is inevitably low, since it would be seen as an expensive curio with fewer technical capabilities than a piano accordion. Unfortunately this seems to be a historically irreversible judgement.

Cheers, LangoLee.

Link to Emily's MySpace page here:

http://profile.myspa...endID=121645002

Emily plays English concertina.

There was a bumper crop of talented young singers and musicians who hit the folk scene in the late 1980's. Maybe a disproportionate number played concertina, and skewed the statistics.

Classical-type repertoires were popular 100+ years ago, but maybe that was a passing musical phase. I don't see why the concertina should not break into other forms of music; it just needs the right person to find him/herself in the right circumstances.

Regards,
Peter.

#35 Mark Evans

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 03:33 PM

However, the likelihood of anyone playing a concertina professionally in a non-folk setting (e.g. some classical/New Music pioneer) is inevitably low, since it would be seen as an expensive curio with fewer technical capabilities than a piano accordion. Unfortunately this seems to be a historically irreversible judgement.


Yup...I would agree. You know the likelyhood of anyone making a real living in a folk setting is about a as unlikely. A few are said to. Is it even a very comfortable living? I dunno. A joke from the world of bluegrass:

How do you make million dollars paying bluegrass music?

Start with two million....

I'm one to talk. I Kinda make a living, if I lived in Northeast Kingdom of Vermont in a trailer with no plumbing and an outhouse in the back yard.

My wife, a fine singer would make a very comfortable living if she didn't have kids, a bulldog, a house and oh yes, a lay about college administrator of a husband. By the time she pays her airfare, hotel, food and let's not forget the 20% agents fee which comes right off the top before taxes are taken into consideration, there's enough to go around with my slim wages for us to bump along like an overweight bumble bee.

Why oh why would any young turk monster musician choose that career if they wanted more out of life than living out of a suitcase and sleeping in airport terminals. Then of all things play a concertina?

I tell you true, last Tuesday night while having a fine session at Stones, a couple of young swains walk by and get sight of me playing the concertina and one starts a pantomime playing a box and the other playing like he's the monkey. God's honest truth. Thanks be to my middle age and two good pints of Speckled Hen, all I did was laugh (and they didn't mean it in a friendly way).

Well, I've rained enough gloom on this nice little thread...sorry.

Edited by Mark Evans, 01 December 2008 - 05:59 PM.


#36 Leo

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 07:47 PM

......................
How do you make million dollars paying bluegrass music?

Start with two million....
.............

Why oh why would any young turk monster musician choose that career if they wanted more out of life than living out of a suitcase and sleeping in airport terminals. Then of all things play a concertina?


Well, I've rained enough gloom on this nice little thread...sorry.

Hi Mark

Reminds me of the story of the guy that joined the circus. The only job available was cleaning out the animal stalls. Over the years the stains and stench he became used to, but he couldn't get rid of it. The other people avoided him like the plague. Finally someone asked him why he stayed to which his reply was "And do what? Give up show business!" :rolleyes:

Kids can be intimidating: http://www.youtube.c...698q2hn8&fmt=22
It's at 2:40 B)

Thanks :D
Leo




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