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#37 Henk van Aalten

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Posted 30 December 2005 - 04:18 AM

Both John Nixon and Chris Timson (with Anne Gregson) have CD's for sale with excellent playing on vintage concertinas, yet each is represented in the Tune Links only by brief excerpts on midi instruments. Brian Peters isn't represented there at all, but he has a wonderful CD for sale....

....Finally, I would mention that there have occasionally been links posted in various threads to sound files which have not found their way (perhaps with good reason) to the Tune Links page. One example is Morgana's recordings from the ACE. Another is the recordings by Wim Wakker at the Concertina Connection. And yet another is Pauline de Snoo's periodic announcements of what's on her own web site.

Jim in general you are touching a point that I started to think about after the page was there for a few months. I started the page rather spontaneously and (as it was still rather empty) included every sound file I could find, except for the sound files on the C.Net music page. Although there were a lot of initial reactions on the set-up of the page, there were no ideas posted from the C.Net community for criteria about what to include and what not to include. Looking back, I realise now that I "more or less" used the following criteria for inserting a sound file on the Links Page:
  • My toes should not get bent when listening to the sound file (never happened up till now)
  • When it is a sound-track with more instruments, the concertina should be clearly present
  • The player should be a C.Netter, unless...
  • When it is a sound-track from an existing CD, it should be at the C.Net music page
  • The sound file should not serve commercial purposes
Looking at these criteria, I feel very much like leaving the last two or three out..
Anyone would like to give feed back? Someone feels like setting up a poll on this subject?

Finally the ACE recordings of Morgana are labelled on her site as "Temporary Files". On top of that there are contributions on the ACE recording, where no concertina at all can be heard. The permanent files on Morgana's website are on the Links Page except for the Arran Air by Samantha, because I know she can play this beautiful air so much better and she promised :unsure: to make a new recording of it.

#38 Morgana

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Posted 30 December 2005 - 08:27 PM

The files in the temporary section were placed there so everyone from last year's ACE could download a copy if they wanted to. Which is why I included all the recordings I had, not just the concertina playing. [it was such a fun night - thanks again Samantha for organising it :D]

#39 Samantha

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Posted 31 December 2005 - 03:54 AM

... the Arran Air by Samantha, because I know she can play this beautiful air so much better and she promised :unsure: to make a new recording of it.


I did?? :huh: ? Did I say when :ph34r: ?!?
Samantha

#40 Boney

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 04:52 PM

I like having a page of non-commercial recordings of C.Net members. If you want to expand to other concertina recordings, I'd like it better if they were on a different page.

#41 m3838

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Posted 01 January 2006 - 07:32 PM

When I get my Lachenal from Barleycorn.
I thought of faking it with my Hohner 1 row accordion, but decided against it.
I will push hard to make it, although I don't like the tracks chosen for the "band".
It's Irish-centric and not to my taste.
Also, it would be nice to have some guidelines about possible arrangements.
I also don't buy dial-up slowness as an obstacle to sending a tune.
Record it with your tape recorder ($18) and send a tape by mail ($10). Still lightyears ahead of 19 century.
Paraphrasing the saying: "Remember, each day is the last day of your entire past life".
Let's make it happen.

#42 brightfield

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Posted 06 January 2006 - 04:05 AM

[*]My toes should not get bent when listening to the sound file (never happened up till now)
[*]When it is a sound-track with more instruments, the concertina should be clearly present
[*]The player should be a C.Netter, unless...
[*]When it is a sound-track from an existing CD, it should be at the C.Net music page
[*]The sound file should not serve commercial purposes
[/list]Looking at these criteria, I feel very much like leaving the last two or three out..
Anyone would like to give feed back? Someone feels like setting up a poll on this subject?


I am incredibly grateful to Henk for managing the recorded tune page for us - I run a couple of weblog circles and know how hard it can be to fit in the time to add new members, check links are working, deal with correspondence etc. I think Henk's work on the recorded tune page must be very demanding.

For myself, I see the recorded tune page as supplementing this forum. It provided examples of the playing of members of the forum, often leading to postive criticism of the playing, leading to learning and improvement. With the few tunes I have on the page, I certainly value comments on how I may improve, and my only difficulty is that when I listen to the files a few weeks after they're posted, I think, "how did I have the gall to submit such dreadful recordings for public consumption?". But so be it, they are a snapshot of a moment in time and people can take them or leave them.

I therefore don't think the soundtracks from existing CDs should be posted, nor commerical offerings etc. And I think the player should be a C-Netter. The value of this sort of page is that its primarily for enthusiastic amateurs or semi-professionals (?) so share their playing, to learn from each other, to be inspired by people who play better than oneself etc. I value it greatly as a learning resource and once again commend Henk for his hard work in maintaining it for us.

Tom

Edited by brightfield, 06 January 2006 - 04:07 AM.


#43 Stephen Mills

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Posted 06 January 2006 - 09:26 AM

[*]My toes should not get bent when listening to the sound file (never happened up till now)
[*]When it is a sound-track with more instruments, the concertina should be clearly present
[*]The player should be a C.Netter, unless...
[*]When it is a sound-track from an existing CD, it should be at the C.Net music page
[*]The sound file should not serve commercial purposes
[/list]Looking at these criteria, I feel very much like leaving the last two or three out..
Anyone would like to give feed back? Someone feels like setting up a poll on this subject?

I therefore don't think the soundtracks from existing CDs should be posted, nor commerical offerings etc. And I think the player should be a C-Netter. The value of this sort of page is that its primarily for enthusiastic amateurs or semi-professionals (?) so share their playing, to learn from each other, to be inspired by people who play better than oneself etc.

Tom

I agree in principle with what you say, Tom, but the overarching concern should be whether the recordings are in some way useful to c.net members. When others noted a lack of many duet examples or Maccann players, I suggested to Henk that he link to John Morgan's web-posted Maccann piece "goronwy owain - ffarwel i'r marian". Not a cnet member, to my knowledge; from an existing cd not on the c.net music page, last I looked - I still think it's an appropriate inclusion.

Great job, Henk. I've complimented you privately a couple of times, but public praise doesn't hurt, either. The fact I've learned a few of these pieces after hearing them posted speaks to the success of your project, I think.

#44 Alan Day

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 06:13 PM

I am sorry but my computer will not allow me to put up a quote and then reply to it,but I would like to comment on this recent thread regarding the Tune Link Page excellently run by Henk.

The original idea was to promote MP3 sound clips of music supplied by members for other members to listen to.A music swap of playing styles, our favourite tunes,new tunes we may have written etc. It was certainly not an additional platform for sound clips of CDs or promotional work for say a forthcoming tour.The use of professionally made recordings on this site would put off new and old members who have no access to specialist recording facilities.I for one record on a little web cam mike and I know the recording quality can be dreadful,with exterior noise etc creeping in to the recording.I do not submit my recordings as professional .This is a bit of fun amongst ourselves and we have a chance to listen to recordings of playing from all over the World.We should also be active in promoting new members to record their music (whatever it is) for us to listen to.Once it becomes a professional launch pad it will be killed off. Morgana on her new site and even the Music page (Conc.net)has areas perhaps where CD sound clips can be provided.
I think my thoughts run along similar lines to Henk who may be concerned about the possible future direction of the link page and I would like to add my backing for what has been achieved so far and with our members help what we can acheive in the future.
I think now serious thought should be given by Paul and Ken to find a proper home for this site,which I know Ken we have discussed before.
Al

Edited to say
Please note this is not in any way aimed at any player or players who may have submitted a professional recording or talked of submitting one.It is only my suggesstion of the policy regarding the future of this Tune Link Page and that is all that is intended by this posting.

Edited by Alan Day, 13 January 2006 - 06:21 PM.


#45 Morgana

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 10:03 PM

Bandwidth, cost of webspace and copyright issues aside, I agree that one of the charms of Henk's wonderful site is that the tunes are submitted by Cnet members. Rough and ready or highly polished, all submissions are accepted and appreciated. :)

A lot of players who have recorded CDs have their own webpages were sound bites can be heard. With these in addition to Henk's page, I think we are very lucky at the wealth of sound files available :)

Cheers
Morgana

#46 Henk van Aalten

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Posted 17 January 2006 - 02:38 AM

Thanks to (in order of appearance) Jeff, Tom, Stephen, Alan and Morgana for the reaction on my message about the recorded tunes link page.

I quote some essential remarks of your posts below.

I like having a page of non-commercial recordings of C.Net members. If you want to expand to other concertina recordings, I'd like it better if they were on a different page.

For myself, I see the recorded tune page as supplementing this forum. It provided examples of the playing of members of the forum, often leading to postive criticism of the playing, leading to learning and improvement.

I therefore don't think the soundtracks from existing CDs should be posted, nor commerical offerings etc. And I think the player should be a C-Netter. The value of this sort of page is that its primarily for enthusiastic amateurs or semi-professionals (?) so share their playing, to learn from each other, to be inspired by people who play better than oneself etc. ...I value it greatly as a learning resource...

...but the overarching concern should be whether the recordings are in some way useful to c.net members... When others noted a lack of many duet examples or Maccann players, I suggested to Henk that he link to John Morgan's web-posted Maccann piece "goronwy owain - ffarwel i'r marian". Not a cnet member, to my knowledge; from an existing cd not on the c.net music page, last I looked - I still think it's an appropriate inclusion...

The original idea was to promote MP3 sound clips of music supplied by members for other members to listen to.A music swap of playing styles, our favourite tunes,new tunes we may have written etc. It was certainly not an additional platform for sound clips of CDs or promotional work for say a forthcoming tour....

I agree that one of the charms of Henk's wonderful site is that the tunes are submitted by Cnet members. Rough and ready or highly polished, all submissions are accepted and appreciated. :)


From the quotes above I distill keywords like: useful/learning, C.Net members, non-commercial. Based on these keywords I come to the following criteria for inserting entries in the links page.
In order of importance:
  • it should be useful to the C.Net community (new tunes, styles, instruments, etc.)
  • the tune should preferably be played by a C.Net member
  • the tune should preferably not serve commercial purposes
The word preferably suggests that there might be exceptions. In some cases criterium 1 might overrule 2 and/or 3.

Stephen mentiones a nice example below:

When others noted a lack of many duet examples or Maccann players, I suggested to Henk that he link to John Morgan's web-posted Maccann piece "goronwy owain - ffarwel i'r marian". Not a cnet member, to my knowledge; from an existing cd not on the c.net music page, last I looked - I still think it's an appropriate inclusion...


Note that there is no sharp border between useful/not-useful and commercial/non-commercial.

#47 Kurt Braun

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Posted 18 January 2006 - 03:51 PM

The tunes page is good testimony of the need to share sound files among C.net members.

It is too bad that it can't be done inside the fora. One could imagine discussions about different ways of playing something with members attaching mp3 files as examples. Since the concertina is a musical instrument, it seems that would be more useful to be able to attach mp3 files than jpg files. Wouldn't we want to hear each other rather than see one another or one another's concertina?

Anyway, if this were possible wouldn't people be open to attaching files with questions like Is this too fast? or Which sounds better this a.mp3 or this b.mb3? and so on? Wouldn't that give the novice something back for the risk of "sharing?"

One hesitates to suggest such a thing in a free forum where eople already work hard to provide free service, but the vision seems compelling.

#48 Alan Day

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Posted 18 January 2006 - 04:22 PM

By strange coincedence Kurt, Jody Kruskal and I have been discussing the recent tune I submitted to this page being the tune for the dance Kost er C`hoat. It was this discussion about a fantastic tune recorded by GIGCB that prompted me to record this tune and send to Jody and subsequently to Henk.Jody in return sent me his version of the tune. Jodys version is completely different to mine,although similar in the B part.He has promised to send it in to Henk and I look foreward to your comments.
This tune has a worm in it that makes you want to keep playing it, so BE WARNED.
Al

#49 Jody Kruskal

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Posted 19 January 2006 - 03:27 AM

[/quote from brightfield Jan 6 2006, 04:05 AM]

For myself, I see the recorded tune page as supplementing this forum. It provided examples of the playing of members of the forum, often leading to postive criticism of the playing, leading to learning and improvement. With the few tunes I have on the page, I certainly value comments on how I may improve, and my only difficulty is that when I listen to the files a few weeks after they're posted, I think, "how did I have the gall to submit such dreadful recordings for public consumption?". But so be it, they are a snapshot of a moment in time and people can take them or leave them.
Tom



Good point Tom.

The act of recording and listening to myself is very powerful. Being a performer and being in the audience requires very different, though related skills. In recording, I have to take turns with those two roles. The process is an active agent of change for the better in my music. Before I submit a tune I have played and rejected from 3 to 15 takes. If there are too many mistakes, or if I think I can do better, I'll try again, until I think I can live with the submitted take, imperfections and all. Don't you all do that?

I think that recording and listening to ourselves, editing and selecting the take that is the best we can do at the moment, and then submitting it for peer listening and comment is bound to improve everyone's playing. The recording, listening, editing process improves the playing of all those who submit. Though perhaps that is not the main goal of the page, it's a benefit enjoyed by all submitees. Thanks again Henk for making it work.

Jody

Edited by Jody Kruskal, 19 January 2006 - 03:37 AM.


#50 Theodore Kloba

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Posted 16 February 2006 - 12:42 PM

... the Recorded Tunes Link Page was set up.

This page is now about two years old and steadily growing. Everyone may submit his tune(s) from beginner to (almost) professional. Every possible help is offered in the field of recording and hosting. However one cannot force people to submit.

If someone (like me) were to encounter this page solely from your link above (or the one in your signature), they would have no idea how to submit a song for inclusion.

FWIW, I have some tunes at: http://www.aquila.net/sworkers/rm/
They're in RealMedia format for compactness, but I can generate anything from 32-bit floating-point WAV on down.
I also played (left hand only) on a song on my wife's last album: http://www.ampcast.c...ls.php?id=13758
The song is "Illinois OAO."




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