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Nancy (Tom Clough)

Concertina solo WIP home recording

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#1 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 18 November 2017 - 07:54 PM

Instead of further hijacking Gary's thread I'd rather start a new one, presenting the very first recording with my newly acquired Wheatstone model 24 ET concertina (onto which I tried to transfer my fiddle-orientated approach):

 

Nancy (by Tom Clough)

 

First attempt / WIP, but hopefully sufficiently enjoyable already...

 

As in the past: comments of all kind welcome.

 

Best wishes - Wolf



#2 m3838

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Posted 18 November 2017 - 10:32 PM

What's the fiddle approach?



#3 gcoover

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Posted 18 November 2017 - 11:24 PM

Wow, that's absolutely lovely, Wolf! Love the harmonies and the classical music approach. I've played it for years on EC but never once thought to embellish it like this. Well done!

 

Gary



#4 mathhag

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Posted 19 November 2017 - 08:12 AM

Thank you, Wolf! Both for the music and for fixing my misplaced and hijacked thread. This really helps

#5 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 19 November 2017 - 10:34 AM

Wow, that's absolutely lovely, Wolf! Love the harmonies and the classical music approach. I've played it for years on EC but never once thought to embellish it like this. Well done!

 

Gary

 

Thank you so much Gary, very glad you like my take, and your comment is welcomely encouraging for my being on the way back to the concertina universe!

 

Best wishes - Wolf



#6 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 19 November 2017 - 10:39 AM

Thank you, Wolf! Both for the music and for fixing my misplaced and hijacked thread. This really helps

 

Your very welcome, and thank you for the hint overthere resulting in a worthwhile addition to my repertoire - and I*m happy that my contribution appears to be helpful for your own proceeding with this sweet tune as well.

 

Best wishes - Wolf



#7 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 19 November 2017 - 11:05 AM

What's the fiddle approach?

 

By "fiddle approach" (which had been mentioned and discussed before) I'm referring to a certain sweetness and/or intensity of the sound I'm aiming for. The main element are undoubtedly the open fifths as provided so comfortably by the English concertina. I take them as starting point for double stops, which may sound like passing drones, or are to be combined with certain ornamentations. They're another important element of this approach, possibly not so much according to certain folk routines but rather taken from the universal fiddle/violin/string playing, be it baroque, classical or folksy.

 

At least something like this is what I have in mind when developng my arrangements. I might add that albeit having learned to play a bunch of different musical instruments which I happened to acquire had they not just fallen into my hands, the violin/fiddle is the instrument I never tried but always wanted to. I guess it would be too hard to trudge through the awful sounds of a beginner now with lots of instruments at hand that already (or easily anyway) sound nice - but the EC has provided a certain reconciliation insofar it's in the range of a violin and is sharing some qualities with it (at least it was meant as sort of a replacement...).

 

Best wishes - Wolf



#8 Paul_Hardy

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 05:56 AM

We listened to your Nancy rendition at Chiltinas yesterday, and everyone there was impressed with what you had achieved in using more than one note at a time on the EC.

 

Do you have a score (or abc) of what you play? - several of us would be interested in trying your approach.

 

Regards,

Paul.



#9 JimLucas

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 07:38 AM

Do you have a score (or abc) of what you play? - several of us would be interested in trying your approach.


I believe there's a thread from a couple of years ago where Wolf wrote in some detail about his approach, including other sound examples.  I've no time to look for it at the moment, but maybe you can find it... or he can point us to it?



#10 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 09:21 AM

We listened to your Nancy rendition at Chiltinas yesterday, and everyone there was impressed with what you had achieved in using more than one note at a time on the EC.

 

Do you have a score (or abc) of what you play? - several of us would be interested in trying your approach.

 

Regards,

Paul.

 

Thanks a lot Paul, I'm very happy about my version being listened to at your meeting (apparently of a highly desirable kind which I would very much appreciate within my reach as well), and of course I'll love to further share musical ideas!

 

As to what I'm playing here, unfortunately I have nothing written down this time. Re the melody, after listening to the very charming banjo video I started with one of the ABCs provided by "thesession.org", then had a look at the one posted by Peter here and not least listened to the playing of Nancy Kerr as available on YT. No bigger differences emerged appart from the D-section, where I combined different versions to my liking. The full arrangement came more or less spontaneously then...

 

I will gladly come back to the subject and provide more detailed remarks on the particular arrangement and my approach in general (as to what Jim's been saying, I'm not sure about that; there has been a lot of discussion regarding certain TOTMs (for instance here) and on various other occasions, but a quick search didn't reveal anything approximate to an overall concept - I guess the closest to that was my "course" at the SSI some years ago).

 

If required I might gladly compile ABC notation for a lead sheet shortly.

 

Best wishes - Wolf



#11 Paul_Hardy

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 12:06 PM

... I will gladly come back to the subject and provide more detailed remarks on the particular arrangement and my approach in general ...
... If required I might gladly compile ABC notation for a lead sheet shortly.


I know the melody of the tune quite well - apart from anything else, Alex Wade used it in an EC workshop at Kilve last year. It's a lovely tune - and although it has lots of notes, they are generally 'well-behaved' and fall under the fingers nicely.
 
However up until recently, I've always been a 'one note at a time' player (apart from an odd terminating chord), but would like to move towards adding simple parallel embellishments to some of my playing.

It would be great if you could produce an ABC score for what you actually play for Nancy. Any description as to why you chose those particular extra notes to add to the melody would be helpful also.

Don't feel under pressure though.
 
Regards,

#12 Don Taylor

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 08:45 PM

Wolf

I really enjoyed this first outing for your new model 24 ET, very nice tone.

Nancy, the tune, is new to me too although it is vaguely familiar. Reading about Tom Clough, this is about his wife, Nancy, and I think that you have communicated his happiness in your version. That was the immediate emotion that I felt when I heard your tune. Although you may not have consciously intended it, your version did give me the impression of hearing the pipes being played, albeit without a drone.

As others have already noted, your arrangement for EC is quite remarkable. I would love to read how you approached the arrangement. Paul has asked for the dots, and that would be good to have, but I would like to understand how you got from a lead sheet to your arrangement. If asked I would have guessed that you were playing a duet and not an EC.

I would like to hear it a little bit faster, I think, and if you want to keep it as long as it is then maybe you could try modulating part of it into another key - very non-traditional I know, but it might keep up the interest and emotion into the last couple of minutes.

#13 Bill Worsfold

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 10:47 PM

I, too, would love to read about other peoples arranging thought processes, so no rush, Wolf, but have you done it yet? :)

 

On the same subject, if you look at Prof Rat's YT video of 'Rat in the Bed', in the comments section he explains bit about his arranging process - I think it involves playing the bass note of the appropriate chord on 1st and 3rd beats.

Check it out here:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=b1VW2HEZzbs

 

My absolute favourite, though, for sheer insanely wonderful accompaniment lines is Rob Harbron's 'Young Collins'. I'd love to know what was going through his mind there:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=3h0nP63_M3E

 

Cheers,

Bill



#14 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 04:20 AM

Here is a pipe version by Chris Ormston that includes a picture of Tom Clough with Nancy, his wife. The tune Nancy begins at about 1:39 in. Very interesting video and musical history of the Clough family.

https://youtu.be/5j2Z161Rzg4


Wolf

I really enjoyed this first outing for your new model 24 ET, very nice tone.

Nancy, the tune, is new to me too although it is vaguely familiar. Reading about Tom Clough, this is about his wife, Nancy, and I think that you have communicated his happiness in your version. That was the immediate emotion that I felt when I heard your tune. Although you may not have consciously intended it, your version did give me the impression of hearing the pipes being played, albeit without a drone.

As others have already noted, your arrangement for EC is quite remarkable. I would love to read how you approached the arrangement. Paul has asked for the dots, and that would be good to have, but I would like to understand how you got from a lead sheet to your arrangement. If asked I would have guessed that you were playing a duet and not an EC.

I would like to hear it a little bit faster, I think, and if you want to keep it as long as it is then maybe you could try modulating part of it into another key - very non-traditional I know, but it might keep up the interest and emotion into the last couple of minutes.

 
Don, thanks a lot for your listening and in-depth remarks. I'm very happy with the impression you're describing. You're right insofar I rather intended a fiddle-like sound, at least in sections A and B (and partly D). It's amazing to actually hear this (piper's) tune played by a piper (as in the video you provided). The faster tempo is quite appealing to me as well, although I'm not sure it would work with passing harmony instead of the drone (which I also tried, but not to my entire liking as yet).
 
The other issue, or topic, you're raising - and I reckon rightly so - is variation. I often seem to be sort of enchanted by a certain tune so that I could go through it again and again, always anticipating the next sweet moment - but this might not naturally spread out to an audience to the same degree. As I seem to be reluctant of taking the tune to another key I'm musing about either different manners of playing/embellishing, or true variations in the "classical" sense.
 
Wherever this will lead me to (maybe even inserting a drone in between), you gave me some vital things to work on.
 
As to the arrangement (which is however fairly basic, and has not been worked out on screen or paper this time, making it thus more a case of application of my general approach I guess) I will come back to that later.
 
Best wishes - Wolf


Edited by blue eyed sailor, 21 November 2017 - 05:41 AM.


#15 gcoover

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 05:11 PM

I, too, would love to read about other peoples arranging thought processes, so no rush, Wolf, but have you done it yet? :)

 

On the same subject, if you look at Prof Rat's YT video of 'Rat in the Bed', in the comments section he explains bit about his arranging process - I think it involves playing the bass note of the appropriate chord on 1st and 3rd beats.

Check it out here:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=b1VW2HEZzbs

 

My absolute favourite, though, for sheer insanely wonderful accompaniment lines is Rob Harbron's 'Young Collins'. I'd love to know what was going through his mind there:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=3h0nP63_M3E

 

Cheers,

Bill

 

Bill,

You're right, an absolutely amazing arrangement of Young Collings and Getting Upstairs! A lot of the chords sound influenced by modern melodeon playing. Here are a few clues to Rob's playing from the man himself: https://youtu.be/R1cuieGmcy8. 

 

And he doesn't always use the pinky rests, so that can allow for some pretty full chords.

 

Gary


Edited by gcoover, 21 November 2017 - 08:15 PM.


#16 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 06:11 PM

X: 1
T: Nancy
C: Tom Clough
R: reel
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
K: Dmaj
Z: arr. Wolf Molkentin (www.concertina.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=19954&p=186369)

(3ABc|:"D"d2D2F2A2|"D"d2fe d2A2|"D"d2ef "e/G"gfed|
"A"c2ec A2Bc|"D"d2D2F2A2|"D"d2fe d2A2|
"G"B2g2"A"fe d/2c3/2| [1"D"d6 (3ABc:|[2"D"d6(fg)||
|:"D"a3b a2f2|"A/E"g2a2 "A"g2e2|"D"f2d2"G"gfed|
"A"c2e2A2Bc|"D"d2D2F2A2|"D"d2fe d2A2|
"G"B2g2"A"fedc|[1"D"d6(fg):|[2"D"d6 (3ABc||
|:"D"dcBA "G"GFED|"(D)/A"F2A2d2A2|"b"dcdf "G"gfed|
"A"cdec A2Bc|"b"dcBA "G"GFED|"(D)/A"F2A2d2A2|
"G"B2g2"A"fe d/2c3/2|[1"D"d6 (3ABc:|[2"D"d6(fg)||
|:"D"aAaA a2gf|"A"gAgA g2fe|"D"fdfa "G"gfed|
"A"cdec AB"/C#"cA|"b"dcBA "G"GFED|"(D)/A"F2A2d2A2|
"G - e/G"B2g2"A"fedc|[1"D"d6(fg):|[2"D"d6|]
 
I hope this represents more or less what I've been playing here (as mentioned in advance, it's sort of a reconstruction of a pretty much spontaneous arrangement). No complex chords (as yet; I might apply some - or at least suspensions, which already seem to be in the air - for variation later).
 
Instead of a chord I mainly play open fifths (that's the EC thing, isn't it?), at times even reducing that to just the respectice root note (or different note within the harmony) in order not to produce a "too-thick" sound (something I seem to have learned over the years).
 
I have always inserted a chord symbol where I would apply or repeat a chord (fifth, single note); of course the harmony has often to be played in a "staccato" or "portato" style (not at the full length) then, but that varies. At times I'm adding a second note just some beats later (f.i. in the D section) to rhythmically emphasize a point.

Hope that helps (and the ABC is more or less correct, as I'm rather tired now), I will gladly go more into some details (or as to why I chose a certain harmony, but I guess there's not much to be explained this time) later if required.
 
Best wishes, and thanks all for the interest - Wolf
 
edited to add: I'm myself not using the "pinky rests" either - it's not just a matter of more complex chords for me but having acccess to some fifths and even root notes combined with freely playing the melody line - here with "Nancy" it's both the A and the b fifths. I might add that, as some will be aware of anyway, I'm holding my concertina sort of rotated by 60 degrees so that the rows are not leading "away" from the body but rather "upwards" (with the thumbs completely plugged into the "straps").

(ABC adjusted without changes in the music - please replace)


Edited by Wolf Molkentin, 22 November 2017 - 04:16 AM.


#17 hielandman

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 12:45 AM

Very nice Wolf!  Keep up the good work!

 

Don



#18 Wolf Molkentin

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 03:27 AM

Very nice Wolf!  Keep up the good work!

 

Don

 

Thanks a lot Don - much appreciated!

 

Best wishes - Wolf


Edited by blue eyed sailor, 22 November 2017 - 03:27 AM.





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