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Aeola Tenor-Treble At Auction

Aeola Tenor-Treble Wheatstone Concertina

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#1 Chris Drinkwater

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Posted 24 August 2015 - 07:54 AM

Scottish auctioneers,Thomson Roddick Auctions are selling a Wheastone Aeola 56 key metal-ended tenor-treble serial number 29004, a model 19, dated September 30th 1921, in the Wheatstone Ledgers, on September 3rd. They describe it as 'Victorian' and their estimate is ridiculously low, given that Chris Algar currently has a similar one dating from 1924, for sale at £4,399! See below for details copied from the auction web page:

 

Lot 284 - Victorian Wheatstone 56 button concertina serial no 29004,
By Thomson Roddick Scottish Auctions Add to favourites
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Description:
Victorian Wheatstone 56 button concertina serial no 29004, with foliate pierced silver plated grills and buttons, in a velvet lined tan leather case, 19cm dia.
 
Estimate: 700 GBP - 900 GBP
 
 
Chris

Edited by Chris Drinkwater, 24 August 2015 - 08:17 AM.


#2 Myrtle's cook

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Posted 24 August 2015 - 09:58 AM

Yes - quite a bargain at the estimate!
Does look like it has had quite a tough/hard working life so likely to require some work.
None the less, tempting....

#3 Ptarmigan

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Posted 25 August 2015 - 12:13 PM

 

Scottish auctioneers,Thomson Roddick Auctions are selling a Wheastone Aeola 56 key metal-ended tenor-treble serial number 29004, a model 19, dated September 30th 1921, in the Wheatstone Ledgers, on September 3rd. They describe it as 'Victorian' and their estimate is ridiculously low, given that Chris Algar currently has a similar one dating from 1924, for sale at £4,399! See below for details copied from the auction web page:

 

Lot 284 - Victorian Wheatstone 56 button concertina serial no 29004,
By Thomson Roddick Scottish Auctions Add to favourites
540x360.jpg
  • 80x80.jpg
  • 80x80.jpg
Description:
Victorian Wheatstone 56 button concertina serial no 29004, with foliate pierced silver plated grills and buttons, in a velvet lined tan leather case, 19cm dia.
 
Estimate: 700 GBP - 900 GBP
 
 
Chris

 

 

700 - 900 GBP ... clearly a 'come & by me' price Chris, to attract the buyers.  ;) 



#4 Chris Drinkwater

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Posted 25 August 2015 - 05:59 PM

"700 - 900 GBP ... clearly a 'come & by me' price Chris, to attract the buyers." Couldn't agree more, Dick!

 

Chris



#5 Bruce Thomson

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Posted 15 November 2015 - 06:12 PM

PLEASE, PLEASE folks, we've GOT GOT GOT to get the price of good concertinas down.

 

That appalling 'admired' price excludes even excellent players, let alone the public.

I'm deeply frustrated not to be able to own an instrument like that.

My existing old Stagi tenor-treble is worn out from daily playing and play-outs in public.

 

Let's keep thinking of ways of creating beautiful-sounding, nice looking concertinas that almost anyone can afford - under $1000.

 

'Probably by 3D-printing all or some of the parts for exact precision.

 

To me, the value of a concertina is not it's 'heritage' or 'tradition', or 'its awesomely painstaking precision and construction',or even its appearance.

It's the emotional human communion it enables, either just me to myself, or with others, from the human-emotion sounds it makes.

And I'd like thousands of people, especially young people, to have that, not just the few that do now.

Around campfires, with family voices together, accompanied by guitars, in backpacks at Youth Hostels, in the quiet times late at night after a party among friends.


Edited by Bruce Thomson, 15 November 2015 - 06:16 PM.


#6 ceemonster

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Posted 15 November 2015 - 07:42 PM

RE Chris Algar and a 1924 priced at 4399UK . . . Is this on the grapevine from someone who examined or inquired recently?

 

 

[[[Let's keep thinking of ways of creating beautiful-sounding, nice looking concertinas that almost anyone can afford - under $1000.]]]

 

Concertina-reeded?  A fast, responsive, rich-sounding, dynamically expressive Tenor-Treble concertina under $1000 is probably not possible, though it would be great if it were.  However, I continue to believe and insist, that this can be achieved at a fraction of current prices for vintage and newly-made ones.  I don't have the engineering skills.  But . . . it is a matter of having those skills, along with the knack for upside-down, out-of-the-box tinker-magpie thinking required to come at the thing innovatively.  Actually, if you don't mind accordion reeds, you can have a wonderful concertina for half the price of vintage/newly-made concertina-reeded instruments . . . I do note that accordion-reeded are not as loud, which is another engineering problem that is totally solvable by creative thinking, IMHO . . .

 

Accordion-reeded?  I also play accordion.  And newly-made, high-quality European-crafted accordions with wood, leather, and high-grade metal insides rather than flimsy tin and plastic tubing, are very, very expensive. Very expensive indeed.  But the chops of the Asian builders have progressed to the point where there are a few Asian-made examples that, sure, are cheaply made, but very responsive, fast, good-sounding, and serviceable.   I keep wondering when this is going to occur with the Asian concertinas, which remain horrifying, particularly so given that the prices have gone up, with no increase in quality.  However, one day . . . We might see a fast, responsive, big-voiced Asian accordion-reeded concertina pop up, with riveted button action that actually works and doesn't fall to pieces, for $700-$1,000, and wouldn't that be great. . . .  The potential is there. It CAN be done. 


Edited by ceemonster, 15 November 2015 - 07:53 PM.


#7 Geoff Wooff

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 03:37 AM

PLEASE, PLEASE folks, we've GOT GOT GOT to get the price of good concertinas down.



The ecconomics of the current concertina market prevent the production of a cheap but fine quality instrument over and above the work being done by Concertina Connection and The Button Box etc. However, the recent history of the Concertina is such that, other than the highly charged market for Anglos caused by the recent revival in Irish music, there are probably sufficient vintage instruments to fullfill the needs of those who wish to play fine instruments , for FREE!!!!

Bruce, buy yourself a Wheatstone Tennor Treble Aeola... they hold their value so you would only be investing and , if my experience over the last 45 years is anything to go by, you may well turn a profit when it comes time to sell. I have never lost money on a concertina, ok if you buy at the top market price from a dealer you may need to hope for some inflation over time to show a profit but from an economic standpoint you get to play the best possible instrument for nothing, or very very little expense over and above your investment dollar.
Geoff.


Edited by Geoff Wooff, 16 November 2015 - 03:39 AM.


#8 Theo

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 05:58 AM

PLEASE, PLEASE folks, we've GOT GOT GOT to get the price of good concertinas down.

:wacko:

I can't think of any other type of musical instrument where the price of the very best instrument that money can buy is as little as £5000! 



#9 ceemonster

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Posted 16 November 2015 - 11:02 PM

[[[I can't think of any other type of musical instrument where the price of the very best instrument that money can buy is as little as 5000 [UK sterling] ]]]

 

To a US buyer, that is like eight grand.  Nobody wants or needs "the best instrument that money can buy."    What's wanted and needed are excellent, super, wonderfully playable instruments. And there are many, many musical instruments where excellent, super, wonderful examples are available at a fraction of that price.  A fraction.    Guitar, both acoustic and electric, is a dramatic example given that it is fully chromatic and can play any genre of music in any  key.  And you can get a superb acoustic guitar for under $3k, and a totally playable, responsive, fast, comfortable one with a solid wood top, for $200-300.  Then there is fiddle, another fully chromatic, play-in-any-key, play-anything on it, super-portable instrument.  Who wants or needs a Stradivarius?  Just a damn good, rich-sounding, responsive fiddle/violin---and they are to be had, again, for a fraction of the price of that Wheatstone. Mandolins, another example. Yes, the "best mandolin money can buy" could be ten grand, but you can spent two grand and have a totally wonderful, lifetime, pro-grade keeper.  Same with banjos.

 

Accordions--heavier, but astonishing what you can do on them.  In addition to the increasing numbers of very playable new Asian instruments as discussed above, we also have newly-made, perfectly playable German Weltmeisters which are quite affordable, as well as gobs and gobs of superb used accordions--the unisonoric market, at least. PAs in the U.S. and CBAs in France.  That won't last forever, but as of right now,  fabulous accordions with multiple reed voicings, sound chambers, and gosh-knows-what else, are to be had for pennies to the pound of what these vintage concertinas are now costing.   

 

I don't know if it's Geoff or who, but whoever it is that has pointed out it is the market, I think has the nut of it.  If enough people were making them, which requires a big market, the prices would come down.  This is the reason the Chinese have not yet crossed the bar in making playable, fast, durable concertinas.  The market is not big enough for an entrepreneur to go over there and supervise it.  That is what how well-made Asian banjos and guitars began to happen.  Entrepreneurs who were also obsessively in love with these instruments seeded and supervised production operations over there that began to turn out good stuff.  There are lots of crummy Asian guitars and banjos, but there are really great ones now.  The same could be the case for concertinas, but the market is not big enough for it to be worth anyone's while to do it right.


Edited by ceemonster, 16 November 2015 - 11:09 PM.


#10 conzertino

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 09:42 AM

I just wanted to remind the concertina-community across the sea that the button-box currently has two of the finest Wheatstone tenor-treble Aeolas that money can buy for sale! At - from my point of view - reasonable prices!

 

I have played them both before.



#11 ceemonster

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 09:55 AM

the last I checked, the Amboyna TT at BB was sold or on hold.  the metal-ended may be great in real life,  but its sound clip to this listener was not favorably impressive.


Edited by ceemonster, 17 November 2015 - 09:56 AM.


#12 conzertino

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 10:53 AM

In fact, I have known the ME TT for over 35 years and I personally would prefer it to the Amboyna one. The action is amazing!

 

Besides the fact that I like my concertinas as small as possible, I would think that I would have to play her against a few similar boxes to really judge the sound.



#13 JimLucas

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 12:57 PM

I can't think of any other type of musical instrument where the price of the very best instrument that money can buy is as little as £5000!


To a US buyer, that is like eight grand. Nobody wants or needs "the best instrument that money can buy." What's wanted and needed are excellent, super, wonderfully playable instruments. And there are many, many musical instruments where excellent, super, wonderful examples are available at a fraction of that price. A fraction.

 
And the number of individual parts -- handcrafted or otherwise -- is also a very small fraction of that in a concertina.  In terms ofthe number of parts, I think a better comparison than the guitar or violin might be a piano. What's the price of a newly made acoustic piano, even one with only a 5-octave range?  I don't have time for in-depth research, but the first English-language link Google gave me was this one, which says, "...I checked out a number of pianos priced under $10,000, with an emphasis at the $5,000 price point or even less."  The title of the review is "Affordable Acoustic Pianos" (my emphasis).
 
In any case, this discussion has been "done to death" more than once before, so I think that rather than add more to this digression I should find one of those earlier threads and continue the discussion there.  (Not sure how soon I'll get around to it, but when I do, I'll try to remember to edit this post to include the link.)



#14 ceemonster

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Posted 18 November 2015 - 12:49 AM

If you feel the discussion has been "done to death," you certainly have the option to pass on further participation.  An earlier poster raised this point, no one is forcing you to weigh in. 

 

As for pianos, they are in a type-class by themselves as musical instruments and have no comparison basis with compact, portable instruments you can throw in a pack or sling over your back and carry along during your Two Years Before the Mast. Perhaps a full-sized harp might be comparable, but even a full-size harp is more transportable than a piano.  Like concertina, guitars, mandolins, fiddles, and hrmoniums, however, do fit that profile, AND you can play them in a classical recital hall if that's what strikes your fancy. 



#15 conzertino

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Posted 19 November 2015 - 04:11 AM

Here is another nice TT Aeola at auction in Scotland. May be a bargain this time!? Lot 253!

 

http://www.greatwest...15/page003.html



#16 Geoff Wooff

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Posted 19 November 2015 - 04:23 AM

Here is another nice TT Aeola at auction in Scotland. May be a bargain this time!? Lot 253!
 
http://www.greatwest...15/page003.html



They certainly do the pictures very well at Great Western Auctions !!

Thanks for the tip Robert.

#17 Rikki

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Posted 20 November 2015 - 04:21 PM

Great Western Auctions is local to me and I tend to pop along at least to try the concertinas that go on sale.  I'll probably pop along next weekend if I get the chance.  There are usually plenty of bidders at the auction and one or two phone bidders, and this one will also be online, so I would expect it to go for £2k plus regardless of the condition.  Still, if you aint in it you can't win it.



#18 Mike Pierceall

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Posted 27 November 2015 - 01:31 PM

Here is another nice TT Aeola at auction in Scotland. May be a bargain this time!? Lot 253!

 

http://www.greatwest...15/page003.html

£1500 would seem like a bargain between friends, but not so much after premiums, taxes, surcharges, shipping, and restoration.  Mike







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