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Lachenal Value Today?


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#1 Aquarussell

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 07:27 PM

Hello.

How much would a Lachenal English, in tune and in good condition, go for these days? I have seen one. . .

Wait for it. . .

On eBay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/...E:X:RTQ:US:1123

I liked the "Little Old Lady from Pasadena" part of the description!

It looks good, comes from a dealer with 100% positive feedback, who deals in accordions. He might not know much about concertinas, but he should very well know what he is talking about when he claims that it is in tune.

Would it be smarter to get one that I know needs work, and have it gone through by the Button Box? What do those of you with Concertina Aquisition Syndrome think?

I play for Morris Dancing, so brass reeds seem to be right out, as volume is a must.

Thanks,
Aquarussell
Russell Hedges

#2 Theo

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Posted 14 February 2012 - 08:06 PM

I expect this one will need work if it has been keep unused for years. Pads and valves may be the originals, if so they will be well past their best. I would take the claim to be in tune with a pinch of salt too.

#3 spindizzy

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 09:10 AM

Hello.

How much would a Lachenal English, in tune and in good condition, go for these days? I have seen one. . .

Wait for it. . .

On eBay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/...E:X:RTQ:US:1123

I liked the "Little Old Lady from Pasadena" part of the description!

It looks good, comes from a dealer with 100% positive feedback, who deals in accordions. He might not know much about concertinas, but he should very well know what he is talking about when he claims that it is in tune.

Would it be smarter to get one that I know needs work, and have it gone through by the Button Box? What do those of you with Concertina Aquisition Syndrome think?

I play for Morris Dancing, so brass reeds seem to be right out, as volume is a must.

Thanks,
Aquarussell
Russell Hedges


It looks "new" enough to have steel reeds rather than brass, but probably "old" enough not to be at concert pitch, unless it's been retuned at some time. So it may be in tune with itself, but not with
other instruments. In UK terms, I would guess that the price is towards the high end of OK for a refurbished English metal button lachenal.

Chris
ps If it isn't in concert pitch, you could try getting the price down.

#4 Greg Jowaisas

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 10:03 AM

[attachment=7279:P1020536-2.JPG][attachment=7280:P1020535-2.JPG][attachment=7278:P1020539-2.JPG][attachment=7277:P1020538-2.JPG]

Steel reeds, standard pitch, in tune, all necessaries renewed. Playing well. Reconditioned by a repair expert that plays english. $1100 + shipping. Donation to cnet. if sold.

PM me if you are interested.

Greg

#5 Aquarussell

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 10:59 AM

Hello,

Thanks to all who posted replys to my question, I appreciate your advice.

I have corresponded with the seller, and unfortunately it is a mostely brass reeded instrument. I play for morris dancing, and so I am looking for a steel reeded concertina. I will tell him so.

His tuning information is probably correct. He deals in accordions (and how, wanna buy a case? He has a few used ones) and has checked the concertina. This one's not for me, but it looks to be a nice one for somebody who only plays quietly in the parlor.

Thanks again,
Aquarussell
Russell Hedges

#6 shelly0312

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 01:56 PM

...might be worthwhile to still talk to Greg...???

#7 malcolmbebb

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 02:28 PM

Forgive me for saying so, but I wouldn't have thought of a concertina, particularly perhaps, English, as No 1 choice of instrument for Morris... (I do know people who do.... but if you have an open choice...)

I get the impression that you already play something else????

#8 Aquarussell

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Posted 15 February 2012 - 05:34 PM

Hello,

I have been playing my Jackie English concertina for about six years now. It still works, though I ruined the bellows (DON'T put it in a generic concertina soft case, they are too small and it will wear the bellows at the corners). Still plays, still in tune, just leaks a bit.

And yes, I know that Morris generally calls for an Anglo, but I had a very bad experiance with a cheap East German Anglo with wooden levers, then the Jackie came out, and so I am an English player. Ah, fate.

I have PM'd Greg, and talked to my spending adviser, who knows I don't need a new concertina yet. I am trying to argue the point.

Thanks,
Russell Hedges
Aquarussell

#9 Ivan Viehoff

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 06:12 AM

Forgive me for saying so, but I wouldn't have thought of a concertina, particularly perhaps, English, as No 1 choice of instrument for Morris... (I do know people who do.... but if you have an open choice...)

Morris groups most often use melodeons of the free reed instruments. But on the other hand I would say that Morris dance displays are precisely where I most often seen English concertinas being played. These things do vary regionally, and there may be some bias due to the fact that my local Morris group particularly emphasises English concertinas, having several players.

#10 Aquarussell

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 03:02 PM

When I first started looking for a concertina, I had a vision of myself carrying an Anglo, and playing for folk dancing and 19th century ballroom dancing. I bought an unusable and cheap German made Anglo that never played, and my attempts to fix it came to naught. About that time I was finding this place (CONCERTINA.net), and the Jackie was just coming out. Since there was nothing like it in an anglo, I bought it, and started teaching myself to play.

The Jackie was and is a low cost entry into concertina playing. Low cost but with a guarentee. Until recently, there was no equivalent for anglo.

One day, between tap dance classes, I was ouside the room sitting on the grass practicing. The shadows of two people came up behind me and just stood there for a minute. Then a woman's voice said "Are you from around here?". What kind of question was that? I turned around and saw two Morris Dancers. They explained about when and where they practiced and asked me to join them. A few weeks later I did.

Would a melodeon have been a better choice? Perhaps. But in my mind, it's too late now. When I bought my Jackie, I had no thought for Morris at all. When I came to Morris, I came with my English concertina in hand. And I still practice to play for vintage ballroom dancing. Waltzes in particular.

While I am arguing about buying a new concertina, it seems that I will have to save for a while yet, before I can get one. I am sorry for that, but it's a matter of domestic tranquility.

But a 48 button Lachenal, recently serviced? Well, I hope to find one when I have the full purchase price in hand.

Thank you all,
Russell Hedges
Aquarussell

#11 JimLucas

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 04:06 AM

Forgive me for saying so, but I wouldn't have thought of a concertina, particularly perhaps, English, as No 1 choice of instrument for Morris... (I do know people who do.... but if you have an open choice...)

Morris groups most often use melodeons of the free reed instruments. But on the other hand I would say that Morris dance displays are precisely where I most often seen English concertinas being played. These things do vary regionally, and there may be some bias due to the fact that my local Morris group particularly emphasises English concertinas, having several players.

Just like concertinas, Morris dancers and musicians are not all the same, not in their personalities and not in their preferences.

When I first encountered/learned Morris (about 1970), the local (NYC) philosophy -- supposedly derived from English tradition -- was that there should never be more than one musician playing at a time... and fiddle was generally preferred, with pipe and tabor being rare and special, but not considered inferior. I'm talking Cotswold Morris here, not clog or border, which are as different musically as they are in dance form.

I was first recruited (in 1972) as a musician, with my English, and only later became a dancing member of the team. At that time, I didn't know any anglo players, nor did I know of anglo being used for Morris. (Didn't know of it being used in Irish music, either. I had a lot to learn!) Dancing with other teams, especially at the Marlboro Ale, I found that other instruments were also being used for Morris... piano accordion, melodeons, but also recorder, soprano sax, and oh yes, anglo concertina. Well, one team had an anglo player, though he wasn't their only musician, and I was told that there was another team that had one. At least in the US, concertinas of any sort for Morris were rare then, and in my experience Englishes outnumbered anglos for at least a decade.

It may have been different in England, though I think it's more likely that the balance didn't vary so much from country to country as from team to team (village to village?). But then William Kimber was discovered by "the masses", and thanks to the existence of a single concertina player in pre-revival Morris, the anglo was touted as the "only" appropriate concertina for Morris. That reminds me of a joke my father used to tell: "All Indians walk single file. At least the only one I ever saw did." (I hope everyone can see the logical flaw which makes that a joke.) Even so, I think that a significant factor in the growing popularity of the anglo in American Morris was the fact that anglos were significantly cheaper than Englishes.

My, how times have changed!

But in the end, I believe that for the best Morris music, what matters most is the playing, not the type(s) of instrument(s).

#12 malcolmbebb

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 04:31 AM

In case clarification is needed, the OP did initially state that he wanted volume - and that usually points towards melodeons :D

Obviously, since he's been playing English for a while then it becomes obvious that he'd want to stay with it. No reason why one shouldn't be used, I know a couple of people who do play English for Morris. (But, thinking about it, rather more who play Anglo)

(Also banjo, ukelele, guitar, clarinet, harmonica and tuba. But not all in the same band. Fortunately.)

#13 Theo

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 05:30 AM

In case clarification is needed, the OP did initially state that he wanted volume - and that usually points towards melodeons :D


Not really, true some melodeons are loud, but some are not. The same can be said about English concertinas, choose the right one and it can be more audible than a melodeon in a noisy environment such as an outdoor Morris.

The player does not always realise how loud a concertina can be because of the way the sound is directed away from the ends of the instrument. One model that almost always has a loud bright sound is a metal ended Lachenal New Model the hexagonal raised ended model. Metal ended Edeophones are often loud too, but are considerably more expensive.

#14 John Wild

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Posted 17 February 2012 - 07:03 AM

I play for a North West clog dancing side. The philosophy here seems to be the more the merrier. We currently have 2 accordions, 2 melodeons and 2 English concertinas plus bass drum and snare drum. The concertina I use is a metal ended Wheatstone, which has a volume suitable to carry outdoors. Also, the sound of the treble range seems to stand out over the bass sounds from the other instruments.

regards

John Wild




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